Re: [Technical Errata Reported] RFC5458 (1746)
Gorry Fairhurst <gorry@erg.abdn.ac.uk> Wed, 29 April 2009 15:23 UTC
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Date: Wed, 29 Apr 2009 15:50:25 +0100
From: Gorry Fairhurst <gorry@erg.abdn.ac.uk>
Organization: School of Engineering, University of Aberdeen, Scotland
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Subject: Re: [Technical Errata Reported] RFC5458 (1746)
References: <200903300724.n2U7Ocpx010767@boreas.isi.edu> <225B6337E699484095DA8EE02A5063B57983F1@EVS-EC1-NODE1.surrey.ac.uk> <71C9EC0544D1F64D8B7D91EDCC6220200320E6B3@NABSREX027324.NAB.ORG> <49F7F798.8070309@erg.abdn.ac.uk> <71C9EC0544D1F64D8B7D91EDCC6220200320E732@NABSREX027324.NAB.ORG>
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Noted, but it is not possible to delete lines from an RFC, we can make a public Errata statement if the protocol has a significant error or there is an ambiguity that will lead to implementation error, etc. Or we can make a note in the document database, that will be used when a new RFC is issued to replace this one. I suggested the latter. Gorry Allison, Art wrote: > The definition using the undefined term is "TS: Transport Stream > [ISO-MPEG2]." A method of > transmission at the MPEG-2 layer using TS Packets; it represents Layer 2 > of > the ISO/OSI reference model. See also TS Logical Channel and TS > Multiplex." > > Fixing this error by defining the term "TS logical channel' is indeed > difficult, but as it was only introduces as one of two 'see also' > references, fixing the definition by deletion seems appropriate as the > 'see also' only misleads. > So, I suggest the last sentence be changed to read "See also TS > Multiplex." > > This would remove the reference to an undefined term, and thereby > resolve the documentation issue. > > Art > Art Allison > > Senior Director Advanced Engineering, Science and Technology > > National Association of Broadcasters > 1771 N Street NW > Washington, DC 20036 > Phone 202 429 5418 > Fax 202 775 4981 > www.nab.org > > Advocacy Education Innovation > > > > > |-----Original Message----- > |From: owner-ipdvb@erg.abdn.ac.uk > |[mailto:owner-ipdvb@erg.abdn.ac.uk] On Behalf Of Gorry Fairhurst > |Sent: Wednesday, April 29, 2009 2:46 AM > |To: ipdvb@erg.abdn.ac.uk > |Cc: rfc-editor@rfc-editor.org; p.pillai@Bradford.ac.uk; > |mnoist@cosy.sbg.ac.at; sunil.iyengar@logica.com; > |rdroms@cisco.com; jari.arkko@piuha.net; ah@TR-Sys.de > |Subject: Re: [Technical Errata Reported] RFC5458 (1746) > | > |After looking at this reported Errata, I suggest there does > |seems to be a valid issue to note. My thoughts are that the > |term 'TS logical channel' has been used to describe a > |component of the TS multiplex, carried as an elementary stream > |(ES) over a MPEG-2 TS. This term was used to differentiate it > |from the term "stream" which is widely used in other IETF > |specs to describe something different. It is not a peer of 'TS > |multiplex'. > | > |Given the term is already defined in other RFCs that are > |cited, I suggest this is not likely to result in > |implementation errors in future protocols. I suggest the WG > |categorise this as "Hold for Document Update" - i.e. a future > |update of the document should consider this erratum when > |making the update. > | > |If anyone would like to add further comments, please send them > |to the list by 5th May 2009. After this date we will inform > |the RFC-Ed of a