Re: [secdir] dir review of draft-laurie-pki-sunlight-05
Ben Laurie <benl@google.com> Wed, 30 January 2013 10:15 UTC
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Date: Wed, 30 Jan 2013 10:15:09 +0000
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From: Ben Laurie <benl@google.com>
To: Jeffrey Hutzelman <jhutz@cmu.edu>
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Cc: The IESG <iesg@ietf.org>, draft-laurie-pki-sunlight.all@tools.ietf.org, "secdir@ietf.org" <secdir@ietf.org>
Subject: Re: [secdir] dir review of draft-laurie-pki-sunlight-05
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On 29 January 2013 21:28, Jeffrey Hutzelman <jhutz@cmu.edu> wrote: > On Tue, 2013-01-29 at 11:35 +0000, Ben Laurie wrote: >> On 24 January 2013 19:06, Jeffrey Hutzelman <jhutz@cmu.edu> wrote: >> > Similarly, as an anti-spam measure, this document proposes that logs accept >> > only certificates which chain back to a known CA, and requires that logs >> > validate each submitted certificate before appending it to the log. This >> > sounds good, but it's not the only possible mechanism, and so I think MUST >> > is too strong here. Additionally, there is no discussion of the security >> > implications if a client depends on a log to do this and the log does not >> > actually do so. Rather than requiring that logs validate every submitted >> > certificate, the document should only RECOMMEND that they do so, and make >> > clear that clients MUST NOT depend on such validation having been done. >> >> On second thoughts, whilst that is an effective anti-spam measure, it >> is also part of the functionality of CT: i.e. to identify misissue and >> give some means to do something about it. The CA check ensures we have >> someone to blame for misissue. > > Hrm. I sort of thought the idea was for the logs to be untrusted > repositories, able to be audited but not themselves expected to detect > problems. If logs are expected to do validation of this sort, is there > a way for a third party to discover whether they are doing so (or at > least, whether they are accepting certificates they shouldn't)? A third party can indeed verify this - they just watch the log like any monitor does. >> I am not averse to suggestions that achieve the overall aim, but I >> don't see the virtue of leaving it vague in the description of the >> experiment we are actually running. > > I'm not suggesting vagueness; rather, I'm merely suggesting downgrading > a MUST to a SHOULD, which is still quite strong. What happens if > someone wants to start logging certs issued by a private CA, or > self-signed certs they have observed, or...? I don't see an issue with logging certs from a private CA. As for self-signed certs, I don't see the point, but I guess if someone figures out a point we can relax it in the next version. > I'm suppose I'm OK with keeping the scope narrower than that for > purposes of the experiment, as long as it is possible to relax the > requirement later without breaking the system. Hence the importance of > making it clear that clients must not rely on logs to have done > validation (on which point I think we've already reached agreement). Cool.
- [secdir] dir review of draft-laurie-pki-sunlight-… Jeffrey Hutzelman
- Re: [secdir] dir review of draft-laurie-pki-sunli… Ben Laurie
- Re: [secdir] [therightkey] dir review of draft-la… =JeffH
- Re: [secdir] dir review of draft-laurie-pki-sunli… Ben Laurie
- Re: [secdir] dir review of draft-laurie-pki-sunli… Jeffrey Hutzelman
- Re: [secdir] dir review of draft-laurie-pki-sunli… Ben Laurie
- Re: [secdir] dir review of draft-laurie-pki-sunli… Tobias Gondrom
- Re: [secdir] dir review of draft-laurie-pki-sunli… Ben Laurie
- Re: [secdir] dir review of draft-laurie-pki-sunli… Tobias Gondrom
- Re: [secdir] dir review of draft-laurie-pki-sunli… Ben Laurie
- Re: [secdir] dir review of draft-laurie-pki-sunli… Tobias Gondrom