Re: [Rswg] Making progress on evolving the XML format

Eric Rescorla <ekr@rtfm.com> Thu, 16 February 2023 03:36 UTC

Return-Path: <ekr@rtfm.com>
X-Original-To: rswg@ietfa.amsl.com
Delivered-To: rswg@ietfa.amsl.com
Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 0E45AC17CE81 for <rswg@ietfa.amsl.com>; Wed, 15 Feb 2023 19:36:59 -0800 (PST)
X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com
X-Spam-Flag: NO
X-Spam-Score: -1.896
X-Spam-Level:
X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.896 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, RCVD_IN_ZEN_BLOCKED_OPENDNS=0.001, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_NONE=0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no
Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (2048-bit key) header.d=rtfm-com.20210112.gappssmtp.com
Received: from mail.ietf.org ([50.223.129.194]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id tivvUUpVNnvj for <rswg@ietfa.amsl.com>; Wed, 15 Feb 2023 19:36:54 -0800 (PST)
Received: from mail-pl1-x62f.google.com (mail-pl1-x62f.google.com [IPv6:2607:f8b0:4864:20::62f]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_128_GCM_SHA256 (128/128 bits) key-exchange X25519 server-signature RSA-PSS (2048 bits) server-digest SHA256) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 7CE89C1782B0 for <rswg@rfc-editor.org>; Wed, 15 Feb 2023 19:36:54 -0800 (PST)
Received: by mail-pl1-x62f.google.com with SMTP id b5so761886plz.5 for <rswg@rfc-editor.org>; Wed, 15 Feb 2023 19:36:54 -0800 (PST)
DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=rtfm-com.20210112.gappssmtp.com; s=20210112; h=to:subject:message-id:date:from:in-reply-to:references:mime-version :from:to:cc:subject:date:message-id:reply-to; bh=rWsujamvUzLB2gQ7AoqNBp2xIzeVR+OFFaojYjIJkik=; b=aKpuJ/Uwc4N/u0pP7iDu+v5VzKx5bitsY3zfPe5J7t/NEwItAVmBgBPEjoBAVqnZlW BWNCX/mBr1DrtAGthEZ4VfkTDG5jSWOoISlDluDYnCG/lSu8BJ1Dp+8LfT7sIGsaLbI3 nOGg9gsBntGuSGyQSbVsDkpY7koLstxgB+xxXMejrs3V3OkuvGLMam3oA6IvNch1Lzyl 2eIPtMH9Qm/qa3QYa6ej222M51CHFwESQWj4njL2TYW2RwAuaj/CvyH24kAE35hTcXwY R3DbYZKco+z65i69SFlwqw/5cIY7l81Z/Ua3FA7KY0Z/71pGY8Yaa2ZDyV0k93/PcGwz 7MGg==
X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20210112; h=to:subject:message-id:date:from:in-reply-to:references:mime-version :x-gm-message-state:from:to:cc:subject:date:message-id:reply-to; bh=rWsujamvUzLB2gQ7AoqNBp2xIzeVR+OFFaojYjIJkik=; b=XTdS7wU+Xfj+X3E4wNzfVujBFr1IkwZc6abpCcZVErdEIc7J3Ar6jOSo367oL1+cx1 6RAi3vTH1nNW9Z7aUzaxHAMlXIO3/NZ/dPxDXb/Rwf9BIK2gYWxcdyTKIPHmPnh2zbd4 KCE8Alv5fdoevm+ZkgyN8vWpEW04Vt8HyFE4wsQDFt2xbpWOKHMKXy7/1bw/ln7B0SoM Fo+XSfn9XNIgQjoqvLcdIRxhtd3FaNuE7GMnC3xqs1fv3fXqrjEq3HNz03unjW1F1Svd ovnsk/iEvrxPLJfJ9T9FuHjPu7/JmyoNILg8Zs5+EKht9jnGl3yVCsIfHuiXZFtOOUt0 wPtA==
X-Gm-Message-State: AO0yUKWTYZZc1dRljjqq5rlMiuVutR+6irp0cg4LoLfqximiVM05ykCS zWRnxduNOdlTt791Gg/trOLzVYuM5r8+v45oMd3i3/T5xK3Heg==
X-Google-Smtp-Source: AK7set/cQYdI8RP5qs//9itXRgwL2daMCKD8FwWZf20wI2TFNs0cWmEKqQmLLpi/BmZXrRIOmTu6bo07a1eGW1VLgHU=
X-Received: by 2002:a17:90b:1a8a:b0:233:fbf8:6876 with SMTP id ng10-20020a17090b1a8a00b00233fbf86876mr194401pjb.57.1676518613271; Wed, 15 Feb 2023 19:36:53 -0800 (PST)
MIME-Version: 1.0
References: <CABcZeBM1TKqRkXJ8JErVijoKhEKOa+ebWDpxfERuq1NhUrSG4g@mail.gmail.com>
In-Reply-To: <CABcZeBM1TKqRkXJ8JErVijoKhEKOa+ebWDpxfERuq1NhUrSG4g@mail.gmail.com>
From: Eric Rescorla <ekr@rtfm.com>
Date: Wed, 15 Feb 2023 19:36:17 -0800
Message-ID: <CABcZeBM5jfXK-XjDSD5wTZbOXxse19GXO=UBbf25v616wub2hw@mail.gmail.com>
To: RSWG <rswg@rfc-editor.org>
Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="00000000000067694b05f4c8e80e"
Archived-At: <https://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/msg/rswg/KLM4uvQPB3pRIYTXv1m53saJ2qY>
Subject: Re: [Rswg] Making progress on evolving the XML format
X-BeenThere: rswg@rfc-editor.org
X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.39
Precedence: list
List-Id: "RFC Series Working Group \(RSWG\)" <rswg.rfc-editor.org>
List-Unsubscribe: <https://mailman.rfc-editor.org/mailman/options/rswg>, <mailto:rswg-request@rfc-editor.org?subject=unsubscribe>
List-Archive: <https://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/browse/rswg/>
List-Post: <mailto:rswg@rfc-editor.org>
List-Help: <mailto:rswg-request@rfc-editor.org?subject=help>
List-Subscribe: <https://mailman.rfc-editor.org/mailman/listinfo/rswg>, <mailto:rswg-request@rfc-editor.org?subject=subscribe>
X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 16 Feb 2023 03:36:59 -0000

