Re: [lamps] [EXTERNAL] Re: I-D Action: draft-ietf-lamps-im-keyusage-00.txt
Rohan Mahy <rohan.mahy@gmail.com> Wed, 17 April 2024 14:10 UTC
Return-Path: <rohan.mahy@gmail.com>
X-Original-To: spasm@ietfa.amsl.com
Delivered-To: spasm@ietfa.amsl.com
Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 75654C14F6B8 for <spasm@ietfa.amsl.com>; Wed, 17 Apr 2024 07:10:06 -0700 (PDT)
X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com
X-Spam-Flag: NO
X-Spam-Score: -1.993
X-Spam-Level:
X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.993 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_EF=-0.1, FREEMAIL_FROM=0.001, HTML_FONT_LOW_CONTRAST=0.001, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, HTTPS_HTTP_MISMATCH=0.1, RCVD_IN_ZEN_BLOCKED_OPENDNS=0.001, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001, URIBL_DBL_BLOCKED_OPENDNS=0.001, URIBL_ZEN_BLOCKED_OPENDNS=0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no
Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (2048-bit key) header.d=gmail.com
Received: from mail.ietf.org ([50.223.129.194]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id LBDtcj5rTeVj for <spasm@ietfa.amsl.com>; Wed, 17 Apr 2024 07:10:01 -0700 (PDT)
Received: from mail-ej1-x62a.google.com (mail-ej1-x62a.google.com [IPv6:2a00:1450:4864:20::62a]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_128_GCM_SHA256 (128/128 bits) key-exchange X25519 server-signature RSA-PSS (2048 bits) server-digest SHA256) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id C0739C14F6AC for <spasm@ietf.org>; Wed, 17 Apr 2024 07:10:01 -0700 (PDT)
Received: by mail-ej1-x62a.google.com with SMTP id a640c23a62f3a-a51a80b190bso365161866b.3 for <spasm@ietf.org>; Wed, 17 Apr 2024 07:10:01 -0700 (PDT)
DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20230601; t=1713362999; x=1713967799; darn=ietf.org; h=cc:to:subject:message-id:date:from:in-reply-to:references :mime-version:from:to:cc:subject:date:message-id:reply-to; bh=WJ0JeHWGhMJm98iPnLOwvu9DPamDp3isyKqbS7Z6jOw=; b=CjWEIQu35r/Wd2+Nk4Dj5unwHJJNZK1qBKO8lBvpuKxJy0RNMyS+IiQwRUDW7Y0XRa pymS1mU5qoipUjLiGIH303YXAs4w1ewgAOa3ZlGhuQLUyO9kbNBzH7H1mXodmuzRozXo AOvgqHPXOMPelxeWc5Qp6kS5mVIm3ZehEzdGI5NIKq2GMTO9fmOgvh0+/xtLD32KJxoj 8qzONLVsVdYQeiO4gssMDIopnLuiZZNeU4w75tuEK2kqcW9EW8316jOaYCShygE5yFZn 46vllnRCiHEisCHxghJDKaXcjfZaA/DAPZKhVPijFih0K7fL5eh6prt87wQUQHAD3JeO R4bA==
X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20230601; t=1713362999; x=1713967799; h=cc:to:subject:message-id:date:from:in-reply-to:references :mime-version:x-gm-message-state:from:to:cc:subject:date:message-id :reply-to; bh=WJ0JeHWGhMJm98iPnLOwvu9DPamDp3isyKqbS7Z6jOw=; b=doZhRV3cPFt3WZnVqCEkab5aas8qLYfG1NRv8Dn/rlfNGF3Z+/6Nwg2oJ1q5EVfax3 OFOdfnyssGtEZjM7Wwbv5hb0lFOkJAu2DQSCHHuL7S8LQB8UCr7oIaOOgApXGedaVpyQ g23kRu65H8XjHbaaz/OWivtzh+2jnup90so5fzDZ+QKOUxbUQYK7hqZs9njNMI8LM7QI oQcz3tAMiAhHWhmVPCmAx1vGW4FU/Qvl3TaGeyQiRuJiYAOOHKqMcFEfV+IamiT2gE91 Th28sT4QvaNzB0kaDkfmccoVj3PeGUvNqx42nBpNm/7l1FnuMwl15MAZmwezEl2mzPsA 9VoQ==
X-Forwarded-Encrypted: i=1; AJvYcCV8pkwFtqfuYq2aKFon3++hPoPiYqzwWs2yvo4fW2vARQCLsK+r5Zodr2f/Gug7s1NDkt+PDHXZfODQXbjxpQ==
