Re: [Teas] [E] Re: What SLOs and SLEs should be in the Slicing Service Model?

["Jalil, Luay" <[e-mail]>]

Agree with Joel. Providers can look at SLOs & SLEs and decide what goes in
the SLA (legal agreement)

Regards,
Luay

On Fri, Mar 25, 2022, 7:52 PM Joel M. Halpern <[e-mail]> wrote:

> Sounds like we need to clarify the verbiage.  SLEs are, as I understand
> it, indeed non-measurables.  But they are not the legal translation of
> the SLOs.  They are expression of customer expectations that are not
> directly observable or measurable.  The example I have the easiest time
> understanding is that the customer expects the operator to encrypt the
> traffic across the service.
>
> Yours,
> Joel
>
> On 3/25/2022 3:07 PM, Gyan Mishra wrote:
> > Hi Med & Joel
> >
> > I reread section 4.1 of the slice draft and to me it seems that SLO is
> > from provider POV measurable indicators and SLE is the is unmeasurable
> > expectations which is makes up the customer fulfillment of obligations
> > by the provider which would be like taking the tangible measurement
> > characteristics from the SLO and translation into legal obligation
> > fulfillment verbiage that goes into the service agreement.  So as the
> > SLE is not tangible but just a translation of SLO metrics into legal
> > verbiage my thoughts are that the framework as well as Yang model need
> > only focus on the SLO tangible metrics and leave the intangible for the
> > lawyers writing the customer agreement.
> >
> >
> > 4.1
> > <
> https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__datatracker.ietf.org_doc_html_draft-2Dietf-2Dteas-2Dietf-2Dnetwork-2Dslices-2D09-23section-2D4.1&d=DwIGaQ&c=udBTRvFvXC5Dhqg7UHpJlPps3mZ3LRxpb6__0PomBTQ&r=k0DrrBeS0St-D1jEwNQ_u1ZyHQXQly5fgCsWF0VTh7o&m=J9C0uO0pyymUD5TiJjBzWVIBLtm6tjJWU_KbStCzl45FBHTa6b70W0rrKaqLhnKA&s=_9k1Nl-OUCyzLyrk4L_1Zs3rtdk6_Z_-D0_pTvR6Fko&e=
> >.
> > Objectives for IETF Network Slices
> >
> >     An IETF Network Slice service is defined in terms of quantifiable
> >     characteristics known as Service Level Objectives (SLOs) and
> >     unquantifiable characteristics known as Service Level Expectations
> >     (SLEs).  SLOs are expressed in terms Service Level Indicators (SLIs),
> >     and together with the SLEs form the contractual agreement between
> >     service customer and service provider known as a Service Level
> >     Agreement (SLA).
> >
> >     The terms are defined as follows:
> >
> >     *  A Service Level Indicator (SLI) is a quantifiable measure of an
> >        aspect of the performance of a network.  For example, it may be a
> >        measure of throughput in bits per second, or it may be a measure
> >        of latency in milliseconds.
> >
> >     *  A Service Level Objective (SLO) is a target value or range for the
> >        measurements returned by observation of an SLI.  For example, an
> >        SLO may be expressed as "SLI <= target", or "lower bound <= SLI <=
> >        upper bound".  A customer can determine whether the provider is
> >        meeting the SLOs by performing measurements on the traffic.
> >
> >     *  A Service Level Expectation (SLE) is an expression of an
> >        unmeasurable service-related request that a customer of an IETF
> >        Network Slice makes of the provider.  An SLE is distinct from an
> >        SLO because the customer may have little or no way of determining
> >        whether the SLE is being met, but they still contract with the
> >        provider for a service that meets the expectation.
> >
> >
> >
> > On Thu, Mar 24, 2022 at 10:36 AM <[e-mail]
> > <mailto:[e-mail]>> wrote:
> >
> >     Re-,
> >
> >     They shouldn't!
> >
> >     This is why I'm suggesting to not have that tagging frozen in the
> >     model. We can simply have a provision for a set of parameters. These
> >     parameters will be included to characterize the service with a
> >     service assurance component that will call out the identity of the
> >     subset of parameters that will be used as committed ones. That
> >     component will also include other data to ensure the same based used
> >     for assessment, etc.
> >
> >     Cheers,