decision. > | > |Best wishes, > | > |Gorry Fairhurst > |IPDVB Chair > | > |Allison, Art wrote: > |> It is simply dead wrong to use TS logical channel in relation to > |> defining a Transport Stream. > |> The errata should delete the term TS logical channel, not define it > |> as it only misleads and propagates misunderstanding. > |> > |> The term 'TS logical channel' is not a peer of 'TS > |multiplex', it is > |> a component of the TS multiplex. > |> > |> A MPEG-2 Transport Stream is a multiplex consisting of a > |collection of > |> elementary streams in 188-byte packets each stream having a Packet > |> IDentifier (PID). > |> > |> I attempted to inform authors of RFC4326 of the poor construction at > |> the time, but the inventors of the term had more time and > |used it very > |> very narrowly so it was no longer dead wrong use, at which point my > |> budget to support this work was exhausted. > |> > |> I do have time to educate and advocate better resolution of this > |> errata; but for accurate usage of PID and transport stream > |see ISO/ITU > |> 13818-1, not later attempts to 'clarify' those terms by those not > |> expert in > |> MPEG-2 Systems. > |> > |> Art > |> Art Allison > |> > |> Director Advanced Engineering, Science and Technology > |> > |> National Association of Broadcasters > |> 1771 N Street NW > |> Washington, DC 20036 > |> Phone 202 429 5418 > |> Fax 202 775 4981 > |> www.nab.org > |> > |> Advocacy Education Innovation > |> > |> > |> > |> > |> > |> > |> |-----Original Message----- > |> |From: owner-ipdvb@erg.abdn.ac.uk > |> |[mailto:owner-ipdvb@erg.abdn.ac.uk] On Behalf Of > |> |H.Cruickshank@surrey.ac.uk > |> |Sent: Tuesday, April 07, 2009 11:47 AM > |> |To: rfc-editor@rfc-editor.org; p.pillai@Bradford.ac.uk; > |> |mnoist@cosy.sbg.ac.at; sunil.iyengar@logica.com; rdroms@cisco.com; > |> |jari.arkko@piuha.net; townsley@cisco.com; gorry@erg.abdn.ac.uk > |> |Cc: ah@TR-Sys.de; ipdvb@erg.abdn.ac.uk > |> |Subject: RE: [Technical Errata Reported] RFC5458 (1746) > |> | > |> | > |> | Hi again, > |> | > |> |I suggest to add the the TS Logical Channel definition (taken from > |> |RFC 4326). So here is the proposed text: > |> | > |> |********************************************* > |> | > |> |TS Logical Channel: Transport Stream Logical Channel. In this > |> |document, this term identifies a channel at the MPEG-2 level > |> |[ISO-MPEG2]. It exists at level 2 of the ISO/OSI reference > |model. All > |> |packets sent over a TS Logical Channel carry the same PID > |value (this > |> |value is unique within a specific TS Multiplex). The term > |"Stream" is > |> |defined in MPEG-2 [ISO-MPEG2] to describe the content carried by a > |> |specific TS Logical Channel (see ULE Stream). Some PID values are > |> |reserved (by > |> |MPEG-2) for specific signalling. Other standards (e.g., ATSC, > |> |DVB) also reserve specific PID values. > |> | > |> |********************************************** > |> | > |> | > |> |---- > |> |Dr. Haitham S. Cruickshank > |> |Lecturer > |> |Communications Centre for Communication Systems Research > |> |(CCSR) BA Building, Room E11 School of Electronics, Computing and > |> |Mathematics University of Surrey, Guildford, UK, GU2 7XH > |> | > |> |Tel: +44 1483 686007 (indirect 689844) > |> |Fax: +44 1483 686011 > |> |e-mail: H.Cruickshank@surrey.ac.uk > |> |http://www.ee.surrey.ac.uk/Personal/H.Cruickshank/ > |> | > |> |-----Original Message----- > |> |From: RFC Errata System [mailto:rfc-editor@rfc-editor.org] > |> |Sent: 30 March 2009 08:25 > |> |To: Cruickshank HS Dr (CCSR); p.pillai@bradford.ac.uk; > |> |mnoist@cosy.sbg.ac.at; sunil.iyengar@logica.com; rdroms@cisco.com; > |> |jari.arkko@piuha.net; townsley@cisco.com; gorry@erg.abdn.ac.uk > |> |Cc: ah@TR-Sys.de; ipdvb@erg.abdn.ac.uk; rfc-editor@rfc-editor.org > |> |Subject: [Technical Errata Reported] RFC5458 (1746) > |> | > |> | > |> |The following errata report has been submitted for RFC5458, > |"Security > |> |Requirements for the Unidirectional Lightweight Encapsulation (ULE) > |> |Protocol". > |> | > |> |-------------------------------------- > |> |You may review the report below and at: > |> |http://www.rfc-editor.org/errata_search.php?rfc=5458&eid=1746 > |> | > |> |-------------------------------------- > |> |Type: Technical > |> |Reported by: Alfred Hoenes <ah@TR-Sys.de> > |> | > |> |Section: 2 > |> | > |> |Original Text > |> |------------- > |> |[[ at the bottom of page 5 / top of page 6 ]] > |> | > |> | TS: Transport Stream [ISO-MPEG2]. A method of > |transmission at the > |> | MPEG-2 layer using TS Packets; it represents Layer 2 of > |the ISO/OSI > |> | reference model. See also TS Logical Channel and TS Multiplex. > |> | ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ > |> | > |> |<< page break >> > |> | > |> | TS Multiplex: In this document, ... > |> | > |> | > |> | > |> |Corrected Text > |> |-------------- > |> | TS: Transport Stream [ISO-MPEG2]. A method of > |transmission at the > |> | MPEG-2 layer using TS Packets; it represents Layer 2 of > |the ISO/OSI > |> | reference model. See also TS Logical Channel and TS Multiplex. > |> || > |> || TS Logical Channel: ... << to be filled in >> > |> || ... > |> | > |> | TS Multiplex: In this document, ... > |> | > |> | > |> | > |> | > |> |Notes > |> |----- > |> |The quoted keyword explanation for "TS Logical Channel" > |> |is missing in Section 2. > |> | > |> |Authors/Verifiers: > |> | Please restore the entry and fill in the missing Corrected Text. > |> | > |> |Instructions: > |> |------------- > |> |This errata is currently posted as "Reported". If > |necessary, please use > |> |"Reply All" to discuss whether it should be verified or > |> |rejected. When a > |> |decision is reached, the verifying party (IESG) can log in to > |> |change the > |> |status and edit the report, if necessary. > |> | > |> |-------------------------------------- > |> |RFC5458 (draft-ietf-ipdvb-sec-req-09) > |> |-------------------------------------- > |> |Title : Security Requirements for the Unidirectional > |> |Lightweight Encapsulation (ULE) Protocol > |> |Publication Date : March 2009 > |> |Author(s) : H. Cruickshank, P. Pillai, M. Noisternig, S. > |> |Iyengar > |> |Category : INFORMATIONAL > |> |Source : IP over DVB > |> |Area : Internet > |> |Stream : IETF > |> |Verifying Party : IESG > |> | > |> | > |> > |> > | > | > | > >
- RE: [Technical Errata Reported] RFC5458 (1746) H.Cruickshank
- RE: [Technical Errata Reported] RFC5458 (1746) Allison, Art
- Re: [Technical Errata Reported] RFC5458 (1746) Gorry Fairhurst
- RE: [Technical Errata Reported] RFC5458 (1746) Allison, Art
- Re: [Technical Errata Reported] RFC5458 (1746) Gorry Fairhurst
- RE: [Technical Errata Reported] RFC5458 (1746) H.Cruickshank
- RE: [Technical Errata Reported] RFC5458 (1746) Allison, Art
- Re: [Technical Errata Reported] RFC5458 (1746) Gorry Fairhurst
- Re: [Technical Errata Reported] RFC5458 (1746) Marie-Jose Montpetit