Re: [Qirg] arch I-D: pull request & comments
Wojciech Kozlowski <W.Kozlowski@tudelft.nl> Sun, 12 July 2020 21:33 UTC
Return-Path: <W.Kozlowski@tudelft.nl>
X-Original-To: qirg@ietfa.amsl.com
Delivered-To: qirg@ietfa.amsl.com
Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id B75963A0893 for <qirg@ietfa.amsl.com>; Sun, 12 Jul 2020 14:33:49 -0700 (PDT)
X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com
X-Spam-Flag: NO
X-Spam-Score: -1.897
X-Spam-Level:
X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.897 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_H3=0.001, RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_WL=0.001, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no
Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id Oget5V0hGeF9 for <qirg@ietfa.amsl.com>; Sun, 12 Jul 2020 14:33:47 -0700 (PDT)
Received: from mailservice.tudelft.nl (mailservice.tudelft.nl [130.161.131.5]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id E97A13A088A for <qirg@irtf.org>; Sun, 12 Jul 2020 14:33:46 -0700 (PDT)
Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by amavis (Postfix) with ESMTP id A9A442400CA for <qirg@irtf.org>; Sun, 12 Jul 2020 23:33:45 +0200 (CEST)
X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at tudelft.nl
Received: from mailservice.tudelft.nl ([130.161.131.71]) by localhost (tudelft.nl [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10026) with ESMTP id yFACbMJrULA6 for <qirg@irtf.org>; Sun, 12 Jul 2020 23:33:43 +0200 (CEST)
Received: from SRV220.tudelft.net (mailboxcluster.tudelft.net [131.180.6.20]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher AES256-SHA256 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by mx4.tudelft.nl (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 088622400BB for <qirg@irtf.org>; Sun, 12 Jul 2020 23:33:42 +0200 (CEST)
Received: from SRV220.tudelft.net (131.180.6.20) by SRV220.tudelft.net (131.180.6.20) with Microsoft SMTP Server (version=TLS1_2, cipher=TLS_ECDHE_RSA_WITH_AES_256_CBC_SHA384_P521) id 15.1.1913.5; Sun, 12 Jul 2020 23:33:40 +0200
Received: from SRV220.tudelft.net ([fe80::dc7a:a6b8:8bb9:2210]) by SRV220.tudelft.net ([fe80::dc7a:a6b8:8bb9:2210%13]) with mapi id 15.01.1913.007; Sun, 12 Jul 2020 23:33:40 +0200
From: Wojciech Kozlowski <W.Kozlowski@tudelft.nl>
To: "qirg@irtf.org" <qirg@irtf.org>
Thread-Topic: [Qirg] arch I-D: pull request & comments
Thread-Index: AQHWLaQyrVsKAcW+NkSdtv+Hsw5K7qkEq2eA
Date: Sun, 12 Jul 2020 21:33:40 +0000
Message-ID: <5543d40967778dcd33f3aa8f5cdd329f52036f44.camel@tudelft.nl>
References: <553672B6-E4C5-4537-8916-E2B1F200A362@sfc.wide.ad.jp>
In-Reply-To: <553672B6-E4C5-4537-8916-E2B1F200A362@sfc.wide.ad.jp>
Accept-Language: en-GB, nl-NL, en-US
Content-Language: en-US
X-MS-Has-Attach:
X-MS-TNEF-Correlator:
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"
Content-ID: <BA9041B05DF8464FB413E4E7D96FC9BA@forest.intra>
Content-Transfer-Encoding: base64
MIME-Version: 1.0
Archived-At: <https://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/msg/qirg/xymCPENW9Mog6K8ooBLQVaI_pI8>
Subject: Re: [Qirg] arch I-D: pull request & comments
X-BeenThere: qirg@irtf.org
X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29
Precedence: list
List-Id: "Quantum Internet \(proposed\) RG" <qirg.irtf.org>
List-Unsubscribe: <https://www.irtf.org/mailman/options/qirg>, <mailto:qirg-request@irtf.org?subject=unsubscribe>
List-Archive: <https://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/browse/qirg/>
List-Post: <mailto:qirg@irtf.org>
List-Help: <mailto:qirg-request@irtf.org?subject=help>
List-Subscribe: <https://www.irtf.org/mailman/listinfo/qirg>, <mailto:qirg-request@irtf.org?subject=subscribe>
X-List-Received-Date: Sun, 12 Jul 2020 21:33:50 -0000
