Re: [Last-Call] [Gen-art] Genart last call review of draft-ietf-oauth-rar-15

[Brian Campbell <[e-mail]>]

On Wed, Nov 30, 2022 at 5:04 PM Robert Sparks <[e-mail]> wrote:

>
> On 11/30/22 5:53 PM, Brian Campbell wrote:
>
>
>
> On Wed, Nov 30, 2022 at 4:08 PM Robert Sparks <[e-mail]>
> wrote:
>
>>
>> On 11/30/22 2:39 PM, Brian Campbell wrote:
>>
>> <snip>
>>
>> On Thu, Nov 17, 2022 at 3:45 PM Robert Sparks <[e-mail]>
>> wrote:
>> <snip>
>>
>>> I have two major issues that I think need discussion:
>>>
>>> Major Issue 1) The document seems to be specifying a new way of
>>> comparing json names, claiming it is what RFC8259 requires, but I
>>> disagree that RFC8259 says what this document is claiming. If I'm
>>> correct, the document is trying to rely on the text in section 7 of
>>> RFC8259 to support the idea that implementation MUST NOT alter the json
>>> names (such as applying Unicode normalization) before comparison and
>>> that the comparison MUST be performed octet-by-octet. Rather, section 7
>>> says something more like "you better escape and unescape stuff correctly
>>> if you’re going to do unicode codepoint by codepoint comparison" which
>>> is a completely different statement.
>>>
>>> If I'm right, and this is a new comparison rule that goes beyond what
>>> JSON itself defines, I think the group should seek extra guidance from
>>> Unicode experts. If I'm wrong and this behavior is defined somewhere
>>> else, please provide a better pointer to the definition.
>>>
>>> In many environments, its unusual for an implementation relying on a
>>> stack below it to have any say at all on whether normalization is going
>>> to be applied to the unicode before the application gets to look. Rather
>>> than trying to work around the problem you've identified with
>>> normalization by specifying the comparison algorithm, consider just
>>> making stronger statements about the strings used in the json names the
>>> document defines. Why _can't_ you restrict the authorization_details
>>> values to ascii? If it's because you want to present the string to a
>>> user, consider putting a presentation string elsewhere in the json that
>>> is not used for comparison.
>>>
>>
>> To the best of my understanding, it's not trying to specify a new or
>> different way of comparing JSON names or values. I think it's only trying
>> to say that the application must not do any *additional* normalization of
>> the string values that it gets from the JSON stack or any other extra
>> processing for the sake of comparison. I think anyway.
>>
>> Honestly, I didn't really (and still don't) understand the concerns that
>> some of the WG had that led to the text in question. So I didn't pay close
>> attention to it while thinking to myself there can't be harm in saying to
>> do a byte-by-byte comparison with no additional processing. But here we
>> are...
>>
>> Does that halfhearted explanation alleviate your concerns at all? Or,
>> with that explanation in mind, are there specific changes to the text (in sec
>> 12
>> <https://www.ietf.org/archive/id/draft-ietf-oauth-rar-15.html#section-12>
>> and sec 2
>> <https://www.ietf.org/archive/id/draft-ietf-oauth-rar-15.html#section-2>,
>> I think) that would alleviate your concerns? Or do we need to consider just
>> deleting those parts?
>>
>> I did track down this issue about it
>> https://github.com/oauthstuff/draft-oauth-rar/issues/28 for maybe added
>> context.
>>
>> Thanks for that pointer. If that's the extent, then I really think the
>> group should walk this back just a little and answer why restricting these
>> names to (a subset of) ascii is an unacceptable thing to do. The
>> conversation there reinforces my guess that these aren't meant for display
>> to users, so why take on the additional complexity? Make it easy for
>> implementors to get it right with much less effort.
>>
>
> Yes, that guess is correct that type value is not meant for display to
> users (the issue is about type value). I can't confidently say the same
> about names and values that any particular type will define. I don't think
> it matters though. It's not that restricting is unacceptable but that it's
> not necessary. Just using the values that come from the JSON layer is
> enough. And I'd contend there's not really additional complexity. It just
> appears like additional complexity because of the unnecessary and maybe
> less than idea wording in the draft. Wording that I'd be more than happy to
> try and fix up or just remove.
>
> If you can change it to "compare these the same way you would compare
> anything else out of json" and the group is fine with it, then great.
>

Okay, I've changed it attempting to say that with
https://github.com/oauthstuff/draft-oauth-rar/pull/94/commits/98e1b73ff3cad699191606eaf9278e6653fe7493

The WG is on this thread so I expect/hope that anyone that isn't fine with
it will chime in.


<snip>

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