Re: [v6ops] new draft: draft-colitti-v6ops-host-addr-availability
Andrew 👽 Yourtchenko <ayourtch@gmail.com> Tue, 07 July 2015 15:33 UTC
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Date: Tue, 07 Jul 2015 17:33:53 +0200
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From: Andrew 👽 Yourtchenko <ayourtch@gmail.com>
To: "Fred Baker (fred)" <fred@cisco.com>
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Cc: "v6ops@ietf.org" <v6ops@ietf.org>, "draft-colitti-v6ops-host-addr-availability@tools.ietf.org" <draft-colitti-v6ops-host-addr-availability@tools.ietf.org>
Subject: Re: [v6ops] new draft: draft-colitti-v6ops-host-addr-availability
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On 7/7/15, Fred Baker (fred) <fred@cisco.com> wrote: > Thanks. One question. Chair hat off. > > Section 2 identifies the current deployment model - each interface has a > link-local address, a SLAAC address, and one or more temporary addresses. I > haven't heard anyone complaining about that. Section 3 goes on to discuss > virtual machines/containers, which might each have additional addresses, and > the model Facebook is reportedly using, which gives individual addresses to > processes. It also mentions draft-herbert-nvo3-ila, which is not a stupid > model - I still have some comments on it in a multi-administration > environment or for running applications in an "inside" and an "outside" > address ("NAT has well-known drawbacks"), but it at least gets rid of the > random encapsulations predominant in data centers today. > > In other words, we already assign multiple addresses, by some means, to each > interface in a network. > > You mention SLAAC. Lorenzo mentions that in section 7. He also mentions DHCP > address and prefix allocation. Lorenzo already commented on the "problem definition" so I will reply just to this part: Yes, we both mention them - but I'm arguing the usage of them should be proactively monitored by the devices themselves. Preferably along with the tangible benefits provided to the apps when the device is on a network allowing for more than one address. (Though that is outside of the "ops" domain). --a > > The statement that I don't see in the document, which would help me > personally, is a problem statement. I would guess that the problem statement > is "we think some networks are limiting host interfaces to a single IPv6 > address." I'd want a little more detail, but I'll bet that's the crux of > it. > > So my question is: "precisely what problem are we solving here?". > >> On Jul 6, 2015, at 2:39 PM, Andrew Yourtchenko <ayourtch@gmail.com> >> wrote: >> >> I read the draft and absolutely agree with the spirit. >> >> Unfortunately, I think it won't work: >> >> As soon as the devices work "good enough" with a single address, appealing >> to increase the amount of work by administrators in the name of humanity >> is going to fall on deaf ears. >> >> The only way I see to solve this is to always use SLAAC on the devices: >> either 'externally' from the prefix received within the RA, or >> 'internally' from within the prefix received via DHCP-PD, and provide a >> mandatory registration mechanism for name-to-IP mapping. >> >> If neither of the above works, as a backup effort the device can try >> getting N addresses via DHCP IA_NA and release those that it does not need >> immediately - and displaying a big yellow warning "This network may >> restrict IPv6 functionality and eat your kittens, contact your system >> administrator". Because ND is not going to happen on these 'extra' >> addresses, forwarding wise there will be no impact, just some more DHCP >> traffic after attachment (the "limited functionality" of course would need >> just one address