Re: [aqm] Benoit Claise's Discuss on draft-ietf-aqm-eval-guidelines-11: (with DISCUSS and COMMENT)

Mirja Kühlewind <ietf@kuehlewind.net> Fri, 10 June 2016 13:14 UTC

Return-Path: <ietf@kuehlewind.net>
X-Original-To: aqm@ietfa.amsl.com
Delivered-To: aqm@ietfa.amsl.com
Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 22BD712D0F6 for <aqm@ietfa.amsl.com>; Fri, 10 Jun 2016 06:14:43 -0700 (PDT)
X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com
X-Spam-Flag: NO
X-Spam-Score: -3.328
X-Spam-Level:
X-Spam-Status: No, score=-3.328 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, RP_MATCHES_RCVD=-1.426, SPF_HELO_PASS=-0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no
Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id nlFY3CD5APcA for <aqm@ietfa.amsl.com>; Fri, 10 Jun 2016 06:14:41 -0700 (PDT)
Received: from kuehlewind.net (kuehlewind.net [83.169.45.111]) (using TLSv1 with cipher DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 2B2DE12D0C4 for <aqm@ietf.org>; Fri, 10 Jun 2016 06:14:41 -0700 (PDT)
Received: (qmail 28159 invoked from network); 10 Jun 2016 15:14:39 +0200
Received: from nb-10510.ethz.ch (HELO ?82.130.103.143?) (82.130.103.143) by kuehlewind.net with ESMTPSA (DHE-RSA-AES128-SHA encrypted, authenticated); 10 Jun 2016 15:14:38 +0200
To: Benoit Claise <bclaise@cisco.com>, "MORTON, ALFRED C (AL)" <acmorton@att.com>
References: <20160519093824.17314.65212.idtracker@ietfa.amsl.com> <4AF73AA205019A4C8A1DDD32C034631D458D3D3108@NJFPSRVEXG0.research.att.com> <8D2CEA6F-BC90-4606-B737-1F5837178C1A@kuehlewind.net> <DEC82FD2-9F80-465A-AA16-C13C4766B54C@kuehlewind.net> <4AF73AA205019A4C8A1DDD32C034631D458D677B27@NJFPSRVEXG0.research.att.com> <2E5B5988-B119-44F6-BA82-F59F817948FB@kuehlewind.net> <4AF73AA205019A4C8A1DDD32C034631D458D677B29@NJFPSRVEXG0.research.att.com> <5CA63370-E84C-4C84-92A8-9C298B2CD0C3@kuehlewind.net> <4AF73AA205019A4C8A1DDD32C034631D458D677B2D@NJFPSRVEXG0.research.att.com> <82287fc6-473a-617c-757c-69bb2e7ce17a@cisco.com> <575A8DB2.3040702@kuehlewind.net> <ff2b5cc0-22be-7898-39f4-cd163b8f358b@cisco.com>
From: Mirja Kühlewind <ietf@kuehlewind.net>
Message-ID: <575ABD37.6090706@kuehlewind.net>
Date: Fri, 10 Jun 2016 15:14:31 +0200
User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; Linux x86_64; rv:38.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/38.8.0
MIME-Version: 1.0
In-Reply-To: <ff2b5cc0-22be-7898-39f4-cd163b8f358b@cisco.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"; format="flowed"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
Archived-At: <https://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/msg/aqm/pFxCCgre8qIUwggoFGPsPlfEk2g>
Cc: "wes@mti-systems.com" <wes@mti-systems.com>, "aqm-chairs@ietf.org" <aqm-chairs@ietf.org>, The IESG <iesg@ietf.org>, "draft-ietf-aqm-eval-guidelines@ietf.org" <draft-ietf-aqm-eval-guidelines@ietf.org>, "Schulthess Nicolas (F&W)" <nicolas.schulthess@sl.ethz.ch>, "aqm@ietf.org" <aqm@ietf.org>
Subject: Re: [aqm] Benoit Claise's Discuss on draft-ietf-aqm-eval-guidelines-11: (with DISCUSS and COMMENT)
X-BeenThere: aqm@ietf.org
X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.17
Precedence: list
List-Id: "Discussion list for active queue management and flow isolation." <aqm.ietf.org>
List-Unsubscribe: <https://www.ietf.org/mailman/options/aqm>, <mailto:aqm-request@ietf.org?subject=unsubscribe>
List-Archive: <https://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/browse/aqm/>
List-Post: <mailto:aqm@ietf.org>
List-Help: <mailto:aqm-request@ietf.org?subject=help>
List-Subscribe: <https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/aqm>, <mailto:aqm-request@ietf.org?subject=subscribe>
X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 10 Jun 2016 13:14:43 -0000

Benoit,

waiting for Al. But in the mean time see below.

On 10.06.2016 11:57, Benoit Claise wrote:
> Al, assuming that someone would like to register this metric in a registry
> (RFC6390), are they any grey areas in the performance metric definitions in
> the draft?
>  From what I understand, a point such this one (from Al) is:
>
>     Because we are using Goodput, G, I take as given that there
>     must be a protocol with retransmission capability.
>     Otherwise, further simplification is possible (with dummy traffic).

Not really if you have not retransmission, simply your goodout=throughput. 
Don't see a problem here.

>
>     But yes, Fs and G need to be reported on payload
>     at the same layer, so the protocol layer chosen is
>     an input parameter for this metric.

Yes, it need to be the same layer for all your tests; but the goal is not be 
compatible with other tests. So it's your decision. It's guidance how you 
would test AQMs to decide if you want to deploy them in the future (or to 
show that your AQM has benefits compared to other AQMs such that another guy 
might deploy this in future).

Mirja