[Tools-discuss] Re: [126attendees] Re: tools-discuss: side meetings vanishing (was: Re: Does it exist? (RE: [nmrg] Re: [OPSAWG]Re: [ainetops] Re: AIOPS Side Meeting [Was Re: Agenda for the Side Meeting: AI-Driven Network) Operations

[Tools-discuss] Re: [126attendees] Re: tools-discuss: side meetings vanishing (was: Re: Does it exist? (RE: [nmrg] Re: [OPSAWG]Re: [ainetops] Re: AIOPS Side Meeting [Was Re: Agenda for the Side Meeting: AI-Driven Network) Operations — IETF 126, Fri 24 Jul, 08:00 CEST])

Mirja Kuehlewind <ietf@kuehlewind.net> Fri, 24 July 2026 16:35 UTC

mail-alias-created-date: 1725731591227
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
From: Mirja Kuehlewind <ietf@kuehlewind.net>
Mime-Version: 1.0 (1.0)
Date: Fri, 24 Jul 2026 18:35:20 +0200
Message-Id: <F6330652-137B-4C7F-8686-6DDE2034405E@kuehlewind.net>
References: <9A2C1ECA-82D8-42A9-BFC8-FF341B638309@viagenie.ca>
In-Reply-To: <9A2C1ECA-82D8-42A9-BFC8-FF341B638309@viagenie.ca>
To: Marc Blanchet <marc.blanchet@viagenie.ca>
Message-ID-Hash: HDLD5D2KVUGT4KOMZR4SQKHD6LJEFEIG
CC: Alexander Clemm <ludwig@clemm.org>, 126attendees@ietf.org, tools-discuss@ietf.org
Precedence: list
Subject: [Tools-discuss] Re: [126attendees] Re: tools-discuss: side meetings vanishing (was: Re: Does it exist? (RE: [nmrg] Re: [OPSAWG]Re: [ainetops] Re: AIOPS Side Meeting [Was Re: Agenda for the Side Meeting: AI-Driven Network) Operations — IETF 126, Fri 24 Jul, 08:00 CEST])
Archived-At: <https://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/msg/tools-discuss/EPg9WYDRoCu0GeDc5s7SjIhOsuw>

Can we just not use this tool anymore? I know the wiki was not perfect but having to wait that the secretariat manually enters things and no quick an easy way to update or even to see what slots are still available makes things complicated and not very community self organized.

