Re: [Gendispatch] Thoughts on draft-carpenter-gendispatch-draft-adoption

Fernando Gont <fernando@gont.com.ar> Thu, 23 July 2020 10:35 UTC

Return-Path: <fernando@gont.com.ar>
X-Original-To: gendispatch@ietfa.amsl.com
Delivered-To: gendispatch@ietfa.amsl.com
Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 2BF323A0811; Thu, 23 Jul 2020 03:35:51 -0700 (PDT)
X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com
X-Spam-Flag: NO
X-Spam-Score: -1.622
X-Spam-Level:
X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.622 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, KHOP_HELO_FCRDNS=0.267, NICE_REPLY_A=-0.001, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, T_SPF_PERMERROR=0.01, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001] autolearn=no autolearn_force=no
Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id qWMk1O2DXtEb; Thu, 23 Jul 2020 03:35:49 -0700 (PDT)
Received: from tools.si6networks.com (v6toolkit.go6lab.si [IPv6:2001:67c:27e4::57]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ADH-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 5A5BD3A080A; Thu, 23 Jul 2020 03:35:47 -0700 (PDT)
Received: from [IPv6:2800:810:464:1f7:f51d:9a65:5fc2:4b87] (unknown [IPv6:2800:810:464:1f7:f51d:9a65:5fc2:4b87]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by tools.si6networks.com (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id C1BE83FFFD; Thu, 23 Jul 2020 12:35:43 +0200 (CEST)
To: adrian@olddog.co.uk, 'Michael Richardson' <mcr+ietf@sandelman.ca>, gendispatch@ietf.org, draft-carpenter-gendispatch-draft-adoption@ietf.org
References: <031601d65fb0$f6aa0a30$e3fe1e90$@olddog.co.uk> <22930.1595383098@localhost> <036b01d66003$b2cc4c30$1864e490$@olddog.co.uk>
From: Fernando Gont <fernando@gont.com.ar>
Message-ID: <64b85c4a-dd2f-ed84-27f8-fbe77aa05b02@gont.com.ar>
Date: Thu, 23 Jul 2020 07:34:07 -0300
User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; Linux x86_64; rv:60.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/60.9.1
MIME-Version: 1.0
In-Reply-To: <036b01d66003$b2cc4c30$1864e490$@olddog.co.uk>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"; format="flowed"
Content-Language: en-US
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
Archived-At: <https://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/msg/gendispatch/MJK2eAtoM1MmjEl7GXEuHDRD9Gg>
Subject: Re: [Gendispatch] Thoughts on draft-carpenter-gendispatch-draft-adoption
X-BeenThere: gendispatch@ietf.org
X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29
Precedence: list
List-Id: General Area Dispatch <gendispatch.ietf.org>
List-Unsubscribe: <https://www.ietf.org/mailman/options/gendispatch>, <mailto:gendispatch-request@ietf.org?subject=unsubscribe>
List-Archive: <https://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/browse/gendispatch/>
List-Post: <mailto:gendispatch@ietf.org>
List-Help: <mailto:gendispatch-request@ietf.org?subject=help>
List-Subscribe: <https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/gendispatch>, <mailto:gendispatch-request@ietf.org?subject=subscribe>
X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 23 Jul 2020 10:35:51 -0000

On 22/7/20 05:40, Adrian Farrel wrote:
> Michael,
> 
> I think what you are saying (or what we should agree upon) is that different
> WGs run their work differently. It would be a shame, IMHO, to mandate the
> micromanagement of WGs to this level. IOW, sometimes the draft would get
> implicitly adopted, sometimes the chairs would adopted it by fiat, sometimes
> the WG would discuss it before adoption: leave it up to the chairs to decide
> how to run each situation with different DTs in different WGs.

I don't think the intent is to micro-manage, but rather to set 
constraints, and establish a common ground.

Recently I have seen the following as part of adoption calls:

* Folks arguing support/not support with a different understanding of 
what adoption actually means

* Chairs rejecting to do a wg call for adoption as a result of the 
personal opinion about a document

* Documents being adopted without a consensus call on the mailing list 
(and no previous action item in the charter or anything)

...and quite a few others.


Yes, when everything works as expected, it might seem that specifying 
stuff is unnecessary or even undesirable. But in other cases, it may 
become evident why not setting a common-ground, common expectations, and 
constraints within which the wg needs to operate becomes evident.


Thanks,
-- 
Fernando Gont
e-mail: fernando@gont.com.ar || fgont@si6networks.com
PGP Fingerprint: 7809 84F5 322E 45C7 F1C9 3945 96EE A9EF D076 FFF1