X-Gm-Message-State: AOJu0YwDS8+GFLvanjd9Q1z0UeMe42ndhvBZauabvvV1zaC7A78997Wm XO5f2z60KujGrLZfRFHlJlb2kzyFSLXoT1cfv5GOjQKMMHxuc8fwNU/rR3xzLaeyiqlhq2+hjWx 3L1gmTwyXD9yDnA3igKxi6RuXggcX3g==
X-Google-Smtp-Source: AGHT+IE3S0W9AMMqzWMsxi5bNz4e7k10oxtqlmuv+Rqwyx2Hgk+ZmTL8LfbvPbUOOKhn6NavjKADK+N6YnlsHAfVr1o=
X-Received: by 2002:a50:d659:0:b0:56d:fca8:d2d6 with SMTP id c25-20020a50d659000000b0056dfca8d2d6mr14250141edj.6.1713362999107; Wed, 17 Apr 2024 07:09:59 -0700 (PDT)
MIME-Version: 1.0
References: <171320513468.22285.6899802433610546466@ietfa.amsl.com> <B508131E-0554-471F-94FD-4AA2A0A95346@vigilsec.com> <CAKoiRuYCSwdzwKwSXdyLCNm5Z3DzzzLZzSyDO7DGWHTSeUj-fA@mail.gmail.com> <2E8965D1-F0D8-4947-8A6B-19B822EEFA4C@vigilsec.com> <CH0PR11MB5739FF2B9A378DF7ADFF24E69F082@CH0PR11MB5739.namprd11.prod.outlook.com>
In-Reply-To: <CH0PR11MB5739FF2B9A378DF7ADFF24E69F082@CH0PR11MB5739.namprd11.prod.outlook.com>
From: Rohan Mahy <rohan.mahy@gmail.com>
Date: Wed, 17 Apr 2024 07:09:47 -0700
Message-ID: <CAKoiRuY5Caq_61+99RQiaRkeKUAou=fiLj+HadajzhwhLKOdAA@mail.gmail.com>
To: Mike Ounsworth <Mike.Ounsworth@entrust.com>
Cc: Russ Housley <housley@vigilsec.com>, Rohan Mahy <rohan.ietf@gmail.com>, LAMPS <spasm@ietf.org>
Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="000000000000eeec6106164b68ec"
Archived-At: <https://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/msg/spasm/qS5m8pYTMans9a0T7iD1D_xc7-k>
Subject: Re: [lamps] [EXTERNAL] Re: I-D Action: draft-ietf-lamps-im-keyusage-00.txt
X-BeenThere: spasm@ietf.org
X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.39
Precedence: list
List-Id: This is the mail list for the LAMPS Working Group <spasm.ietf.org>
List-Unsubscribe: <https://www.ietf.org/mailman/options/spasm>, <mailto:spasm-request@ietf.org?subject=unsubscribe>
List-Archive: <https://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/browse/spasm/>
List-Post: <mailto:spasm@ietf.org>
List-Help: <mailto:spasm-request@ietf.org?subject=help>
List-Subscribe: <https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/spasm>, <mailto:spasm-request@ietf.org?subject=subscribe>
X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 17 Apr 2024 14:10:06 -0000
Thanks Mike, The semantics of the EKU is an Instant Messaging identity. It should be perfectly fine to use this with XMPP, MIMI, or a proprietary messaging system. Unless you have some reason to do otherwise, a very natural way to express this identity would be to use a URI identifier of any relevant scheme in the subjectAltName. (XMPP already has a custom SAN identifier type but that was not strictly necessary.) I'll take a stab at some more generic text for the Intro and Security Considerations. Thanks again for the review. I will fix the other small errors as well. -rohan On Tue, Apr 16, 2024, 12:14 Mike Ounsworth <Mike.Ounsworth@entrust.com> wrote: > Hey Rohan, > > > > I’m a novice on the IM topic, but I’ll provide a review of your document > anyway (feel free to ignore). > > > > The introduction mentions that the driving motivation is IM apps built on > top of MLS, and then says “or others see: MIMI”. Are all IMs considered > equal, or is it important to be able to say “This cert is for MikeGram, and > that cert is for RohanChat?”