RE: New Version Notification for draft-jiang-l2vpn-evpn-etree-2vlan-00.txt
Jiangyuanlong <jiangyuanlong@huawei.com> Wed, 26 September 2012 09:32 UTC
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From: Jiangyuanlong <jiangyuanlong@huawei.com>
To: "Ali Sajassi (sajassi)" <sajassi@cisco.com>, "UTTARO, JAMES" <ju1738@att.com>, "'Rogers, Josh'" <josh.rogers@twcable.com>, Aldrin Isaac <aldrin.isaac@gmail.com>, Giles Heron <giles.heron@gmail.com>
Subject: RE: New Version Notification for draft-jiang-l2vpn-evpn-etree-2vlan-00.txt
Thread-Topic: New Version Notification for draft-jiang-l2vpn-evpn-etree-2vlan-00.txt
Thread-Index: AQHNmq4pFVANLlv0RU6/0DirrqUYkJeanNRAgAEEFYCAALLAoA==
Date: Wed, 26 Sep 2012 09:31:00 +0000
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Ali, On the one hand, you said E-VPN solution doesn't have the limitation of data-plane forwarding and inherently support E-Tree, on the other hand, you agreed that 2 labels are introduced specially for E-Tree for these two cases. Furthermore, forwarding behaviors for these two labels are different (for root label, split horizon + forward to both root & leaf ports; for leaf label, split horizon + forward only to leaf ports) from the E-VPN itself (split horizon only). But my main concern is whether OAM is needed for E-VPN, if yes, how it can be implemented in practical? Regards, Yuanlong -----Original Message----- From: Ali Sajassi (sajassi) [mailto:sajassi@cisco.com] Sent: Wednesday, September 26, 2012 2:15 PM To: Jiangyuanlong; UTTARO, JAMES; 'Rogers, Josh'; Aldrin Isaac; Giles Heron Cc: l2vpn@ietf.org Subject: Re: New Version Notification for draft-jiang-l2vpn-evpn-etree-2vlan-00.txt Hi Yuanlong, If one understood the operation of SH filtering in E-VPN, he would have seen that it exactly covers both of these cases that are mentioned below. Also, E-VPN allows for policy-based forwarding on a per MAC basis without scale issue. As I said previously, I won't be able to provide E-VPN tutorial over the email. Cheers, Ali On 9/25/12 12:02 AM, "Jiangyuanlong" <jiangyuanlong@huawei.com> wrote: >Hi all, > >I don't think E-VPN control plane can solve all the problem of E-Tree. >For the following two scenarios data plane indication of E-Tree is needed: >1. Per EVI label is assigned, and there are multiple PEs with both Leaf >AND Root sites; >2. Per <ESI, Ethernet Tag> label is assigned, and there are multiple >Ethernet segments with both Leaf AND Root sites; >Using 2 labels (EVI MPLS label or ESI MPLS label respectively) is an >option, but maybe OAM is a challenge. > >Assigning label per MAC for E-Tree will not need this indication, but at >expense of scalability. > >Regards, >Yuanlong > > >-----Original Message----- >From: Ali Sajassi (sajassi) [mailto:sajassi@cisco.com] >Sent: Tuesday, September 25, 2012 7:42 AM >To: UTTARO, JAMES; 'Rogers, Josh'; Aldrin Isaac; Giles Heron >Cc: l2vpn@ietf.org; Jiangyuanlong >Subject: Re: New Version Notification for >draft-jiang-l2vpn-evpn-etree-2vlan-00.txt > > >Jim, Aldrin, Josh: > >You guys are spot on. E-VPN solution doesn't have the limitation of >data-plane forwarding that VPLS has and as such it doesn't need addition >vlan-tag to solve root/leaf indication issue as it can be supported >inherently by the solution. > >Cheers, >Ali > >On 9/22/12 4:34 PM, "UTTARO, JAMES" <ju1738@att.com> wrote: > >>Josh, >> >> Yes.. I think that is the reality of it.. VPLS either the LDP or BGP >>variety uses data plane learning as the mechanism to "learn".. The fact >>that we extend the L2 footprint via these "tunnels" does not change that >>fact.. SO in VPLS the only hammer you have is the data plane, so one must >>manipulate bits on the wire to infer topology ( Limited set of topology >>).. >> >>Another challenge is when roots and leafs "land" on the same PE. >> >>EVPN is intended to use contexts and associated import/export to manage >>the topology.. So here there is a set of tools to create the desired >>topologies, along with that there other mechanisms realized i.e >>active/active... >> >>Jim Uttaro >> >>-----Original Message----- >>From: l2vpn-bounces@ietf.org [mailto:l2vpn-bounces@ietf.org] On Behalf Of >>Rogers, Josh >>Sent: Saturday, September 22, 2012 7:03 PM >>To: UTTARO, JAMES; Aldrin Isaac; Giles Heron >>Cc: l2vpn@ietf.org; Jiangyuanlong >>Subject: Re: New Version Notification for >>draft-jiang-l2vpn-evpn-etree-2vlan-00.txt >> >>I agree. >> >>Would it be safe to state that