Re: [MBONED] MBONED Digest, Vol 134, Issue 10

Tim Chown <Tim.Chown@jisc.ac.uk> Mon, 02 April 2018 06:59 UTC

Return-Path: <tim.chown@jisc.ac.uk>
X-Original-To: mboned@ietfa.amsl.com
Delivered-To: mboned@ietfa.amsl.com
Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 3AF88120726 for <mboned@ietfa.amsl.com>; Sun, 1 Apr 2018 23:59:14 -0700 (PDT)
X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com
X-Spam-Flag: NO
X-Spam-Score: -4.301
X-Spam-Level:
X-Spam-Status: No, score=-4.301 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-2.3, SPF_PASS=-0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no
Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (1024-bit key) header.d=jisc.ac.uk
Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id Ntv_zbwN7NVF for <mboned@ietfa.amsl.com>; Sun, 1 Apr 2018 23:59:11 -0700 (PDT)
Received: from eu-smtp-delivery-189.mimecast.com (eu-smtp-delivery-189.mimecast.com [207.82.80.189]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id DD038126C25 for <mboned@ietf.org>; Sun, 1 Apr 2018 23:59:10 -0700 (PDT)
DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=jisc.ac.uk; s=mimecast20170213; t=1522652349; h=from:subject:date:message-id:to:cc:mime-version:content-type:content-transfer-encoding:in-reply-to:references; bh=hI0vAtJ691pX4lv/ZPJIrdW6Rc/vMLpgPzI4sFxuU34=; b=YM1QbZotNr3ePciUIUiOIl7cgu7bAgHORQQkJYgxEhVUG4kzAhyq0L7ilxcueSJ114Kugge8l0zSlbz+fKmdoY5Eo2Abq7ySPtDZnswTKfTQrm6w6ye3FJs30LbcAxCYOUd306Nm71egRhI4S74786r8Dj+pNchBF0VEWwAQIrs=
Received: from EUR01-HE1-obe.outbound.protection.outlook.com (mail-he1eur01lp0212.outbound.protection.outlook.com [213.199.154.212]) (Using TLS) by eu-smtp-1.mimecast.com with ESMTP id uk-mta-120-t2seHGkvOIaqBwFB9LjBXA-1; Mon, 02 Apr 2018 07:59:05 +0100
Received: from VI1PR07MB0879.eurprd07.prod.outlook.com (10.161.108.21) by VI1PR07MB0816.eurprd07.prod.outlook.com (10.161.107.151) with Microsoft SMTP Server (version=TLS1_2, cipher=TLS_ECDHE_RSA_WITH_AES_256_GCM_SHA384) id 15.20.653.5; Mon, 2 Apr 2018 06:59:03 +0000
Received: from VI1PR07MB0879.eurprd07.prod.outlook.com ([fe80::4011:38b1:3ecf:4201]) by VI1PR07MB0879.eurprd07.prod.outlook.com ([fe80::4011:38b1:3ecf:4201%6]) with mapi id 15.20.0653.005; Mon, 2 Apr 2018 06:59:03 +0000
From: Tim Chown <Tim.Chown@jisc.ac.uk>
To: "James A. (Jim) Stevens" <james.a.stevens@rockwellcollins.com>
CC: Toerless Eckert <tte@cs.fau.de>, "mboned@ietf.org" <mboned@ietf.org>
Thread-Topic: [MBONED] MBONED Digest, Vol 134, Issue 10
Thread-Index: AQHTyJ8bhQiy/ORy6kuQwA26EJMFZ6Pr4nqAgAEDIwCAAClJAA==
Date: Mon, 02 Apr 2018 06:59:03 +0000
Message-ID: <BEEE70F3-AD25-40E0-AFCB-F23C8C2E68E0@jisc.ac.uk>
References: <mailman.5.1522436416.18425.mboned@ietf.org> <CAH8Jh6Ba7Qo7Em1Y9O-jpyNpEfnbCQ6u_OwC0zXemSTPpEtkCA@mail.gmail.com> <20180401130343.GA28411@faui40p.informatik.uni-erlangen.de> <CAH8Jh6BOT8cmirE1eWt5U-YxV9i7-sMAyD5FgGzMt7eOJpOj_Q@mail.gmail.com>
In-Reply-To: <CAH8Jh6BOT8cmirE1eWt5U-YxV9i7-sMAyD5FgGzMt7eOJpOj_Q@mail.gmail.com>
Accept-Language: en-GB, en-US
Content-Language: en-US
X-MS-Has-Attach:
X-MS-TNEF-Correlator:
x-mailer: Apple Mail (2.3445.5.20)
x-originating-ip: [2001:a88:d510:1101:6c96:d1ee:a35c:6f32]
x-ms-publictraffictype: Email
x-microsoft-exchange-diagnostics: 1; VI1PR07MB0816; 7:bnQtgyFJw6lNI1cB6YVazckSHjyvfPA3FbXDdt7/VPkdWd37vhzna2DLRZU7wbGlxGVYToPce/kR3rpM/mhhCuCiWgVMZqMQFxCi0NI+wcKbnwl3YUx8XaPLloMvPQe5+SYRzTScJgEQu0TqGPHQ0Cj+cYw6VCCUNnk3BylYS8YvKtpijbhhbb/rEufjBZa5K8K93kVxwCi/p4zsUtvH/N0kqIswmRQPURyYrupIexqQZ652XA56DLkJBz3KlX+7; 20:Kuxwk70Wj+grUYE8xFBwEWEzNVnuJ+h28jA3HcJ2rMPc+ymU2NFzSUqjRYvqUuFs/NNihWFftH5okXqZ92evefi1qx/UonmTtXQdlrTeiWdvITFXqH0m9McWZLRscbsEzin6CzWXGbaPm/HG0raYcJDLVelMd6M6oeoiBtzWzNY=
x-ms-exchange-antispam-srfa-diagnostics: SOS;
x-ms-office365-filtering-correlation-id: 054ebdeb-117b-4ea4-f847-08d598673847