. IE would it be better if this draft created > the specific EKUs that MIMI needs for the specific IM protocols that you’re > designing now? > > > > It would be good to expand the Security Considerations section to be clear > about what security is gained by using the mechanism, including what the > expectation is of verifiers who are looking for this EKU. Again, I think > some discussion of using the same cert across different IM protocols would > be good. > > > > > > Why is it called id-kp-imUri? Why “Uri”? Perhaps this is clear in the mimi > arch docs, but could use repeating here. > > > > > > Typo? The IANA Considerations section asks for “id-kp-im-eku”, but the > ASN.1 Module defines “id-mod-im-eku”. I think the latter is the better > name, to indicate that this is the identifier of an ASN.1 module. > > > > > > To Russ’ question about whether this draft should also cover SANs: the > intro already says > > “The subjectAltName of these certificates can be an IM URI, for example.” > > Out of curiosity, which SAN type would be used for that? > > > > --- > > *Mike* Ounsworth > > > > *From:* Spasm <spasm-bounces@ietf.org> *On Behalf Of *Russ Housley > *Sent:* Monday, April 15, 2024 4:22 PM > *To:* Rohan Mahy <rohan.ietf@gmail.com> > *Cc:* LAMPS <spasm@ietf.org> > *Subject:* [EXTERNAL] Re: [lamps] I-D Action: > draft-ietf-lamps-im-keyusage-00.txt > > > > I thought it was worth asking. I think the xmpp: URI in the SAN would be a > very reasonable solution. Russ On Apr 15, 2024, at 4: 49 PM, Rohan Mahy > <rohan. mahy@ gmail. com> wrote: Hi Russ, I don't understand why an > XmppAddr identifier type > > I thought it was worth asking. I think the xmpp: URI in the SAN would be > a very reasonable solution. > > > > Russ > > > > > > On Apr 15, 2024, at 4:49 PM, Rohan Mahy <rohan.mahy@gmail.com> wrote: > > > > Hi Russ, > > I don't understand why an XmppAddr identifier type would have been > strictly needed, since anyone could have put either an xmpp: URI or an im: > URI into a SAN without any extensions (as a URI type). > > > > I'm happy to go look at some old discussions, but I don't know the history. > > Thanks, > > -rohan > > > > > > > > On Mon, Apr 15, 2024 at 11:28 AM Russ Housley <housley@vigilsec.com> > wrote: > > Rohan: > > RFC 6120 defines the way to carry a client name (Jabber ID) in the > subjectAltName extension. Should this document be expanded to address > subjectAltName as well as extended key usage? > > Russ > > > > On Apr 15, 2024, at 2:18 PM, internet-drafts@ietf.org wrote: > > > > Internet-Draft draft-ietf-lamps-im-keyusage-00.txt is now available. It > is a > > work item of the Limited Additional Mechanisms for PKIX and SMIME > (LAMPS) WG > > of the IETF. > > > > Title: X.509 Certificate Extended Key Usage (EKU) for Instant > Messaging URIs > > Author: Rohan Mahy > > Name: draft-ietf-lamps-im-keyusage-00.txt > > Pages: 5 > > Dates: 2024-04-15 > > > > Abstract: > > > > RFC 5280 specifies several extended key purpose identifiers > > (KeyPurposeIds) for X.509 certificates. This document defines > > Instant Messaging (IM) identity KeyPurposeId for inclusion in the > > Extended Key Usage (EKU) extension of X.509 v3 public key > > certificates > > > > The IETF