Hi Rodney So finally got around to addressing your comments. See in-inline. Note that I actually had two e-mails from you in the pipeline. Since some points were raised in both e-mails I simply appended the older e-mail at the bottom and also addressed the comments in-line. Cheers, Wojtek On Tue, 2020-05-19 at 15:09 +0900, Rodney Van Meter wrote: > <chair hat off> > <individual contributor hat on> > > Wojtek et al., > > A pull request for the architecture I-D awaits you at > https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__github.com_Wojtek242_draft-2Dirtf-2Dqirg-2Dprinciples_pull_7&d=DwIGaQ&c=XYzUhXBD2cD-CornpT4QE19xOJBbRy-TBPLK0X9U2o8&r=xRe3k8UnFVGCjuC7RWUARpslGfYlRaP7D3dVZXHUEVc&m=DAxWywV9qbtvoGKGw6BAJ7W2sUeFaKT0byF8SKqSzWE&s=uAPhFtt4Jag1SImLOB-xdnvE4wqgUKfhwulYKnRNffI&e= > > (I didn't generate the .txt from it, I figure it's generally better > for such generated files that are stored in git to be managed at one > node.) > > I went through the I-D and made a number of small changes; I doubt > anything will need discussion but please check. Almost all edits are > for clarity, spelling or grammar. I modified the Muralidharan > reference to the right "generations" paper, and I added Sutor as a > reference for beginners. (I really do think that's an excellent > beginner's book on quantum computing, with the dead-minimum > assumptions of background in CS, math and physics, as opposed to Mike > & Ike, which can be a steep climb.) PR was accepted > > A number of things occured to me while reading, some of which we've > probably covered before: > > 1. My memory fails me -- in the section on network boundaries, we > previously had a discussion of how much to cover the different types > of logical networks (1G, 2G, 3G), didn't we? What did we decide? > Personally, I think it's _critical_ in a document like this, intended > to be long-lived and set the direction for the network architecture, > to acknowledge that not only are there physical differences and > administrative boundaries, but there are important distinctions in how > errors will be managed, which affects the content and semantics of > messages that must cross those boundaries, as well -- both for > connection setup and real-time operation. This has been included through w PRs from Shota. See latest doc version now. > > 2. Assessment of fidelity is a statistical thing, requiring constant > monitoring and the sacrifice of generated Bell pairs for tomography or > other methods. Should we clarify this? At the moment, fidelity is > mentioned but where it comes from is not. Added the clarification. > > 3. Mentions QKD as depending on Bell pairs, which is not exactly true for > BB84. Also, E91 and BBM92 are probably worth citing as better > instances of entanglement-based QKD. Good point. Cited Ekert paper, but didn't explain it in words as I'm worried it might detract from the main point of the text. > > 4. This (and some of the surrounding paragraphs) needs work: > > It turns out that as long as the underlying implementation > corresponds to (or sufficiently approximates) theoretical models > of > quantum cryptography, quantum cryptographic protocols do not need > the network to provide any guarantees about the authenticity, > confidentiality, or integrity of the transmitted qubits or the > generated entanglement. Instead, applications, such as QKD, > establish such guarantees using the classical network in > conjunction > with he quantum one. This is much easier than demanding that the > network deliver secure entanglement in the first place. > <vspace blankLines="1" /> > > This could cite Satoh on quantum network security; AFAIK, our work on > the security of repeater network operation remains the world's only > work on the topic. One or both of > https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__arxiv.org_abs_1701.04587&d=DwIGaQ&c=XYzUhXBD2cD-CornpT4QE19xOJBbRy-TBPLK0X9U2o8&r=xRe3k8UnFVGCjuC7RWUARpslGfYlRaP7D3dVZXHUEVc&m=DAxWywV9qbtvoGKGw6BAJ7W2sUeFaKT0byF8SKqSzWE&s=LVu3oWfp0WCPG46t-AAs2zgGy6PC0bBYt8ACKAlYI_U&e= > > https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__arxiv.org_abs_2005.04617&d=DwIGaQ&c=XYzUhXBD2cD-CornpT4QE19xOJBbRy-TBPLK0X9U2o8&r=xRe3k8UnFVGCjuC7RWUARpslGfYlRaP7D3dVZXHUEVc&m=DAxWywV9qbtvoGKGw6BAJ7W2sUeFaKT0byF8SKqSzWE&s=8Fs-dOf5B_umAIwmL81kWTqHlgTVOc7-MUva1m7T2LA&e= > > Done, both refs included. > 5. We have discussed Bell pairs as the primary service provided by the > network, but it may be worth mentioning that multi-party states are > useful, and may be generated either by applications operating > end-to-end or by the network itself as a service. There are a number > of uses of multi-party states documented in the literature, but only > Clement, Damian and Frederic Grosshans on how to create them, I > think. > https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__link.aps.org_doi_10.1103_PhysRevA.100.052333&d=DwIGaQ&c=XYzUhXBD2cD-CornpT4QE19xOJBbRy-TBPLK0X9U2o8&r=xRe3k8UnFVGCjuC7RWUARpslGfYlRaP7D3dVZXHUEVc&m=DAxWywV9qbtvoGKGw6BAJ7W2sUeFaKT0byF8SKqSzWE&s=P3uNxsyWPSV-AyvZllHG0VcKmtDmxpLzOuLqLrKrs-8&e= > > Done > 6. "shortest path" is undefined here. Again, work of ours is > relevant: > https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__arxiv.org_abs_1206.5655&d=DwIGaQ&c=XYzUhXBD2cD-CornpT4QE19xOJBbRy-TBPLK0X9U2o8&r=xRe3k8UnFVGCjuC7RWUARpslGfYlRaP7D3dVZXHUEVc&m=DAxWywV9qbtvoGKGw6BAJ7W2sUeFaKT0byF8SKqSzWE&s=5CZHrVvCzrqIE5WlMt53hX0WAA0H7gTARE-g4zWoR3Y&e= > > In what sense is "shortest path" undefined. Could you elaborate? > 7. In discussion of rule-based operation, again, work of ours is > relevant: > https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__arxiv.org_abs_1904.08605&d=DwIGaQ&c=XYzUhXBD2cD-CornpT4QE19xOJBbRy-TBPLK0X9U2o8&r=xRe3k8UnFVGCjuC7RWUARpslGfYlRaP7D3dVZXHUEVc&m=DAxWywV9qbtvoGKGw6BAJ7W2sUeFaKT0byF8SKqSzWE&s=RZE6ErezqKuvt7bPhzr6A7xV3ilHq0krX0EcYpQyadA&e= > > (I _know_ it sounds like I'm citing "cite me" a lot, but this _is_ the > field we have been working for over a decade to establish, and we've > covered a lot of ground in that time, and my students and postdocs > deserve some recognition for the work they have done that is, or > should be, influencing these documents and designs.) > Not sure where to insert the ref though. If you could point out a location or submit a PR that would be great. > 8. The use of "control plane" and "data plane" here might differ a bit > from standard networking use. "Control plane" usual refers to routing > and management traffic, path setup for MPLS, etc. but here it refers > to soft real-time messages that are part of the entangled state > creation process, essentially the equivalent of packet headers and > SYNs and ACKs in TCP/IP. I'd argue that's closer to data plane than > control plane. I 100% agree with this point, but I'm not sure if this point needs clarifying in this doc. We actually do not define a control/data plane split in this doc. > > I don't think the document is close to ready for last call yet, but it > has made a lot of progress. I think we can put serious discussion of > the document onto the agenda for July, with the hopes of publishing > soon after. > > —Rod > > Rodney Van Meter > Professor, Faculty of Environment and Information Studies > Keio University, Japan > rdv@sfc.wide.ad.jp > > > > _______________________________________________ > Qirg mailing list > Qirg@irtf.org > https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__www.irtf.org_mailman_listinfo_qirg&d=DwIGaQ&c=XYzUhXBD2cD-CornpT4QE19xOJBbRy-TBPLK0X9U2o8&r=xRe3k8UnFVGCjuC7RWUARpslGfYlRaP7D3dVZXHUEVc&m=DAxWywV9qbtvoGKGw6BAJ7W2sUeFaKT0byF8SKqSzWE&s=wxv8uRZVSeFyskfYTA2SKnUDIBhmcXehDoaOqFQKLh0&e= > On Fri, 2020-03-06 at 09:17 +0900, Rodney Van Meter wrote: > Wojtek, > > About two weeks ago, I started working on a list of things I’d like to see