> >     Med
> >
> >      > -----Message d'origine-----
> >      > De : Joel M. Halpern <[e-mail]
> >     <mailto:[e-mail]>>
> >      > Envoyé : jeudi 24 mars 2022 15:29
> >      > À : BOUCADAIR Mohamed INNOV/NET <[e-mail]
> >     <mailto:[e-mail]>>
> >      > Cc : 'TEAS WG' <[e-mail] <mailto:[e-mail]>>;
> >     [e-mail] <mailto:[e-mail]>
> >      > Objet : Re: [Teas] What SLOs and SLEs should be in the Slicing
> >     Service
> >      > Model?
> >      >
> >      > If the others are best effort, why would they be included in the
> SLO?
> >      > (We do not assume that every IETF network slice service will
> >     specify all
> >      > possible parameters.)
> >      >
> >      > Yours,
> >      > Joel
> >      >
> >      > On 3/24/2022 10:20 AM, [e-mail]
> >     <mailto:[e-mail]> wrote:
> >      > > Re-,
> >      > >
> >      > > Some services may be sensitive to delay for example but the
> >     slice service
> >      > request may include (for whatever reason) not only the delay, but
> >     also
> >      > other attributes that are currently listed as SLOs in the draft.
> The
> >      > provider is requested to only commit on the delay and best effort
> >     for the
> >      > other attributes.
> >      > >
> >      > > Cheers,
> >      > > Med
> >      > >
> >      > >> -----Message d'origine-----
> >      > >> De : Joel M. Halpern <[e-mail]
> >     <mailto:[e-mail]>> Envoyé : jeudi 24 mars
> >      > >> 2022 15:07 À : BOUCADAIR Mohamed INNOV/NET
> >      > >> <[e-mail]
> >     <mailto:[e-mail]>> Cc : 'TEAS WG' <[e-mail]
> >     <mailto:[e-mail]>>;
> >      > >> [e-mail] <mailto:[e-mail]> Objet : Re:
> >     [Teas] What SLOs and SLEs should be
> >      > >> in the Slicing Service Model?
> >      > >>
> >      > >> Interesting.  If they are indeed not coupled, then you are
> clearly
> >      > >> correct about representation.
> >      > >>
> >      > >> Can you give an example so I can understand when they would
> not be
> >      > coupled.
> >      > >> I had leapt to the (quite possibly incorrect) conclusion that
> >     the two
> >      > >> sets of properties went together.
> >      > >>
> >      > >> Thank you,
> >      > >> Joel
> >      > >>
> >      > >> On 3/24/2022 10:03 AM, [e-mail]
> >     <mailto:[e-mail]> wrote:
> >      > >>> Hi Joel,
> >      > >>>
> >      > >>> It is.
> >      > >>>
> >      > >>> As mentioned below, this should be covered as part of service
> >      > >> assurance/fulfillment/reporting parameters. Which parameters
> >     to put
> >      > >> there is deployment-specific. Not all parameters tagged as SLO
> >     in the
> >      > >> framework will end up as part of the
> >     assurance/fulfillment/reporting.
> >      > >>>
> >      > >>> Cheers,
> >      > >>> Med
> >      > >>>
> >      > >>>> -----Message d'origine-----
> >      > >>>> De : Joel M. Halpern <[e-mail]
> >     <mailto:[e-mail]>> Envoyé : jeudi 24 mars
> >      > >>>> 2022 14:52 À : BOUCADAIR Mohamed INNOV/NET
> >      > >>>> <[e-mail]
> >     <mailto:[e-mail]>>; [e-mail]
> >     <mailto:[e-mail]>; 'TEAS WG'
> >      > >>>> <[e-mail] <mailto:[e-mail]>> Objet : Re: [Teas]
> >     What SLOs and SLEs should be in
> >      > >>>> the Slicing Service Model?
> >      > >>>>
> >      > >>>> Isn't it important to distinguish between "these are things I
> >      > >>>> expect you to do, measure, and report" and "these are things
> I
> >      > >>>> would like you to do even though they are not measurable or
> >      > reportable"?
> >      > >>>>
> >      > >>>> Yours,
> >      > >>>> Joel
> >      > >>>>
> >      > >>>> On 3/23/2022 10:08 AM, [e-mail]
> >     <mailto:[e-mail]> wrote:
> >      > >>>>> Hi all,
> >      > >>>>>
> >      > >>>>> This message actually triggers a companion comment I have
> >     on the
> >      > >>>>> SLO/SLE
> >      > >>>> taxonomy. From the service modeling standpoint, I suggest
> >     that we
> >      > >>>> don't inherit that taxonomy for various reasons:
> >      > >>>>>
> >      > >>>>> * Things would be much simpler if we just focus on service
> >      > >>>>> requirements
> >      > >>>> without making an assumption how such requirement is
