RE: [Tsvwg] Making draft-davie-ecn-mpls a TSVWG item
Dimitri.Papadimitriou@alcatel-lucent.be Fri, 26 January 2007 00:07 UTC
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To: lars.eggert@nokia.com
Subject: RE: [Tsvwg] Making draft-davie-ecn-mpls a TSVWG item
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From: Dimitri.Papadimitriou@alcatel-lucent.be
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lars - i am more generally questioning cost/perf. gain & value for 3 major reasons (they would deserve imho further discussion - or at least further proof of evidence) o) if it is to come up with a forwarding paradigm that becomes equivalent to IP probably we should then start questioning the need for MPLS itself (in part. in the present case focusing on intra-domain operations where i always thought that data-traffic and resource-oriented perf. objectives were taken into account for edge-to-edge MPLS path provisioning) o) MPLS paradigm assumed "intelligence@edges" we progressively enter into a mode where intermediate LSRs will become (see end of section 3) progressively require/result again more selective processing of traffic o) initial MPLS-ECN based its reasoning on expectations from experience - quoting: "We believe the benefits from ECN of better overall performance for a wide range of applications because of reduced packet loss (especially those using non-TCP transports) and reduced queueing delay is sufficiently significant. Furthermore, there seems to be no reasons for LSRs to lack this capability as it becomes available in other (non-label switched) IP routers." it would have been interesting to sustain the reasoning with more tangible proofs - with the underlying question are we here waiting for this doc. to make such experiment possible ? much thanks, - d. <lars.eggert@nokia.com> 18/01/2007 11:49 To: Dimitri PAPADIMITRIOU/BE/ALCATEL@ALCATEL cc: tsvwg@ietf.org Subject: RE: [Tsvwg] Making draft-davie-ecn-mpls a TSVWG item < Attachment smime.p7s removed > Dimitri, > discussion was led on the list mid november - no real > conclusion or action where derived from the concerns > expressed at that time thanks for pointing out that this draft was also discussed elsewhere! As for your specific points: > > 1. CN marking in the EXP bits of the MPLS header falls imho under the > > MPLS change process that states for an optional problem statement and > > a mandatory prior requirements statement I-D to commit for any > > specific change or extension to MPLS > > > > see section 2.1.1 and 4.2 of > > <http://www.ietf.org/internet-drafts/draft-andersson-rtg-gmpls-change-06 .txt> The process described in that document isn't official procedure yet, and has raised significant concern in parts of the IESG. IMO it is unlikely to proceed without major changes. Hence, it's questionable that we should apply it here and now. > [dp] the same section 7 mentions > > "[RFC3168] does not give any reasons against conveying CE information > from the inner header to the outer in the "full functionality" mode." > > nor the other way around - which leaves the point open for ECN itself > -> the issue i am raising is that in absence of evidence current the > processing should be left per RFC3168 and not inline with the expected > PCN needs (even if it does not affect the former) I'm not quite sure I understand your point - are you saying that the benefits of ECN for MPLS are unclear? Thanks, Lars -- NEW EMAIL: lars.eggert@nokia.com NEW MOBILE: +358 50 48 24461 NEW JABBER: lars.eggert@googlemail.com
- [Tsvwg] Making draft-davie-ecn-mpls a TSVWG item Magnus Westerlund
- Re: [Tsvwg] Making draft-davie-ecn-mpls a TSVWG i… Francois Le Faucheur IMAP
- [Tsvwg] Re: [mpls] Making draft-davie-ecn-mpls a … Dimitri.Papadimitriou
- Re: [mpls] [Fwd: [Tsvwg] Making draft-davie-ecn-m… Magnus Westerlund
- RE: [Tsvwg] Making draft-davie-ecn-mpls a TSVWG i… philip.eardley
- Re: [mpls] [Fwd: [Tsvwg] Making draft-davie-ecn-m… Bruce Davie
- Re: [Tsvwg] Re: [mpls] Making draft-davie-ecn-mpl… Bruce Davie
- Re: [Tsvwg] Re: [mpls] Making draft-davie-ecn-mpl… Dimitri.Papadimitriou
- RE: [Tsvwg] Making draft-davie-ecn-mpls a TSVWG i… Anna Charny (acharny)
- Re: [mpls] [Fwd: [Tsvwg] Making draft-davie-ecn-m… Adrian Farrel
- Re: [Tsvwg] Making draft-davie-ecn-mpls a TSVWG i… lars.eggert
- Re: [Tsvwg] Making draft-davie-ecn-mpls a TSVWG i… Dimitri.Papadimitriou
- RE: [Tsvwg] Making draft-davie-ecn-mpls a TSVWG i… lars.eggert
- Re: [Tsvwg] Making draft-davie-ecn-mpls a TSVWG i… Bob Briscoe
- RE: [Tsvwg] Making draft-davie-ecn-mpls a TSVWG i… Dimitri.Papadimitriou
- Re: [Tsvwg] Making draft-davie-ecn-mpls a TSVWG i… Bruce Davie
- Re: [Tsvwg] Making draft-davie-ecn-mpls a TSVWG i… Lars Eggert
- Re: [Tsvwg] Making draft-davie-ecn-mpls a TSVWG i… Dimitri.Papadimitriou
- Re: [Tsvwg] Making draft-davie-ecn-mpls a TSVWG i… Bob Briscoe