[tsvwg] A word for "does not have a significantly negative impact on traffic using standard congestion control"?
Bob Briscoe <ietf@bobbriscoe.net> Tue, 09 March 2021 01:19 UTC
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From: Bob Briscoe <ietf@bobbriscoe.net>
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Date: Tue, 09 Mar 2021 01:19:12 +0000
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Subject: [tsvwg] A word for "does not have a significantly negative impact on traffic using standard congestion control"?
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tsvwg-ers, In the survey of the L4S Prague Requirements, we got quite significant push-back from developers about our two requirements to fall back to Reno-Friendly (which the draft defines as a translation of 'TCP-Friendly' into transport-agnostic language, 'cos TCP isn't the only transport these days). Basically, people don't want to have to fall back to something as lame a Reno (apologies if that's disparaging, but I'm just the messenger). I was hoping people would interpret 'Reno-Friendly' liberally. But everyone takes Reno-Friendly to mean quite close to Reno behaviour - not surprising really, given the definition of TCP-Friendly in TFRC is roughly within 2x of Reno [RFC5348] (pasted at the end). What I'm looking for is a word that means "does not have a significantly negative impact on traffic using standard congestion control", which RFC5033 allows for experimental congestion controls. ==Details from the RFCs== RFCRFC2914 (borrowing from RFC2309) defines TCP-compatible to mean the same behaviour as Reno (essentially). RFC5348 defines the term TCP-Friendly, which was originally intended for real-time media - to allow the rate to temporarily stray from TCP-compatible because it needed to remain more stable as available capacity varied. But it was also used for regular elastic congestion controls like Cubic. Here's the TFRC definition. TFRC is designed to be reasonably fair when competing for bandwidth with TCP flows, where we call a flow "reasonably fair" if its sending rate is generally within a factor of two of the sending rate of a TCP flow under the same conditions. However, TFRC has a much lower variation of throughput over time compared with TCP, which makes it more suitable for applications such as telephony or streaming media where a relatively smooth sending rate is of importance. In RFC5033, Sally Floyd wrote this, which is a useful turn of phrase. I'd just like to find a shorter way of saying it: Alternate congestion controllers that have a significantly negative impact on traffic using standard congestion control may be suspect Bob -- ________________________________________________________________ Bob Briscoe http://bobbriscoe.net/
- [tsvwg] A word for "does not have a significantly… Bob Briscoe
- Re: [tsvwg] A word for "does not have a significa… Neal Cardwell
- Re: [tsvwg] A word for "does not have a significa… Ian Swett
- Re: [tsvwg] A word for "does not have a significa… Jonathan Morton
- Re: [tsvwg] A word for "does not have a significa… Bob Briscoe
- Re: [tsvwg] A word for "does not have a significa… Bob Briscoe
- Re: [tsvwg] A word for "does not have a significa… Ian Swett
- Re: [tsvwg] A word for "does not have a significa… Sebastian Moeller
- Re: [tsvwg] A word for "does not have a significa… Bob Briscoe
- Re: [tsvwg] A word for "does not have a significa… Sebastian Moeller
- Re: [tsvwg] What TCP to target in TCP-friendly [w… Sebastian Moeller
- Re: [tsvwg] What TCP to target in TCP-friendly [w… Gorry Fairhurst
- Re: [tsvwg] A word for "does not have a significa… Lloyd W
- Re: [tsvwg] What TCP to target in TCP-friendly [w… Bob Briscoe
- Re: [tsvwg] What TCP to target in TCP-friendly [w… Martin Duke
- Re: [tsvwg] What TCP to target in TCP-friendly [w… Bob Briscoe
- Re: [tsvwg] What TCP to target in TCP-friendly [w… Sebastian Moeller
- Re: [tsvwg] What TCP to target in TCP-friendly [w… Gorry Fairhurst
- Re: [tsvwg] A word for "does not have a significa… Bob Briscoe