x-microsoft-antispam: UriScan:; BCL:0; PCL:0; RULEID:(7020095)(4652020)(5600026)(4604075)(3008032)(4534165)(4627221)(201703031133081)(201702281549075)(2017052603328)(7153060)(7193020); SRVR:VI1PR07MB0816;
x-ms-traffictypediagnostic: VI1PR07MB0816:
x-microsoft-antispam-prvs: <VI1PR07MB08168F1BABBB052697337D9BD6A60@VI1PR07MB0816.eurprd07.prod.outlook.com>
x-exchange-antispam-report-test: UriScan:(278428928389397);
x-exchange-antispam-report-cfa-test: BCL:0; PCL:0; RULEID:(6040522)(2401047)(8121501046)(5005006)(3002001)(93006095)(93001095)(10201501046)(3231221)(944501327)(52105095)(6041310)(201703131423095)(201702281529075)(201702281528075)(20161123555045)(201703061421075)(201703061406153)(20161123560045)(20161123564045)(20161123562045)(20161123558120)(6072148)(201708071742011); SRVR:VI1PR07MB0816; BCL:0; PCL:0; RULEID:; SRVR:VI1PR07MB0816;
x-forefront-prvs: 0630013541
x-forefront-antispam-report: SFV:NSPM; SFS:(10009020)(39380400002)(366004)(396003)(346002)(376002)(39840400004)(189003)(18543002)(199004)(5403001)(10533003)(3280700002)(97736004)(446003)(82746002)(186003)(3660700001)(6436002)(6486002)(54906003)(6116002)(57306001)(2906002)(25786009)(6916009)(4326008)(229853002)(476003)(86362001)(316002)(46003)(11346002)(786003)(478600001)(486005)(486005)(83716003)(2616005)(102836004)(53936002)(6346003)(6512007)(53546011)(2900100001)(72206003)(6306002)(76176011)(6506007)(7736002)(106356001)(6246003)(14454004)(966005)(105586002)(93886005)(5250100002)(68736007)(36756003)(50226002)(33656002)(305945005)(8936002)(8676002)(74482002)(81156014)(81166006)(99286004)(5660300001); DIR:OUT; SFP:1101; SCL:1; SRVR:VI1PR07MB0816; H:VI1PR07MB0879.eurprd07.prod.outlook.com; FPR:; SPF:None; LANG:en; PTR:InfoNoRecords; MX:1; A:1;
x-microsoft-antispam-message-info: lT5o7zeAd+rXBjBz4xYyXChE93wD9ALBo2CAlYbIvyg1vi9fRiQB4jd7k7V1MEfPmJ7K06CcurC8fbMfh9WqcMWPE7vu7ROvLJnJoqSBq+iMufJRUEeNEBZmUsJCc0dKsKfWzNHdjWl3SYTBxqWKhZn3VQXHgh5t+FM2mlMCl8D01Qo3YtyvklZ+Ugz2X3lxSkgRUbHkWbX7t+Ki+JCTje01OCj3xmaI0w9j3/R4R05z3u5dTvlDXUyQJglPywxNErJChKBhd4LfeUD6gz3P9MznrD2/6eRj3u/8zi1o5WhMqOQIcyd0DAKOVyksA+al7qorph4GekH5NbdDGYtmwRXWSoWfgfo0Do+YcYVcJfTbiMEbQcrNlpySgigd7YpTzElnSyslAeqRwBrmeRSX094RFJ2YAkCxotX+ORDItE0=
spamdiagnosticoutput: 1:99
spamdiagnosticmetadata: NSPM
Content-ID: <BE62C3E185388E4A96C16A16680CA0E8@eurprd07.prod.outlook.com>
MIME-Version: 1.0
X-OriginatorOrg: jisc.ac.uk
X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-Network-Message-Id: 054ebdeb-117b-4ea4-f847-08d598673847
X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-originalarrivaltime: 02 Apr 2018 06:59:03.4726 (UTC)
X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-fromentityheader: Hosted
X-MS-Exchange-CrossTenant-id: 48f9394d-8a14-4d27-82a6-f35f12361205
X-MS-Exchange-Transport-CrossTenantHeadersStamped: VI1PR07MB0816
X-MC-Unique: t2seHGkvOIaqBwFB9LjBXA-1
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: base64
Archived-At: <https://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/msg/mboned/FbH2Vo3A1F_00HlaExjTTUZaFwk>
Subject: Re: [MBONED] MBONED Digest, Vol 134, Issue 10
X-BeenThere: mboned@ietf.org
X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.22
Precedence: list
List-Id: Mail List for the Mboned Working Group <mboned.ietf.org>
List-Unsubscribe: <https://www.ietf.org/mailman/options/mboned>, <mailto:mboned-request@ietf.org?subject=unsubscribe>
List-Archive: <https://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/browse/mboned/>
List-Post: <mailto:mboned@ietf.org>
List-Help: <mailto:mboned-request@ietf.org?subject=help>
List-Subscribe: <https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/mboned>, <mailto:mboned-request@ietf.org?subject=subscribe>
X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 02 Apr 2018 06:59:14 -0000