VPLS has a need for a 'etree solution', >>but >>EVPN does not, because it is inherently supported? >> >>The previously discussed effort of having a 'single etree solution' for >>both VPLS and EVPN may not really be valid due to this. >> >>In fact, I do not think it is valid to ask for a single solution, EVPN >>doesn't have a problem that needs to be fixed here, I don't believe it >>factors into this discussion. >> >>-Josh >> >> >>On 9/22/12 4:56 PM, "UTTARO, JAMES" <ju1738@att.com> wrote: >> >>>EVPN is intended to maximize the flexibility of multiple routing >>>contexts >>>with arbitrary topologies.. As I have stated in the past, EVPN allows >>>for >>>E-Tree to be constructed in the control plane, other solutions require >>>some method to interrogate data and infer topology. IMO this is not >>>desirable. >>> >>>Jim Uttaro >>> >>>-----Original Message----- >>>From: l2vpn-bounces@ietf.org [mailto:l2vpn-bounces@ietf.org] On Behalf >>>Of >>>Rogers, Josh >>>Sent: Saturday, September 22, 2012 12:49 PM >>>To: Aldrin Isaac; Giles Heron >>>Cc: l2vpn@ietf.org; Jiangyuanlong >>>Subject: Re: New Version Notification for >>>draft-jiang-l2vpn-evpn-etree-2vlan-00.txt >>> >>>So, this same sort of 'import/export' of targets is possible using >>>BGP-VPLS today, but it faces limitations outlined in >>>draft-ietf-l2vpn-etree-frwk, in section 2. E-VPN would be able to >>>import/export by attachment circuit, and not by PE? Meaning, AC1 one >>>PE1 >>>may import RTA, while AC2 on PE2 may import RTB? >>> >>>Its occurred to me that EVPN would be able to use other mechanisms that >>>have not yet been discussed yet due to sharing a mac table over BGP. >>> >>>Thanks for the response, >>>Josh >>> >>> >>>On 9/22/12 10:28 AM, "Aldrin Isaac" <aldrin.isaac@gmail.com> wrote: >>> >>>>In E-VPN an E-tree would be implemented as a hub-and-spoke VPN (like as >>>>in a hub-and-spoke IPVPN, i.e. import RTA export RTB at hubs, import >>>>RTB >>>>export RTA at spokes) with filtering to enforce downstream data flow if >>>>desired. The tree could be built using PIM, mLDP, RSVP, etc. >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>>On Sep 21, 2012, at 9:09 AM, Giles Heron wrote: >>>> >>>>> Thanks Yuanlong, >>>>> >>>>> however I must say that your memory of the IETF 84 L2VPN meeting >>>>>differs from mine (and from what is noted in the minutes). Whilst >>>>>Himanshu said that it was better to have the same solution for VPLS >>>>>and >>>>>E-VPN, Ali stated that there was no benefit in the E-VPN case in using >>>>>an additional tag (such as a VLAN). No consensus was reached in the >>>>>meeting. >>>>> >>>>> Giles >>>>> >>>>> On 21 Sep 2012, at 10:16, Jiangyuanlong <jiangyuanlong@huawei.com> >>>>>wrote: >>>>> >>>>>> Hi all, >>>>>> >>>>>> During the 84th IETF meeting, the group discussed the issue of >>>>>>E-Tree >>>>>>in E-VPN, and it was shown that a single solution was more preferred >>>>>>than two different approaches for VPLS and E-VPN. >>>>>> This I-D probes how the 2VLAN approach can be used to support E-Tree >>>>>>in E-VPN and it seems not a big issue. >>>>>> Any comments from you are greatly appreciated. >>>>>> >>>>>> Best regards, >>>>>> Yuanlong >>>>>> >>>>>> -----Original Message----- >>>>>> From: internet-drafts@ietf.org [mailto:internet-drafts@ietf.org] >>>>>> Sent: Friday, September 21, 2012 4:55 PM >>>>>> To: Jiangyuanlong >>>>>> Subject: New Version Notification for >>>>>>draft-jiang-l2vpn-evpn-etree-2vlan-00.txt >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> A new version of I-D, draft-jiang-l2vpn-evpn-etree-2vlan-00.txt >>>>>> has been successfully submitted by Yuanlong Jiang and posted to the >>>>>> IETF repository. >>>>>> >>>>>> Filename: draft-jiang-l2vpn-evpn-etree-2vlan >>>>>> Revision: 00 >>>>>> Title: E-Tree Support with 2VLAN in E-VPN >>>>>> Creation date: 2012-09-21 >>>>>> WG ID: Individual Submission >>>>>> Number of pages: 6 >>>>>> URL: >>>>>>http://www.ietf.org/internet-drafts/draft-jiang-l2vpn-evpn-etree-2vla >>>>>>n >>>>>>- >>>>>>0 >>>>>>0.txt >>>>>> Status: >>>>>>http://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-jiang-l2vpn-evpn-etree-2vlan >>>>>> Htmlized: >>>>>>http://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-jiang-l2vpn-evpn-etree-2vlan-00 >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> Abstract: >>>>>> This document discusses how the Dual-VLAN approach as described in >>>>>> [Etree-vlan] can be used to support the transport of E-Tree