Re: [dnsext] getting people to use new RRTYPEs
Andrew Sullivan <ajs@anvilwalrusden.com> Fri, 26 April 2013 12:14 UTC
Return-Path: <ajs@anvilwalrusden.com>
X-Original-To: dnsext@ietfa.amsl.com
Delivered-To: dnsext@ietfa.amsl.com
Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id F06D621F988B for <dnsext@ietfa.amsl.com>; Fri, 26 Apr 2013 05:14:29 -0700 (PDT)
X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com
X-Spam-Flag: NO
X-Spam-Score: -0.84
X-Spam-Level:
X-Spam-Status: No, score=-0.84 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-2.599, HELO_MISMATCH_INFO=1.448, HOST_MISMATCH_NET=0.311]
Received: from mail.ietf.org ([12.22.58.30]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id fhXRuj9PsxNG for <dnsext@ietfa.amsl.com>; Fri, 26 Apr 2013 05:14:29 -0700 (PDT)
Received: from mx1.yitter.info (ow5p.x.rootbsd.net [208.79.81.114]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5C46521F988A for <dnsext@ietf.org>; Fri, 26 Apr 2013 05:14:29 -0700 (PDT)
Received: from mx1.yitter.info (69-196-144-227.dsl.teksavvy.com [69.196.144.227]) (using TLSv1 with cipher DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by mx1.yitter.info (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id 8999E8A031 for <dnsext@ietf.org>; Fri, 26 Apr 2013 12:14:27 +0000 (UTC)
Date: Fri, 26 Apr 2013 08:14:24 -0400
From: Andrew Sullivan <ajs@anvilwalrusden.com>
To: dnsext@ietf.org
Message-ID: <20130426121424.GA349@mx1.yitter.info>
References: <alpine.BSF.2.00.1304251758160.66546@joyce.lan> <20130426004632.B5E1E32FAF70@drugs.dv.isc.org> <alpine.BSF.2.00.1304252131590.67465@joyce.lan> <5179DB4B.2040403@dougbarton.us>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
Content-Disposition: inline
In-Reply-To: <5179DB4B.2040403@dougbarton.us>
User-Agent: Mutt/1.5.21 (2010-09-15)
Subject: Re: [dnsext] getting people to use new RRTYPEs
X-BeenThere: dnsext@ietf.org
X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.12
Precedence: list
List-Id: DNS Extensions working group discussion list <dnsext.ietf.org>
List-Unsubscribe: <https://www.ietf.org/mailman/options/dnsext>, <mailto:dnsext-request@ietf.org?subject=unsubscribe>
List-Archive: <http://www.ietf.org/mail-archive/web/dnsext>
List-Post: <mailto:dnsext@ietf.org>
List-Help: <mailto:dnsext-request@ietf.org?subject=help>
List-Subscribe: <https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/dnsext>, <mailto:dnsext-request@ietf.org?subject=subscribe>
X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 26 Apr 2013 12:14:30 -0000
I am speaking here as an individual and as an operator. On Thu, Apr 25, 2013 at 06:41:31PM -0700, Doug Barton wrote: > 1. Insert the ability into the interface to add freeform stuff > 2. Run the equivalent of named-checkzone prior to committing the change > 3. Profit! That's preposterously naive. Step 2.1 is "Find that customer who has no theory of the mystifying DNS arcana screwed it up, so you can't publish, and now you have to contact a human. Stop. Invoke expensive off-page customer service process." In some significant number of cases, we never get to step 3. In the DNS business, the margins are small. This list -- and indeed, much of the IETF, as is often lamented -- is heavily populated by people who either are not operators or else are not consumer-facing operators, though there are notable exceptions. It sseems at least possible that this introduces a bias of ignoring problems that others report (or that are observable in deployment) because they're not the problems of the people who happen to be here. I have to agree with John Levine that the usual answer of the DNS community to provisioning problems -- in caricature, "This is easy, you must be morons." -- is not helpful, and is indicative of a closed mindedness that is unbecoming. Maybe, just maybe, the people out there who are successfully operating systems at some scale have something to teach us about the real barriers to the things we think would be ideal. We dismiss those observations not at our peril, but at the peril of the DNS (and Internet). A -- Andrew Sullivan ajs@anvilwalrusden.com
- Re: [dnsext] getting people to use new RRTYPEs Doug Barton
- Re: [dnsext] getting people to use new RRTYPEs John R Levine
- Re: [dnsext] getting people to use new RRTYPEs Mark Andrews
- Re: [dnsext] getting people to use new RRTYPEs John R Levine
- Re: [dnsext] getting people to use new RRTYPEs Mark Andrews
- Re: [dnsext] getting people to use new RRTYPEs John Levine
- Re: [dnsext] getting people to use new RRTYPEs Mark Andrews
- Re: [dnsext] getting people to use new RRTYPEs Doug Barton
- Re: [dnsext] getting people to use new RRTYPEs Douglas Otis
- Re: [dnsext] getting people to use new RRTYPEs Jim Reid
- Re: [dnsext] getting people to use new RRTYPEs Mark Andrews
- Re: [dnsext] getting people to use new RRTYPEs joel jaeggli
- Re: [dnsext] getting people to use new RRTYPEs Jim Reid
- Re: [dnsext] getting people to use new RRTYPEs Jim Reid
- Re: [dnsext] getting people to use new RRTYPEs Ted Lemon
- Re: [dnsext] getting people to use new RRTYPEs Andrew Sullivan
- Re: [dnsext] getting people to use new RRTYPEs Måns Nilsson
- Re: [dnsext] getting people to use new RRTYPEs Warren Kumari
- Re: [dnsext] getting people to use new RRTYPEs Doug Barton
- Re: [dnsext] getting people to use new RRTYPEs Andrew Sullivan
- Re: [dnsext] getting people to use new RRTYPEs John Levine
- Re: [dnsext] getting people to use new RRTYPEs Douglas Otis