Re: [IETF] DMARC methods in mailman

Dave Crocker <> Tue, 27 December 2016 19:47 UTC

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Subject: Re: [IETF] DMARC methods in mailman
To: IETF general list <>
References: <> <20161227013401.11378.qmail@ary.lan> <03e401d25fe5$5f32a5f0$1d97f1d0$> <> <000201d26070$248a9030$6d9fb090$> <> <>
From: Dave Crocker <>
Organization: Brandenburg InternetWorking
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Date: Tue, 27 Dec 2016 11:47:05 -0800
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On 12/27/2016 11:02 AM, Viktor Dukhovni wrote:
> If "Sender + From" are displayed as in Outlook, then it becomes reasonable
> to authenticate Sender when present, and not apply authentication policy
> to "From", since the message is not in fact *from* the author.  It is from
> the sender, (purportedly) on behalf of the author.
> It is rather implausible that phishers will want to present their messages
> this way (on behalf of), most users don't receive such email, and it will
> stand out as unexpected.  And users who still believe such messages to be
> legitimately *from* the purported author and fall victim to scams will fall
> for a myriad other misdirections.

All of the above is language cast in terms of end-users.  In the absence 
of extremely careful and constrained and informed reference, discussion 
of phishing needs to completely avoid references to end-users.

Really.  Just stop.  Everyone.

End-users are essentially irrelevant to the formalized detection and 
handling of phishing.



   Dave Crocker
   Brandenburg InternetWorking