and can start immediately). >> >> Those who want tracking can track the upper 64bits or use IA_NA and filter >> out the addresses that are shortly lived. >> >> Of course to avoid being a religious crusade such an effort need to >> produce something pragmatic - namely, >> a userland cross-platform API that would allow getting new addresses on >> demand by application and if needs to - implementing custom transport >> protocols on top of those on a per-app-per-address basis. >> >> The above conjecture however is even less realistic than politely asking >> the inconveniences away, so the logical conclusion from that is I fully >> support this draft. >> >> --a >> >>> On 06 Jul 2015, at 13:47, fred@cisco.com wrote: >>> >>> A new draft has been posted, at >>> http://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-colitti-v6ops-host-addr-availability. >>> Please take a look at it and comment. >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> v6ops mailing list >>> v6ops@ietf.org >>> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/v6ops > >
- [v6ops] new draft: draft-colitti-v6ops-host-addr-… fred
- Re: [v6ops] new draft: draft-colitti-v6ops-host-a… Simon Perreault
- Re: [v6ops] new draft: draft-colitti-v6ops-host-a… Sander Steffann
- Re: [v6ops] new draft: draft-colitti-v6ops-host-a… Andrew Yourtchenko
- Re: [v6ops] new draft: draft-colitti-v6ops-host-a… Fred Baker (fred)
- Re: [v6ops] new draft: draft-colitti-v6ops-host-a… Lorenzo Colitti
- Re: [v6ops] new draft: draft-colitti-v6ops-host-a… Erik Kline
- Re: [v6ops] new draft: draft-colitti-v6ops-host-a… Yury Shefer
- Re: [v6ops] new draft: draft-colitti-v6ops-host-a… Tore Anderson
- Re: [v6ops] new draft: draft-colitti-v6ops-host-a… Ray Hunter
- Re: [v6ops] new draft: draft-colitti-v6ops-host-a… Erik Kline
- Re: [v6ops] new draft: draft-colitti-v6ops-host-a… Tore Anderson
- Re: [v6ops] new draft: draft-colitti-v6ops-host-a… Andrew 👽 Yourtchenko
- Re: [v6ops] new draft: draft-colitti-v6ops-host-a… Hemant Singh (shemant)
- Re: [v6ops] new draft: draft-colitti-v6ops-host-a… Hemant Singh (shemant)
- Re: [v6ops] new draft: draft-colitti-v6ops-host-a… Brian E Carpenter
- Re: [v6ops] new draft: draft-colitti-v6ops-host-a… Fred Baker (fred)
- Re: [v6ops] new draft: draft-colitti-v6ops-host-a… Brian E Carpenter
- Re: [v6ops] new draft: draft-colitti-v6ops-host-a… Hemant Singh (shemant)
- Re: [v6ops] new draft: draft-colitti-v6ops-host-a… Sander Steffann
- Re: [v6ops] new draft: draft-colitti-v6ops-host-a… Fred Baker (fred)
- Re: [v6ops] new draft: draft-colitti-v6ops-host-a… Tom Taylor
- Re: [v6ops] new draft: draft-colitti-v6ops-host-a… Jouni Korhonen
- Re: [v6ops] new draft: draft-colitti-v6ops-host-a… Erik Kline
- Re: [v6ops] new draft: draft-colitti-v6ops-host-a… Alexandru Petrescu
- Re: [v6ops] new draft: draft-colitti-v6ops-host-a… Mukom Akong T.
- Re: [v6ops] new draft: draft-colitti-v6ops-host-a… Dave Thaler
- Re: [v6ops] new draft: draft-colitti-v6ops-host-a… Mikael Abrahamsson
- Re: [v6ops] new draft: draft-colitti-v6ops-host-a… Ross Chandler
- Re: [v6ops] new draft: draft-colitti-v6ops-host-a… Mark Smith
- Re: [v6ops] new draft: draft-colitti-v6ops-host-a… Lorenzo Colitti
- Re: [v6ops] new draft: draft-colitti-v6ops-host-a… George, Wes
- Re: [v6ops] new draft: draft-colitti-v6ops-host-a… George, Wes
- Re: [v6ops] new draft: draft-colitti-v6ops-host-a… Mark Smith
- Re: [v6ops] new draft: draft-colitti-v6ops-host-a… George, Wes
- Re: [v6ops] new draft: draft-colitti-v6ops-host-a… Templin, Fred L
- Re: [v6ops] new draft: draft-colitti-v6ops-host-a… Lorenzo Colitti
- Re: [v6ops] new draft: draft-colitti-v6ops-host-a… Fred Baker (fred)
- Re: [v6ops] new draft: draft-colitti-v6ops-host-a… Alexandru Petrescu