Hi,

> On 2 Apr 2018, at 05:31, James A. (Jim) Stevens <james.a.stevens@rockwellcollins.com> wrote:
> 
> Toerless, we are using Bidir-PIM.
> 
> I haven't been tracking ​RFC 8364, but from just glancing at it, I think Bidir-PIM is probably better for these bursty source/destination multicast applications as well as being an existing standard available in some routers and host operating systems. Doesn't mean I couldn't change my opinion as I learn more and it becomes widely available, however.

Certainly BIDIR and PFM have their use cases intradomain. The question is how much we talk about these in the draft. The thrust of the document is on removing ASM components from interdomain scenarios.

Tim

> Cheers,
> Jim
> 
> On Sun, Apr 1, 2018 at 8:03 AM, Toerless Eckert <tte@cs.fau.de> wrote:
> Thanks, James, Tim
> 
> Agreed. That additional text in the abstract didn't add good value *sigh*
> 
> Can i ask whether you are using PIM-SM or Bidir-PIM for these type of apps ?
> Always particularily curious about how well PIM-SM with bursty sources
> does work well (or not) in different scenarios. E.g: Do you think that
> ​​RFC 8364 would work equally well for your app environment ?
> 
> Cheers
>     Toerless
> 
> _______________________________________________
> MBONED mailing list
> MBONED@ietf.org
> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/mboned