Re: [IETF] DMARC methods in mailman

Dave Crocker <dhc@dcrocker.net> Tue, 27 December 2016 18:24 UTC

Return-Path: <dhc@dcrocker.net>
X-Original-To: ietf@ietfa.amsl.com
Delivered-To: ietf@ietfa.amsl.com
Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3603B1294D5 for <ietf@ietfa.amsl.com>; Tue, 27 Dec 2016 10:24:17 -0800 (PST)
X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com
X-Spam-Flag: NO
X-Spam-Score: -2.002
X-Spam-Level:
X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.002 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, SPF_HELO_PASS=-0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no
Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (1024-bit key) header.d=dcrocker.net
Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id 99DHMblCOfMd for <ietf@ietfa.amsl.com>; Tue, 27 Dec 2016 10:24:16 -0800 (PST)
Received: from simon.songbird.com (simon.songbird.com [72.52.113.5]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 4A5D11294C0 for <ietf@ietf.org>; Tue, 27 Dec 2016 10:24:16 -0800 (PST)
Received: from [192.168.1.168] (76-218-8-128.lightspeed.sntcca.sbcglobal.net [76.218.8.128]) (authenticated bits=0) by simon.songbird.com (8.14.4/8.14.4/Debian-4.1ubuntu1) with ESMTP id uBRIPWwv032611 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=AES256-GCM-SHA384 bits=256 verify=NOT) for <ietf@ietf.org>; Tue, 27 Dec 2016 10:25:32 -0800
DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=simple/simple; d=dcrocker.net; s=default; t=1482863132; bh=wZIl9XfHDadi7pw5kl80ZB5aTfVSghPXtQB8H5JaHpA=; h=Subject:References:To:Reply-To:From:Date:In-Reply-To:From; b=Vo9dFgIb3HuZ8zIJrW2hT0nolbdX+Gdij7UhofQp/uehh+dO+ELuKhe9of/PZ5+vU 5+nqQiHQ4yi2vlBndalfR2s8OV872jm0xvNwb+Vvp9wGRZXF9XcdNdI5mF4xNWVV11 bUpSoijG6K0qFL+DddMP1SFXf0dVyePHWDWnPl1Q=
Subject: Re: [IETF] DMARC methods in mailman
References: <20161227013401.11378.qmail@ary.lan> <A2F8894E-C983-42F2-9EB9-3E7032615F86@dukhovni.org> <20161227161045.ntov3e3mqvoorn7i@thunk.org> <E663971D38069E9EA13A5072@JcK-HP5.jck.com>
To: IETF general list <ietf@ietf.org>
From: Dave Crocker <dhc@dcrocker.net>
Organization: Brandenburg InternetWorking
Message-ID: <1a3008f4-0037-d35d-2453-c593e426b2f3@dcrocker.net>
Date: Tue, 27 Dec 2016 10:24:04 -0800
User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows NT 10.0; WOW64; rv:45.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/45.5.1
MIME-Version: 1.0
In-Reply-To: <E663971D38069E9EA13A5072@JcK-HP5.jck.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=windows-1252; format=flowed
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
Archived-At: <https://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/msg/ietf/BqWBBqBr6idxQfdcmnly3gZIwvk>
X-BeenThere: ietf@ietf.org
X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.17
Precedence: list
Reply-To: dcrocker@bbiw.net
List-Id: IETF-Discussion <ietf.ietf.org>
List-Unsubscribe: <https://www.ietf.org/mailman/options/ietf>, <mailto:ietf-request@ietf.org?subject=unsubscribe>
List-Archive: <https://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/browse/ietf/>
List-Post: <mailto:ietf@ietf.org>
List-Help: <mailto:ietf-request@ietf.org?subject=help>
List-Subscribe: <https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ietf>, <mailto:ietf-request@ietf.org?subject=subscribe>
X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 27 Dec 2016 18:24:17 -0000

> When a technique is invented that we
> know how to break or get around and then use it to attack a
> problem in the hope that the bad guys are too dumb (or just
> won't bother) to develop and apply the workarounds, we create a
> few additional problems.


Except that none of the anti-abuse efforts being used at scale are 
predicated on any such assumptions or logic.

That logic is, therefore, a strawman serving to distract from serious 
discussion.


d/
-- 

   Dave Crocker
   Brandenburg InternetWorking
   bbiw.net