[rfc-i] draft-hildebrand-html-rfc
jhildebr at cisco.com (Joe Hildebrand (jhildebr)) Tue, 24 July 2012 16:04 UTC
From: "jhildebr at cisco.com"
Date: Tue, 24 Jul 2012 16:04:13 +0000
Subject: [rfc-i] draft-hildebrand-html-rfc
In-Reply-To: <E86DA708-AA7B-4CB6-9082-1C4B38384F90@vpnc.org>
Message-ID: <CC341FBF.19A29%jhildebr@cisco.com>
On 7/24/12 9:24 AM, "Paul Hoffman" <paul.hoffman at vpnc.org> wrote: >On Jul 24, 2012, at 7:19 AM, Joe Hildebrand (jhildebr) wrote: > >> The IETF brand has been ravaged by decades of obstinate conservatism in >> the look of our primary output. > >And hyperbole is destroying the Internet. > >Do you have any evidence that the above statement is true? Which other >SDOs have benefitted from this ravaging you talk of? (No points for >mentioning ones that used Microsoft Word as a publishing format during >the same time period.) Agree that my statement was intentionally hyperbolic. Sorry for that. I don't want to argue over what other SDOs tooling is, since I don't have time to track down references. Also, I don't claim that format is even the largest issue in folks not bringing work here. But I do think it is part of the perception that scares away work that one could argue should be done at the IETF. Some examples that I'm pretty sure about: - OASIS (e.g.: AMQP, CAP, XACML, SAML) - XSF (discovery, compression, capabilities) - WHATWG (URIs, etc.) - Liberty Alliance (ur-SAML) - 3GPP (various SIP entanglements) If I knew more about their spaces, I might be able to give examples for: - CableLabs - DMTF -- Joe Hildebrand
- [rfc-i] draft-hildebrand-html-rfc Julian Reschke
- [rfc-i] draft-hildebrand-html-rfc Joe Hildebrand jhildebr
- [rfc-i] draft-hildebrand-html-rfc Phillip Hallam-Baker
- [rfc-i] draft-hildebrand-html-rfc Joe Hildebrand jhildebr
- [rfc-i] draft-hildebrand-html-rfc Yoav Nir
- [rfc-i] draft-hildebrand-html-rfc Julian Reschke
- [rfc-i] draft-hildebrand-html-rfc Yoav Nir
- [rfc-i] draft-hildebrand-html-rfc Joe Hildebrand jhildebr
- [rfc-i] draft-hildebrand-html-rfc Julian Reschke
- [rfc-i] draft-hildebrand-html-rfc Phillip Hallam-Baker
- [rfc-i] draft-hildebrand-html-rfc Joe Hildebrand jhildebr
- [rfc-i] draft-hildebrand-html-rfc Peter Saint-Andre
- [rfc-i] Graceful degradation is key, was: Re: dra… Joe Hildebrand jhildebr
- [rfc-i] draft-hildebrand-html-rfc Iljitsch van Beijnum
- [rfc-i] draft-hildebrand-html-rfc Iljitsch van Beijnum
- [rfc-i] draft-hildebrand-html-rfc Joe Hildebrand jhildebr
- [rfc-i] draft-hildebrand-html-rfc Julian Reschke
- [rfc-i] draft-hildebrand-html-rfc Iljitsch van Beijnum
- [rfc-i] draft-hildebrand-html-rfc Peter Sylvester
- [rfc-i] draft-hildebrand-html-rfc Peter Sylvester
- [rfc-i] draft-hildebrand-html-rfc Peter Sylvester
- [rfc-i] draft-hildebrand-html-rfc Joe Hildebrand jhildebr
- [rfc-i] draft-hildebrand-html-rfc Joe Hildebrand jhildebr
- [rfc-i] draft-hildebrand-html-rfc Joe Hildebrand jhildebr
- [rfc-i] draft-hildebrand-html-rfc Iljitsch van Beijnum
- [rfc-i] draft-hildebrand-html-rfc Peter Saint-Andre
- [rfc-i] draft-hildebrand-html-rfc Julian Reschke
- [rfc-i] draft-hildebrand-html-rfc Joe Hildebrand jhildebr
- [rfc-i] draft-hildebrand-html-rfc Joe Hildebrand jhildebr