in > the draft, but I’m afraid I’m not going to be able to turn them into text and > an actual pull request by Monday. My apologies. A few are absolute nits, a > few are rather big. > > Put these on your TODO list, and maybe we can find time to work on them > together F2F sometime during the week in Vancouver? > > Comments for Wojtek on QIRG architecture I-D: > > * overall, the flow and structure are much better than -00. I > particularly like 6.2 now, though I'm not sure it's finished yet. > * additional refs: > - Dur group (Pirker, Zwerger) > - (more stuff from us, e.g. my book?) > - Kimble > - Mark Wilde > - Jones on links? > - all-optical? > - triangle inequality for routing > - Riefel > - Simon on QEC > - Dur review of purification > - distributed algorithm zoo > - something from Pan? > - Broadbent > - Gottesman > - Wootters, Park, Ortigoso on no-cloning References are still TODO. Hopefully the last TODO. > * needs a little wordsmithing here and there at some point Generally addressed through all the fixes since this e-mail. > * security needs work Language slightly improved, but let me know if you would like to see some more substantial changes. > * needs to talk about logical differences at network boundaries > (differences in error management parallels the other two very well) > * should cover 1G, 2G, 3G Both points are now addressed under "Error management" and in network boundaries section thanks to Shota's PR. > * "support tomorrow's dist q apps" is time-sensitive, and why > is it different from the apps just above it? This point is addressed as goal/principles have been rewritten. > * does doc accommodate all-optical links or paths? Not at the moment. Do you think it should? What would you propose? > * does doc describe 1G as a distributed computation? > - important corollary: state along the path v. stateless forwarding > - equally important corollary: resource reservation/multiplexing The "Comparison to classical networks" section does mention "stateful distributed task". This section does cover your two corollaries as well. > * just a shade more on apps, as parallel I-D is developing This will be in use-case doc which is now cited. > * describe time-skewed Bell pairs I don't know what this is. Could you elaborate? > * "Therefore, we cannot use the same methods known from > classical computing for the purposes of error detection and > correction." ==> without modification, though both codes derived > from classical and wholy unique to quantum are known (cite Simon?) > Overall, this paragraph needs work to be both more accurate and > clearer. > reconcile w/ later ACK that QEC exists Done > * "through a variety of checksums" -- not entirely accurate. > how about "through both error detection and error correction mechanisms"? Done > * section on direct transmission needs work > --> make it a subsection of 4.1, titled "inadequacy of direct > transmission"? Done > * "challenges" v. "new challenges" is awkward Fixed, by just having "challenges". Though admittedly some creativity in section titles would not hurt. > * use the name "Dirac's ket notation" > (makes it easier for neophytes to find) Done > * expand CNOT first time it's used Done (in your PR I believe) > * connection architecture v. network architecture I've though about this, but I don't think this is material for this draft. Connection architecture is getting close to specific protocols.
- [Qirg] arch I-D: pull request & comments Rodney Van Meter
- Re: [Qirg] arch I-D: pull request & comments Wojciech Kozlowski
- Re: [Qirg] arch I-D: pull request & comments Akbar Rahman
- Re: [Qirg] arch I-D: pull request & comments Wojciech Kozlowski
- Re: [Qirg] arch I-D: pull request & comments Wojciech Kozlowski
- Re: [Qirg] arch I-D: pull request & comments Rodney Van Meter
- Re: [Qirg] arch I-D: pull request & comments Wojciech Kozlowski