Following up on this...

Can we please get any further comments for or against this proposal by
February 20th.

Thanks,
-Ekr








On Mon, Feb 13, 2023 at 12:27 PM Eric Rescorla <ekr@rtfm.com> wrote:

> Hi RSWG members,
>
> Pete and I have been chatting about the best way forward for evolving
> the XMLv3 grammar. We think that there's broad agreement that:
>
> 1. We need some document that describes the "as-is" xmlv3 format.
>    - That document should be published in some form that implies
>      it doesn't have consensus.
>    - The WG should do the work of making sure that happens
> 2. We need to work on a new format (v3.1?) that will have consensus.
>
> I think people are assuming that the new format will need an RFC but
> there is not agreement on whether the "as-is" should be.
>
>
> Pete and I would like to propose the following way forward, based
> on a suggestion from Martin Thomson in January.
>
> - Adopt draft-irse-draft-irse-xml2rfcv3-implemented as a WG document
>   to use as the basis for v3.1.
>
> - Everything that doesn't match RFC 7990 will be marked as
>   "provisional". We go through all of these and either adopt them as
>   having consensus or decline to make the change, in which case we
>   move them to an Appendix.
>
> - If necessary, we can also update the I-D to make consensus changes
>   to the as-is version on an "emergency" basis, though hopefully
>   this will not be needed often.
>
> At the end of this process, we will have a document which describes
> the consensus format and also an appendix which describes how "as
> implemented" differs from the consensus format. These can be published
> together as an RFC, which will provide archival forms of both but
> without requiring that we publish an RFC of the current document while
> the consensus version is still in flux. In the meantime, the ID
> can serve as the definition of the current format.
>
> What do people think of this proposal?
> -Ekr
>