- [rfc-i] draft-hildebrand-html-rfc Julian Reschke
- [rfc-i] draft-hildebrand-html-rfc Iljitsch van Beijnum
- [rfc-i] draft-hildebrand-html-rfc Julian Reschke
- [rfc-i] Graceful degradation is key, was: Re: dra… Joe Hildebrand jhildebr
- [rfc-i] draft-hildebrand-html-rfc Julian Reschke
- [rfc-i] draft-hildebrand-html-rfc Peter Sylvester
- [rfc-i] draft-hildebrand-html-rfc Julian Reschke
- [rfc-i] draft-hildebrand-html-rfc Peter Sylvester
- [rfc-i] draft-hildebrand-html-rfc Peter Sylvester
- [rfc-i] draft-hildebrand-html-rfc Joe Touch
- [rfc-i] draft-hildebrand-html-rfc Joe Touch
- [rfc-i] draft-hildebrand-html-rfc Julian Reschke
- [rfc-i] draft-hildebrand-html-rfc Julian Reschke
- [rfc-i] draft-hildebrand-html-rfc Joe Touch
- [rfc-i] draft-hildebrand-html-rfc Julian Reschke
- [rfc-i] Graceful degradation is key, was: Re: dra… Martin Rex
- [rfc-i] draft-hildebrand-html-rfc Joe Touch
- [rfc-i] draft-hildebrand-html-rfc Julian Reschke
- [rfc-i] draft-hildebrand-html-rfc Joe Touch
- [rfc-i] draft-hildebrand-html-rfc Joe Hildebrand jhildebr
- [rfc-i] draft-hildebrand-html-rfc Julian Reschke
- [rfc-i] Internet-Draft Formats Russ Housley
- [rfc-i] Internet-Draft Formats Phillip Hallam-Baker
- [rfc-i] draft-hildebrand-html-rfc Peter Sylvester
- [rfc-i] draft-hildebrand-html-rfc Phillip Hallam-Baker
- [rfc-i] Graceful degradation is key, was: Re: dra… Martin Rex
- [rfc-i] draft-hildebrand-html-rfc "Martin J. Dürst"
- [rfc-i] draft-hildebrand-html-rfc Iljitsch van Beijnum
- [rfc-i] draft-hildebrand-html-rfc Joe Hildebrand jhildebr
- [rfc-i] draft-hildebrand-html-rfc Martin Rex
- [rfc-i] draft-hildebrand-html-rfc Tim Bray
- [rfc-i] draft-hildebrand-html-rfc Martin Rex
- [rfc-i] Graceful degradation is key, was: Re: dra… Iljitsch van Beijnum
- [rfc-i] Graceful degradation is key, was: Re: dra… Julian Reschke
- [rfc-i] Graceful degradation is key, was: Re: dra… Tim Bray
- [rfc-i] draft-hildebrand-html-rfc Phillip Hallam-Baker
- [rfc-i] Graceful degradation is key, was: Re: dra… Yoav Nir
- [rfc-i] Graceful degradation is key, was: Re: dra… Iljitsch van Beijnum
- [rfc-i] Graceful degradation is key, was: Re: dra… Phillip Hallam-Baker
- [rfc-i] Graceful degradation is key, was: Re: dra… Tim Bray
- [rfc-i] Graceful degradation is key, was: Re: dra… Iljitsch van Beijnum
- [rfc-i] Graceful degradation is key, was: Re: dra… Peter Sylvester
- [rfc-i] Graceful degradation is key, was: Re: dra… Tim Bray
- [rfc-i] Graceful degradation is key, was: Re: dra… Julian Reschke
- [rfc-i] Graceful degradation is key, was: Re: dra… John Levine
- [rfc-i] Graceful degradation is key, was: Re: dra… Phillip Hallam-Baker
- [rfc-i] Graceful degradation is key, was: Re: dra… John R Levine
- [rfc-i] Graceful degradation is key, was: Re: dra… Paul Hoffman
- [rfc-i] Graceful degradation is key, was: Re: dra… Martin Rex
- [rfc-i] Graceful degradation is key, was: Re: dra… Joe Hildebrand jhildebr
- [rfc-i] Graceful degradation is key, was: Re: dra… Peter Sylvester
- [rfc-i] Graceful degradation is key, was: Re: dra… Joe Hildebrand jhildebr
- [rfc-i] Graceful degradation is key, was: Re: dra… Martin Rex
- [rfc-i] Graceful degradation is key, was: Re: dra… Julian Reschke
- [rfc-i] Graceful degradation is key, was: Re: dra… Martin Rex