datatracker status page for this Internet-Draft is: > > https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ietf-lamps-im-keyusage/ > <https://urldefense.com/v3/__https:/datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ietf-lamps-im-keyusage/__;!!FJ-Y8qCqXTj2!eOQUtDAA8uwHi6mlSlRXJVJrnm_r5CwAKy09oCl_Q3itf786AeEtm2xwcGhxxxWefFHr1_P4naZzm9xvxEoUKqOy538S$> > > > > There is also an HTML version available at: > > https://www.ietf.org/archive/id/draft-ietf-lamps-im-keyusage-00.html > <https://urldefense.com/v3/__https:/www.ietf.org/archive/id/draft-ietf-lamps-im-keyusage-00.html__;!!FJ-Y8qCqXTj2!eOQUtDAA8uwHi6mlSlRXJVJrnm_r5CwAKy09oCl_Q3itf786AeEtm2xwcGhxxxWefFHr1_P4naZzm9xvxEoUKn1iEEOp$> > > > > Internet-Drafts are also available by rsync at: > > rsync.ietf.org::internet-drafts > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > > Spasm mailing list > > Spasm@ietf.org > > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/spasm > <https://urldefense.com/v3/__https:/www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/spasm__;!!FJ-Y8qCqXTj2!eOQUtDAA8uwHi6mlSlRXJVJrnm_r5CwAKy09oCl_Q3itf786AeEtm2xwcGhxxxWefFHr1_P4naZzm9xvxEoUKhkjFbRj$> > > _______________________________________________ > Spasm mailing list > Spasm@ietf.org > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/spasm > <https://urldefense.com/v3/__https:/www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/spasm__;!!FJ-Y8qCqXTj2!eOQUtDAA8uwHi6mlSlRXJVJrnm_r5CwAKy09oCl_Q3itf786AeEtm2xwcGhxxxWefFHr1_P4naZzm9xvxEoUKhkjFbRj$> > > >
- [lamps] I-D Action: draft-ietf-lamps-im-keyusage-… internet-drafts
- Re: [lamps] I-D Action: draft-ietf-lamps-im-keyus… Russ Housley
- Re: [lamps] I-D Action: draft-ietf-lamps-im-keyus… Rohan Mahy
- Re: [lamps] I-D Action: draft-ietf-lamps-im-keyus… Russ Housley
- Re: [lamps] [EXTERNAL] Re: I-D Action: draft-ietf… Mike Ounsworth
- Re: [lamps] [EXTERNAL] Re: I-D Action: draft-ietf… Rohan Mahy
- Re: [lamps] [EXTERNAL] Re: I-D Action: draft-ietf… Mike Ounsworth
- Re: [lamps] [EXTERNAL] Re: I-D Action: draft-ietf… Mike Ounsworth
- Re: [lamps] [EXTERNAL] Re: I-D Action: draft-ietf… Michael StJohns
- Re: [lamps] [EXTERNAL] Re: I-D Action: draft-ietf… Mike Ounsworth
- Re: [lamps] [EXTERNAL] Re: I-D Action: draft-ietf… Tim Hollebeek
- Re: [lamps] [EXTERNAL] Re: I-D Action: draft-ietf… Rohan Mahy
- Re: [lamps] [EXTERNAL] Re: I-D Action: draft-ietf… Salz, Rich
- Re: [lamps] [EXTERNAL] Re: I-D Action: draft-ietf… Rohan Mahy
- Re: [lamps] [EXTERNAL] Re: I-D Action: draft-ietf… Rohan Mahy
- Re: [lamps] [EXTERNAL] Re: I-D Action: draft-ietf… Rohan Mahy
- Re: [lamps] [EXTERNAL] Re: I-D Action: draft-ietf… Stephen Farrell
- Re: [lamps] [EXTERNAL] Re: I-D Action: draft-ietf… Salz, Rich
- Re: [lamps] [EXTERNAL] Re: I-D Action: draft-ietf… Salz, Rich
- Re: [lamps] [EXTERNAL] Re: I-D Action: draft-ietf… Michael StJohns
- Re: [lamps] [EXTERNAL] Re: I-D Action: draft-ietf… Rohan Mahy
- Re: [lamps] [EXTERNAL] Re: I-D Action: draft-ietf… Stephen Farrell
- Re: [lamps] [EXTERNAL] Re: I-D Action: draft-ietf… Tomas Gustavsson
- Re: [lamps] [EXTERNAL] Re: I-D Action: draft-ietf… Stephen Farrell
- Re: [lamps] [EXTERNAL] Re: I-D Action: draft-ietf… Rohan Mahy