Re: [Acme] Issue: Allow ports other than 443

Eliot Lear <lear@cisco.com> Tue, 24 November 2015 16:49 UTC

Return-Path: <lear@cisco.com>
X-Original-To: acme@ietfa.amsl.com
Delivered-To: acme@ietfa.amsl.com
Received: from localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 446DE1B2CCF for <acme@ietfa.amsl.com>; Tue, 24 Nov 2015 08:49:43 -0800 (PST)
X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com
X-Spam-Flag: NO
X-Spam-Score: -15.086
X-Spam-Level:
X-Spam-Status: No, score=-15.086 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_HI=-5, RP_MATCHES_RCVD=-0.585, SPF_PASS=-0.001, USER_IN_DEF_DKIM_WL=-7.5] autolearn=ham
Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 4NWEYugz6aY7 for <acme@ietfa.amsl.com>; Tue, 24 Nov 2015 08:49:40 -0800 (PST)
Received: from aer-iport-3.cisco.com (aer-iport-3.cisco.com [173.38.203.53]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher DHE-RSA-SEED-SHA (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 4FF091B2A82 for <acme@ietf.org>; Tue, 24 Nov 2015 08:49:40 -0800 (PST)
DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/simple; d=cisco.com; i=@cisco.com; l=2919; q=dns/txt; s=iport; t=1448383780; x=1449593380; h=subject:to:references:cc:from:message-id:date: mime-version:in-reply-to; bh=AAKaDaUT8heaftDBTqCo5qFJiNrzO0ffkdQqdNboOvk=; b=USa/S2JGexwwL9aP9/V1EOBT49k2IW9Ah6YxpQ4xoQSKZ+bgfMN1phcM /gk8f4/2fwFD7cw3IowV1KV3Bzz9Cu1GgFAmNUxgo10Sg2UdZuPiQfh7o BGHjHTWqKrj7jFm7syF+Gxk0wO/EqmjmXKVPSD6bBIgUUhgUidWwFomsF U=;
X-Files: signature.asc : 481
X-IronPort-Anti-Spam-Filtered: true
X-IronPort-Anti-Spam-Result: A0DXBACkk1RW/xbLJq1ehA5vhCm8cxcKhW4Cgg0BAQEBAQGBC4Q1AQEEAQEBIEsKARALDgoJFgsCAgkDAgECAQ8GMAYBDAYCAQGIFQMSDa4sizUNhG0BAQEBAQEBAQEBAQEBAQEBAQEBEQUEi1KCU4UigUQFllCCWYFhhwGBdokdi1uHU2OEBT00AYUqAQEB
X-IronPort-AV: E=Sophos;i="5.20,338,1444694400"; d="asc'?scan'208";a="606481090"
Received: from aer-iport-nat.cisco.com (HELO aer-core-1.cisco.com) ([173.38.203.22]) by aer-iport-3.cisco.com with ESMTP/TLS/DHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384; 24 Nov 2015 16:49:38 +0000
Received: from [10.61.163.220] ([10.61.163.220]) by aer-core-1.cisco.com (8.14.5/8.14.5) with ESMTP id tAOGnbV2013493; Tue, 24 Nov 2015 16:49:37 GMT
To: Yoav Nir <ynir.ietf@gmail.com>, Kathleen Moriarty <kathleen.moriarty.ietf@gmail.com>
References: <5e9b22a3942d4a39981878b13e4a7752@usma1ex-dag1mb1.msg.corp.akamai.com> <0630035C-E4F6-41AA-A339-7101B448F0FA@vigilsec.com> <CABkgnnUxSwMmOR=QVE-gMvj9dHW6Tk2Z=EO7RDx6E5zVAp_SrQ@mail.gmail.com> <20151124033325.GH18430@eff.org> <56545B4C.3020406@cisco.com> <m2io4ro83g.wl%randy@psg.com> <CAHbuEH4Yh-UUin1F0ajsRAHrzrEZ+eDraXd9xLxcnY5kQVxPUg@mail.gmail.com> <59394DAB-E7B3-487F-9DC0-2820709F5252@gmail.com>
From: Eliot Lear <lear@cisco.com>
Message-ID: <56549520.2050907@cisco.com>
Date: Tue, 24 Nov 2015 17:49:36 +0100
User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Macintosh; Intel Mac OS X 10.11; rv:38.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/38.3.0
MIME-Version: 1.0
In-Reply-To: <59394DAB-E7B3-487F-9DC0-2820709F5252@gmail.com>
Content-Type: multipart/signed; micalg="pgp-sha256"; protocol="application/pgp-signature"; boundary="jQINEWklKaXJuF0lEJihcodQTX1Lw5nUU"
Archived-At: <http://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/msg/acme/1CnOA2yg7mhZw46wRoY3ZWf9Gzs>
Cc: Randy Bush <randy@psg.com>, Russ Housley <housley@vigilsec.com>, Peter Eckersley <pde@eff.org>, Martin Thomson <martin.thomson@gmail.com>, IETF ACME <acme@ietf.org>
Subject: Re: [Acme] Issue: Allow ports other than 443
X-BeenThere: acme@ietf.org
X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.15
Precedence: list
List-Id: Automated Certificate Management Environment <acme.ietf.org>
List-Unsubscribe: <https://www.ietf.org/mailman/options/acme>, <mailto:acme-request@ietf.org?subject=unsubscribe>
List-Archive: <https://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/browse/acme/>
List-Post: <mailto:acme@ietf.org>
List-Help: <mailto:acme-request@ietf.org?subject=help>
List-Subscribe: <https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/acme>, <mailto:acme-request@ietf.org?subject=subscribe>
X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 24 Nov 2015 16:49:43 -0000

Yes, thanks, Yoav.  Apologies to Randy and Kathleen for my terseness.

Eliot


On 11/24/15 5:46 PM, Yoav Nir wrote:
> I think Eliot meant RFC 5785 /.well-known/ locations, rather than well known ports
>
> Yoav
>
>> On 24 Nov 2015, at 6:37 PM, Kathleen Moriarty <kathleen.moriarty.ietf@gmail.com> wrote:
>>
>> I agree with Eliot, I don't think a scan is needed to make a decision
>> here.  Having managed several networks that would not have allowed you
>> access from some random scanner, I don't think you'll get all the data
>> you are looking for.  In a well managed network, the IDS/IPS should
>> detect that it is a scan and block all future probes once you hit a
>> small number of ports/IPs.  So you may get a small sample with
>> everything else failing within an address block.  Granted, not all
>> networks are managed well and you may get a good amount of data.
>>
>> If this connection was expected to a few servers, then a network
>> manager might just allow those only on the assigned port.
>>
>> Without any hat on, I agree that a port + 443 as an alternate is a good plan.
>>
>> Kathleen
>>
>> On Tue, Nov 24, 2015 at 8:11 AM, Randy Bush <randy@psg.com> wrote:
>>>> Isn't this precisely what .well-known was meant to address?
>>> fun small research project.  what percentage of well-known ports can
>>> you connect to from the outside to a machine inside cisco?  hell, to
>>> what percentage of well-known ports outside cisco can you reach from
>>> inside?
>>>
>>> well-known does not correlate well with open to access by IT security
>>> departments.
>>>
>>> randy
>>>
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> Acme mailing list
>>> Acme@ietf.org
>>> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/acme
>>
>>
>> -- 
>>
>> Best regards,
>> Kathleen
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> Acme mailing list
>> Acme@ietf.org
>> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/acme
>