- [rfc-i] Graceful degradation is key, was: Re: dra… Peter Saint-Andre
- [rfc-i] Graceful degradation is key, was: Re: dra… Joe Hildebrand jhildebr
- [rfc-i] Graceful degradation is key, was: Re: dra… Joe Hildebrand jhildebr
- [rfc-i] Graceful degradation is key, was: Re: dra… Joe Hildebrand jhildebr
- [rfc-i] Graceful degradation is key, was: Re: dra… Martin Rex
- [rfc-i] Graceful degradation is key, was: Re: dra… Julian Reschke
- [rfc-i] Graceful degradation is key, was: Re: dra… Martin Rex
- [rfc-i] Graceful degradation is key, was: Re: dra… Joe Hildebrand jhildebr
- [rfc-i] Graceful degradation is key, was: Re: dra… Martin Rex
- [rfc-i] Graceful degradation is key, was: Re: dra… "Martin J. Dürst"
- [rfc-i] Graceful degradation is key, was: Re: dra… Julian Reschke
- [rfc-i] Graceful degradation is key, was: Re: dra… Martin Rex
- [rfc-i] Graceful degradation is key, was: Re: dra… Julian Reschke
- [rfc-i] Graceful degradation is key, was: Re: dra… Joe Hildebrand jhildebr
- [rfc-i] Graceful degradation is key, was: Re: dra… "Martin J. Dürst"
- [rfc-i] Graceful degradation is key, was: Re: dra… "Martin J. Dürst"
- [rfc-i] Graceful degradation is key, was: Re: dra… Peter Sylvester
- [rfc-i] Graceful degradation is key, was: Re: dra… Martin Rex
- [rfc-i] Graceful degradation is key, was: Re: dra… Julian Reschke
- [rfc-i] Graceful degradation is key, was: Re: dra… Martin Rex
- [rfc-i] Graceful degradation is key, was: Re: dra… Julian Reschke
- [rfc-i] Metadatan was Graceful degradation John Levine
- [rfc-i] draft-hildebrand-html-rfc "Martin J. Dürst"
- [rfc-i] draft-hildebrand-html-rfc Joe Hildebrand jhildebr
- [rfc-i] draft-hildebrand-html-rfc Julian Reschke
- [rfc-i] draft-hildebrand-html-rfc Joe Hildebrand jhildebr
- [rfc-i] draft-hildebrand-html-rfc Joe Hildebrand jhildebr
- [rfc-i] draft-hildebrand-html-rfc Julian Reschke
- [rfc-i] draft-hildebrand-html-rfc Joe Hildebrand jhildebr
- [rfc-i] draft-hildebrand-html-rfc "Martin J. Dürst"
- [rfc-i] draft-hildebrand-html-rfc Julian Reschke
- [rfc-i] draft-hildebrand-html-rfc Joe Hildebrand jhildebr
- [rfc-i] draft-hildebrand-html-rfc Julian Reschke
- [rfc-i] draft-hildebrand-html-rfc Paul Hoffman
- [rfc-i] draft-hildebrand-html-rfc Paul Hoffman
- [rfc-i] draft-hildebrand-html-rfc Joe Hildebrand jhildebr
- [rfc-i] draft-hildebrand-html-rfc Joe Hildebrand jhildebr
- [rfc-i] draft-hildebrand-html-rfc Paul Hoffman
- [rfc-i] draft-hildebrand-html-rfc Tim Bray
- [rfc-i] draft-hildebrand-html-rfc Julian Reschke
- [rfc-i] draft-hildebrand-html-rfc Martin Rex
- [rfc-i] draft-hildebrand-html-rfc Joe Hildebrand jhildebr
- [rfc-i] css problems Peter Sylvester
- [rfc-i] css problems Joe Hildebrand jhildebr
- [rfc-i] draft-hildebrand-html-rfc "Martin J. Dürst"
- [rfc-i] draft-hildebrand-html-rfc Joe Hildebrand jhildebr
- [rfc-i] draft-hildebrand-html-rfc Peter Sylvester
- [rfc-i] Importance of good 'canonical' typography… "Martin J. Dürst"
- [rfc-i] disappointment Dave Crocker
- [rfc-i] Importance of good 'canonical' typography… Joe Hildebrand jhildebr
- [rfc-i] disappointment Joe Hildebrand jhildebr
- [rfc-i] disappointment Dave Crocker
- [rfc-i] Importance of good 'canonical' typography… Phillip Hallam-Baker