Re: [hybi] how do we move forward on agreeing on framing?
Dave Cridland <dave@cridland.net> Thu, 19 August 2010 21:44 UTC
Return-Path: <dave@cridland.net>
X-Original-To: hybi@core3.amsl.com
Delivered-To: hybi@core3.amsl.com
Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3A7823A6988 for <hybi@core3.amsl.com>; Thu, 19 Aug 2010 14:44:05 -0700 (PDT)
X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com
X-Spam-Flag: NO
X-Spam-Score: -2.504
X-Spam-Level:
X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.504 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=0.095, BAYES_00=-2.599]
Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id M4KAofd6dwse for <hybi@core3.amsl.com>; Thu, 19 Aug 2010 14:44:03 -0700 (PDT)
Received: from peirce.dave.cridland.net (peirce.dave.cridland.net [217.155.137.61]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 8F04A3A680B for <hybi@ietf.org>; Thu, 19 Aug 2010 14:44:02 -0700 (PDT)
Received: from localhost (localhost.localdomain [127.0.0.1]) by peirce.dave.cridland.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id E351D116809F; Thu, 19 Aug 2010 22:44:36 +0100 (BST)
X-Virus-Scanned: Debian amavisd-new at peirce.dave.cridland.net
Received: from peirce.dave.cridland.net ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (localhost.localdomain [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id m28cUtIJ2EGs; Thu, 19 Aug 2010 22:44:35 +0100 (BST)
Received: from puncture (puncture [217.155.137.60]) by peirce.dave.cridland.net (Postfix) with ESMTPA id 79AEF116809E; Thu, 19 Aug 2010 22:44:35 +0100 (BST)
References: <AANLkTineuhvGsC_vca6AiAX8OmHdkE-7s7rA1DQtjtMm@mail.gmail.com> <1282231803.22142.649.camel@vulcan.aspl.local> <AANLkTim44=x0BRpF3BYMqS9GNzHA+icG818JgfRRaFPT@mail.gmail.com> <1282238100.22142.732.camel@vulcan.aspl.local> <AANLkTinst1+-iTjJXfBypoOjwc+QNdVt85QopdM9w4nZ@mail.gmail.com> <1282245566.10518.11.camel@tot.local>
In-Reply-To: <1282245566.10518.11.camel@tot.local>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Message-Id: <21036.1282254275.490198@puncture>
Date: Thu, 19 Aug 2010 22:44:35 +0100
From: Dave Cridland <dave@cridland.net>
To: Francis Brosnan Blazquez <francis@aspl.es>, Server-Initiated HTTP <hybi@ietf.org>, Roberto Peon <fenix@google.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; delsp="yes"; charset="iso-8859-1"; format="flowed"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit
Subject: Re: [hybi] how do we move forward on agreeing on framing?
X-BeenThere: hybi@ietf.org
X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9
Precedence: list
List-Id: Server-Initiated HTTP <hybi.ietf.org>
List-Unsubscribe: <https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/hybi>, <mailto:hybi-request@ietf.org?subject=unsubscribe>
List-Archive: <http://www.ietf.org/mail-archive/web/hybi>
List-Post: <mailto:hybi@ietf.org>
List-Help: <mailto:hybi-request@ietf.org?subject=help>
List-Subscribe: <https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/hybi>, <mailto:hybi-request@ietf.org?subject=subscribe>
X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 19 Aug 2010 21:44:05 -0000
On Thu Aug 19 20:19:26 2010, Francis Brosnan Blázquez wrote: > Hi Roberto, > > > I don't think that is the case since I'm likely to have to > > load-balance millions or billions of connections and not have the > > ability to modify or place interesting requirements on the servers > > while remaining competitive. > > While I see interesting the case you are exposing (zillions of > connections), it does not make it a representative case at all. As > you > know, good protocol design is based on function delegation: each > layer > makes a particular defined function. > > Actually, good protocol design is about making stuff that works. Anything else is very much a secondary consideration, and while certain principles are useful, the one I'm most concerned with is the end-to-end principle, which (loosely) states that you minimize the amount of smarts in intermediaries, and force complexity to the ends. > I still believe WS should focus more on transport features and let > application protocols on top of it to complete the work.... > > ...because it will be always better than any solution worked by the > WG. > In other words: let the people to choose what to place on top of WS. No, because it means that intermediaries need to work higher up the stack in order to do things like multiplexing and refragmentation, both of which are very low-level tasks. Dave. -- Dave Cridland - mailto:dave@cridland.net - xmpp:dwd@dave.cridland.net - acap://acap.dave.cridland.net/byowner/user/dwd/bookmarks/ - http://dave.cridland.net/ Infotrope Polymer - ACAP, IMAP, ESMTP, and Lemonade
- [hybi] how do we move forward on agreeing on fram… John Tamplin
- Re: [hybi] how do we move forward on agreeing on … Dave Cridland
- Re: [hybi] how do we move forward on agreeing on … Ian Fette (イアンフェッティ)
- Re: [hybi] how do we move forward on agreeing on … Francis Brosnan Blazquez
- Re: [hybi] how do we move forward on agreeing on … Roberto Peon
- Re: [hybi] how do we move forward on agreeing on … John Tamplin
- Re: [hybi] how do we move forward on agreeing on … John Tamplin
- Re: [hybi] how do we move forward on agreeing on … gustav trede
- Re: [hybi] how do we move forward on agreeing on … Francis Brosnan Blazquez
- Re: [hybi] how do we move forward on agreeing on … John Tamplin
- Re: [hybi] how do we move forward on agreeing on … Francis Brosnan Blazquez
- Re: [hybi] how do we move forward on agreeing on … Roberto Peon
- Re: [hybi] how do we move forward on agreeing on … Shelby Moore
- Re: [hybi] how do we move forward on agreeing on … gustav trede
- Re: [hybi] how do we move forward on agreeing on … Francis Brosnan Blázquez
- Re: [hybi] how do we move forward on agreeing on … Roberto Peon
- Re: [hybi] how do we move forward on agreeing on … Dave Cridland
- Re: [hybi] how do we move forward on agreeing on … Shelby Moore
- Re: [hybi] how do we move forward on agreeing on … Shelby Moore
- Re: [hybi] how do we move forward on agreeing on … Patrick McManus
- Re: [hybi] how do we move forward on agreeing on … Francis Brosnan Blazquez
- Re: [hybi] how do we move forward on agreeing on … Roberto Peon
- Re: [hybi] how do we move forward on agreeing on … Shelby Moore
- Re: [hybi] how do we move forward on agreeing on … Shelby Moore