service >>>>>> in E-VPN. Thus a single convergent solution is possible for both >>>>>>VPLS >>>>>> and E-VPN. >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> The IETF Secretariat >>>>>> >>>>> >>>> >>> >>> >>>This E-mail and any of its attachments may contain Time Warner Cable >>>proprietary information, which is privileged, confidential, or subject >>>to >>>copyright belonging to Time Warner Cable. This E-mail is intended solely >>>for the use of the individual or entity to which it is addressed. If you >>>are not the intended recipient of this E-mail, you are hereby notified >>>that any dissemination, distribution, copying, or action taken in >>>relation to the contents of and attachments to this E-mail is strictly >>>prohibited and may be unlawful. If you have received this E-mail in >>>error, please notify the sender immediately and permanently delete the >>>original and any copy of this E-mail and any printout. >> >> >>This E-mail and any of its attachments may contain Time Warner Cable >>proprietary information, which is privileged, confidential, or subject to >>copyright belonging to Time Warner Cable. This E-mail is intended solely >>for the use of the individual or entity to which it is addressed. If you >>are not the intended recipient of this E-mail, you are hereby notified >>that any dissemination, distribution, copying, or action taken in >>relation to the contents of and attachments to this E-mail is strictly >>prohibited and may be unlawful. If you have received this E-mail in >>error, please notify the sender immediately and permanently delete the >>original and any copy of this E-mail and any printout. >
- FW: New Version Notification for draft-jiang-l2vp… Jiangyuanlong
- Re: New Version Notification for draft-jiang-l2vp… Giles Heron
- RE: New Version Notification for draft-jiang-l2vp… Jiangyuanlong
- Re: New Version Notification for draft-jiang-l2vp… Aldrin Isaac
- Re: New Version Notification for draft-jiang-l2vp… Rogers, Josh
- Re: FW: New Version Notification for draft-jiang-… Aldrin Isaac
- Re: New Version Notification for draft-jiang-l2vp… Rogers, Josh
- RE: New Version Notification for draft-jiang-l2vp… UTTARO, JAMES
- Re: New Version Notification for draft-jiang-l2vp… Rogers, Josh
- RE: New Version Notification for draft-jiang-l2vp… UTTARO, JAMES
- RE: New Version Notification for draft-jiang-l2vp… Alexander Vainshtein
- Re: FW: New Version Notification for draft-jiang-… Aldrin Isaac
- RE: New Version Notification for draft-jiang-l2vp… Jiangyuanlong
- RE: FW: New Version Notification for draft-jiang-… Jiangyuanlong
- Re: FW: New Version Notification for draft-jiang-… Aldrin Isaac
- RE: New Version Notification for draft-jiang-l2vp… Alexander Vainshtein
- RE: FW: New Version Notification for draft-jiang-… Jiangyuanlong
- RE: New Version Notification for draft-jiang-l2vp… Jiangyuanlong
- RE: New Version Notification for draft-jiang-l2vp… Alexander Vainshtein
- RE: New Version Notification for draft-jiang-l2vp… Jiangyuanlong
- RE: New Version Notification for draft-jiang-l2vp… Alexander Vainshtein
- RE: New Version Notification for draft-jiang-l2vp… Jiangyuanlong
- RE: New Version Notification for draft-jiang-l2vp… Alexander Vainshtein
- RE: FW: New Version Notification for draft-jiang-… UTTARO, JAMES
- Re: New Version Notification for draft-jiang-l2vp… Ali Sajassi (sajassi)
- Re: New Version Notification for draft-jiang-l2vp… Ali Sajassi (sajassi)
- Re: New Version Notification for draft-jiang-l2vp… Ali Sajassi (sajassi)
- RE: New Version Notification for draft-jiang-l2vp… Jiangyuanlong
- RE: New Version Notification for draft-jiang-l2vp… Jiangyuanlong
- RE: New Version Notification for draft-jiang-l2vp… Alexander Vainshtein
- Re: New Version Notification for draft-jiang-l2vp… Ali Sajassi (sajassi)
- Re: New Version Notification for draft-jiang-l2vp… Ali Sajassi (sajassi)
- Re: New Version Notification for draft-jiang-l2vp… Ali Sajassi (sajassi)
- RE: New Version Notification for draft-jiang-l2vp… Jiangyuanlong
- RE: New Version Notification for draft-jiang-l2vp… Alexander Vainshtein
- Re: New Version Notification for draft-jiang-l2vp… Ali Sajassi (sajassi)
- Re: New Version Notification for draft-jiang-l2vp… Ali Sajassi (sajassi)
- RE: New Version Notification for draft-jiang-l2vp… UTTARO, JAMES
- RE: New Version Notification for draft-jiang-l2vp… Jiangyuanlong
- Re: New Version Notification for draft-jiang-l2vp… Ali Sajassi (sajassi)