Re: [antitrust-policy] New Version Notification for draft-halpern-gendispatch-antitrust-08.txt

Hi Adrian

> On 1 Mar 2024, at 12:24, Adrian Farrel <adrian@olddog.co.uk> wrote:
> 
> Thanks, Jay.
> 
> I have not been following this list, so your email acted as a trigger to
> read -08
> 
> Thanks for writing it (with Joel). It is a useful thing to have published.
> 
> A few very minor points below.

Thanks and thanks for the review below.

> 
> Cheers,
> Adrian
> 
> ===
> 
> I think a key piece of advice is missing (yes, I see 4.2). It may be too
> obvious, but surely you should be saying "individuals are recommended to
> seek legal advice" somewhere highly prominent. For example, lifting and
> tweaking a paragraph from BCP79 and placing it at the end of Section 1...
> 
>   This document is not intended as legal advice.  Readers are advised
>   to consult their own legal advisors if they would like a legal
>   interpretation of antitrust laws, the risks, and their responsibilities.

Section 4.2 is intended to be exactly that so I’m confused as to why you would apparently dismiss it and then ask for the same thing?  Is it just a matter of where it goes or is the language in 4.2 insufficient or do you think we need both 4.2 and the new text above?

For reference for others, section 4 lists "The importance of participants obtaining independent legal advice, as appropriate" and section 4.2 is

"4.2 Obtaining Independent Legal Advice
All IETF participants are expected to behave lawfully when engaged in IETF activities, including by following applicable antitrust law. The IETF does not provide legal advice to participants, and instead recommends that participants obtain independent legal advice as needed."

> ---
> 
> Section 3
>      The established conflict of interest policies, such as the IESG
>      Conflict of Interest Policy, the IAB Conflict of Interest Policy
>      or the IETF LLC Conflict of Interest Policy, if and when
>      applicable.
> 
> - These could really use references.
> - Maybe add the ISE's COI at https://www.rfc-editor.org/about/independent/
> 
> ---
> 
> 4.3
> 
>    via the IETF LLC whistleblower service
> 
> It is great that you mention this, but the reader is left wondering where
> and how.
> Maybe add a pointer to
> https://www.ietf.org/about/administration/policies-procedures/whistleblower/
> or direct to
> https://secure.ethicspoint.com/domain/media/en/gui/71269/index.html

I will talk to Joel and LLC colleagues about creating a stable URL, something like www.ietf.org/coi, that redirects to a new page with links to all of the conflict of interest policies, reporting lines etc.

Jay

> 
> ---
> 
> 
> 
> 
> -----Original Message-----
> From: antitrust-policy <antitrust-policy-bounces@ietf.org> On Behalf Of Jay
> Daley
> Sent: 29 February 2024 21:56
> To: antitrust-policy@ietf.org
> Cc: Lars Eggert <lars@eggert.org>
> Subject: [antitrust-policy] Fwd: New Version Notification for
> draft-halpern-gendispatch-antitrust-08.txt
> 
> Hi All
> 
> A new version of draft-halpern-gendispatch-antitrust is now available.
> 
> The only substantive change is that the previous section "Topics requiring
> caution" has now been deleted.  In the previous version of this I-D, this
> section covered two areas: the first began "Using unpublished market data to
> evaluate the relative  implementation costs" and the second was "Entering
> into potentially discriminatory, group negotiations of IPR terms".  These
> are both complex areas where some behaviours are an antitrust risk and some
> are not, but it has become clear that explaining where the difference lies
> is not possible and all attempts so far have confused people and led to
> mis-interpretation.
> 
> We understand that some on this list wanted this explained, while others
> wanted this whole section deleted, but after much discussion we concluded
> that deletion was our only option.
> 
> With this change, we consider this I-D ready to go to last call and will be
> notifying the sponsoring AD of that view.  If you strongly disagree then
> please speak up.
> 
> Jay
> 
>> Begin forwarded message:
>> 
>> From: internet-drafts@ietf.org
>> Subject: New Version Notification for
> draft-halpern-gendispatch-antitrust-08.txt
>> Date: 29 February 2024 at 21:15:36 GMT
>> To: "Joel M. Halpern" <joel.halpern@ericsson.com>, "Jay Daley"
> <jay@staff.ietf.org>, "Joel Halpern" <joel.halpern@ericsson.com>
>> 
>> A new version of Internet-Draft draft-halpern-gendispatch-antitrust-08.txt
> has
>> been successfully submitted by Joel M. Halpern and posted to the
>> IETF repository.
>> 
>> Name:     draft-halpern-gendispatch-antitrust
>> Revision: 08
>> Title:    Antitrust Guidelines for IETF Participants
>> Date:     2024-02-29
>> Group:    Individual Submission
>> Pages:    8
>> URL:
> https://www.ietf.org/archive/id/draft-halpern-gendispatch-antitrust-08.txt
>> Status:
> https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-halpern-gendispatch-antitrust/
>> HTML:
> https://www.ietf.org/archive/id/draft-halpern-gendispatch-antitrust-08.html
>> HTMLized:
> https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/html/draft-halpern-gendispatch-antitrust
>> Diff:
> https://author-tools.ietf.org/iddiff?url2=draft-halpern-gendispatch-antitrus
> t-08
>> 
>> Abstract:
>> 
>>  This document provides education and guidance for IETF participants
>>  on compliance with antitrust laws and how to reduce antitrust risks
>>  in connection with IETF activities.
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> The IETF Secretariat
>> 
>> 
> 
> -- 
> Jay Daley
> IETF Executive Director
> exec-director@ietf.org
> 
> _______________________________________________
> antitrust-policy mailing list
> antitrust-policy@ietf.org
> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/antitrust-policy
> 

-- 
Jay Daley
IETF Executive Director
exec-director@ietf.org