> >     expressed and
> >      > >>>> whether it is
> >     quantified/quantitative/qualitative/measurable/etc.
> >      > >>>> Whether/how a specific service requirement is covered by
> service
> >      > >>>> assurance/fulfillment can be part of the slice service
> >     definition
> >      > >> itself.
> >      > >>>>>
> >      > >>>>> * What we may tag as an SLE today because of the technology
> >      > >>>>> limitations,
> >      > >>>> may not stay as such forever. It may be true that an
> >     "expectation"
> >      > >>>> may not be easily assessed using current techniques (and
> thus be
> >      > >>>> tagged as SLE), but this does not prevent that innovative
> means
> >      > >>>> would be defined in the future (which means that it is an
> >     SLO, not
> >      > >>>> an SLE
> >      > >> anymore).
> >      > >>>>>
> >      > >>>>> * We are artificially adding extra complexity for the
> modelling
> >      > >>>>> part as
> >      > >>>> service requirement will need to be classified based as SLO
> >     or SLEs.
> >      > >>>>>
> >      > >>>>> * I remember that Kiran agreed at least to not import that
> >      > >>>>> taxonomy into
> >      > >>>> the data model when we were discussing the call for adoption
> >     of the
> >      > >>>> slice
> >      > >>>> definition:
> >      > >>>>>
> >      > >>>>> ==(the full message from Kiran can be found in the
> archives)===
> >      > >>>>> "However, it should not imply that NBI models are required
> >     to have
> >      > >>>> SLE/SLO indicators and I totally agreed with your comments on
> >      > >>>> draft-wd- teas-ietf-network-slice-nbi-yang-03"
> >      > >>>>> ==
> >      > >>>>>
> >      > >>>>> Cheers,
> >      > >>>>> Med
> >      > >>>>>
> >      > >>>>>> -----Message d'origine-----
> >      > >>>>>> De : Teas <[e-mail]
> >     <mailto:[e-mail]>> De la part de Adrian Farrel
> >      > >>>>>> Envoyé
> >      > >>>>>> : mercredi 23 mars 2022 14:47 À : 'TEAS WG' <[e-mail]
> >     <mailto:[e-mail]>> Objet :
> >      > >>>>>> [Teas] What SLOs and SLEs should be in the Slicing Service
> >     Model?
> >      > >>>>>>
> >      > >>>>>> Hi,
> >      > >>>>>>
> >      > >>>>>> Sorry for my audio being a mess in TEAS today.
> >      > >>>>>>
> >      > >>>>>> I believe I heard the discussion between Kireeti and Reza
> >      > >>>>>> correctly, and there was some follow-up in the chat.
> >      > >>>>>>
> >      > >>>>>> I agree that "Protection" is a realisation feature and so
> it
> >      > >>>>>> qualifies as an SLE, if at all.
> >      > >>>>>> But "Reliability" is clearly an SLO. Usually expressed as
> >     maximum
> >      > >>>>>> down- time per unit of time, or maximum lost traffic.
> >      > >>>>>>
> >      > >>>>>> There was one thing that I *think* I heard. This was Reza
> >     saying
> >      > >>>>>> that the service YANG model was only including the SLOs
> >     and SLEs
> >      > >>>>>> noted in the framework. Maybe I misheard "only" because I
> >     think
> >      > >>>>>> that might be a mistake.
> >      > >>>>>> The YANG model should certainly be interested in what the
> >      > >>>>>> framework says, but it is not a requirement that all SLOs
> and
> >      > >>>>>> SLEs in the framework be in the model if the authors find
> that
> >      > >>>>>> there is no interest in implementing them, and there should
> >      > >>>>>> certainly be no limitation about including additional SLOs
> >     or SLEs
> >      > in the YANG model.
> >      > >>>>>> Indeed, the SLOs and SLEs listed in the framework are
> >     presented
> >      > >>>>>> as
> >      > >>>> examples.
> >      > >>>>>>
> >      > >>>>>> Cheers,
> >      > >>>>>> Adrian
> >      > >>>>>>
> >      > >>>>>> _______________________________________________
> >      > >>>>>> Teas mailing list
> >      > >>>>>> [e-mail] <mailto:[e-mail]>
> >      > >>>>>>
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> > <http://www.verizon.com/>
> >
> > *Gyan Mishra*
> >
> > /Network Solutions A//rchitect /
> >
> > /Email [e-mail] <mailto:[e-mail]>//
> > /
> >
> > /M 301 502-1347
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