> Am 24.07.2026 um 12:12 schrieb Marc Blanchet <marc.blanchet@viagenie.ca>:
> 
> 
>> Le 24 juill. 2026 à 10:03, Nicolas Giard <nick@staff.ietf.org> a écrit :
>> 
>> We are completely replacing the side meetings website with our own solution after this meeting.
> 
> 
> +1
> 
> Thanks!
> 
> Marc.
> 
>> The current website relies on a 3rd party service that has many issues and can be unreliable at times.
>> 
>> I would advise against using the JSON link you posted, as it is an outdated copy from 3 weeks ago used for testing.
>> Side meetings have been added, removed or moved since then.
>> 
>> Nick
>> 
>> On Fri, Jul 24, 2026 at 3:43 AM Toerless Eckert <tte@cs.fau.de> wrote:
>> This is the second time we are seeing a side meeting WHILE IT IS GOING ON to vanish from
>> sidemeetings.ietf.org. Yesterday we had the same effect during "Agent Operations" - and it started
>> to show up again after the end of the side meeting.
>> 
>> It kinda makes joining late difficult.
>> 
>> So there is something strangely broken i think in the sidemeetings.ietf.org web page logic...
>> 
>> I've added this as an issue on:
>> 
>> https://github.com/ietf-tools/sidemeetings/issues/5
>> 
>> Also. To look up side meetings as if you where an AI agent, use the json, that is always ocrrect it seems:
>> 
>> https://github.com/ietf-tools/sidemeetings/blob/v1/past-meetings/126.json
>> 
>> Cheers
>>    Toerless
>> 
>>> On Fri, Jul 24, 2026 at 09:30:11AM +0200, Alexander Clemm wrote:
>>> Hallo Toerless
>>> I do not see this AINETOPS / AIOPS side meeting in the list of side meetings - was this a public side meeting, did it actually take place?
>>> I see another meeting "Agent Ops" that sounds related taking place yesterday afternoon?  
>>> Thanks
>>> --- Alex
>>> 
>>> -----Original Message-----
>>> From: Toerless Eckert <tte@cs.fau.de>
>>> Sent: Wednesday, July 22, 2026 12:22 PM
>>> To: Mahesh Jethanandani <mjethanandani@gmail.com>
>>> Cc: Roland.Schott@telekom.de; danvoyerwork@gmail.com; ainetops@ietf.org; nmop@ietf.org; opsawg@ietf.org; nmrg@irtf.org
>>> Subject: [nmrg] Re: [OPSAWG]Re: [ainetops] Re: AIOPS Side Meeting [Was Re: Agenda for the Side Meeting: AI-Driven Network Operations — IETF 126, Fri 24 Jul, 08:00 CEST]
>>> 
>>> [adding NMRG]
>>> 
>>> Thanks, Mahesh
>>> 
>>> Yes, indeed, NMRG meeting starting at 9AM, so lets try to get the most out of the first hour of our side-meeting at 8AM. There are a couple of documents proposed/discussed for the NMRG meeting including yours truly  draft-cxxx-nmrg-ai4ibn-00 that should be also of interest to folks interested in AINETOPS.
>>> 
>>> Even more so, similar to how NMRG work product (RFCs)  was a justification in support of chartering ANIMA (by Benoit back then), such work in NMRG could equally support justifying AINETOPS - or help it to scope. And that's definitely also a question i would like to raise in NMRG:
>>> 
>>> "which of the stuff here in NMRG do you see of interest to you (when you are an operator
>>> specifically) to be brought to the IETF, specifically a group scoped such as proposed for  AINETOPS".
>>> 
>>> So maybe we'll get even more time and interest in the topic, even if some of of it will be in NMRG on friday. But there are a lot of operator participants in there.
>>> 
>>> Cheers
>>>   Toerless                
>>> 
>>> On Wed, Jul 22, 2026 at 12:02:17PM +0200, Mahesh Jethanandani wrote:
>>>> <html class="apple-mail-supports-explicit-dark-mode"><head><meta
>>>> http-equiv="content-type" content="text/html;
>>>> charset=utf-8"></head><body dir="auto">Hi Dan, et
>>>> al,<div><br></div><div>Based on talking to quite a few of you, there
>>>> is clearly a lot of interest in having the meeting. We will therefore
>>>> go ahead and have the meeting.</div><div><br></div><div>A few have
>>>> indicated a conflict starting at 9 am. I expect that we will start
>>>> losing the quorum by that time. So participants, should plan on
>>>> getting a few core things sorted out in the first hour itself. I will
>>>> hang around after the first hour.</div><div><br></div><div>Look
>>>> forward to seeing you all on
>>>> Friday.</div><div><br></div><div>Cheers.</div><div><br
>>>> id="lineBreakAtBeginningOfSignature"><div dir="ltr">Mahesh
>>>> Jethanandani<div>mjethanandani@gmail.com</div></div><div
>>>> dir="ltr"><br><blockquote type="cite">On Jul 22, 2026, at 9:31 AM,
>>>> Roland.Schott@telekom.de wrote:<br><br></blockquote></div><blockquote
>>>> type="cite"><div dir="ltr">
>>>> 
>>>> <meta http-equiv="Content-Type" content="text/html; charset=utf-8">
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> <div dir="ltr" style="font-family: Aptos, Aptos_MSFontService,
>>>> -apple-system, Roboto, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif; font-size: 12pt;
>>>> color: rgb(0, 0, 0);"> Hi Dan,</div> <div dir="ltr"
>>>> style="font-family: Aptos, Aptos_MSFontService, -apple-system, Roboto,
>>>> Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif; font-size: 12pt; color: rgb(0, 0, 0);">
>>>> <br> </div> <div dir="ltr" style="font-family: Aptos,
>>>> Aptos_MSFontService, -apple-system, Roboto, Arial, Helvetica,
>>>> sans-serif; font-size: 12pt; color: rgb(0, 0, 0);"> I want to meet
>>>> with Mahesh to clarify, if I can support.</div> <div dir="ltr"
>>>> style="font-family: Aptos, Aptos_MSFontService, -apple-system, Roboto,
>>>> Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif; font-size: 12pt; color: rgb(0, 0, 0);">
>>>> <br> </div> <div dir="ltr" style="font-family: Aptos,
>>>> Aptos_MSFontService, -apple-system, Roboto, Arial, Helvetica,
>>>> sans-serif; font-size: 12pt; color: rgb(0, 0, 0);"> In case community
>>>> has interest we will find a way to run it.</div> <div dir="ltr"
>>>> style="font-family: Aptos, Aptos_MSFontService, -apple-system, Roboto,
>>>> Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif; font-size: 12pt; color: rgb(0, 0, 0);">
>>>> <br> </div> <div dir="ltr" style="font-family: Aptos,
>>>> Aptos_MSFontService, -apple-system, Roboto, Arial, Helvetica,
>>>> sans-serif; font-size: 12pt; color: rgb(0, 0, 0);"> Best Regards</div>
>>>> <div dir="ltr" style="font-family: Aptos, Aptos_MSFontService,
>>>> -apple-system, Roboto, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif; font-size: 12pt;
>>>> color: rgb(0, 0, 0);"> <br> </div> <div dir="ltr" style="font-family:
>>>> Aptos, Aptos_MSFontService, -apple-system, Roboto, Arial, Helvetica,
>>>> sans-serif; font-size: 12pt; color: rgb(0, 0, 0);"> Roland&nbsp;</div>
>>>> <div dir="ltr" style="font-family: Aptos, Aptos_MSFontService,
>>>> -apple-system, Roboto, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif; font-size: 12pt;
>>>> color: rgb(0, 0, 0);"> <br> </div> <div
>>>> id="ms-outlook-mobile-body-separator-line"
>>>> data-applydefaultfontstyles="true" style="font-family: Aptos,
>>>> Aptos_MSFontService, -apple-system, Roboto, Arial, Helvetica,
>>>> sans-serif; font-size: 12pt;" dir="ltr"> <div dir="ltr"
>>>> style="font-family: Aptos, Aptos_MSFontService, -apple-system, Roboto,
>>>> Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif; font-size: 12pt;"> <br> </div> </div>
>>>> <div style="font-family: Aptos, Aptos_MSFontService, -apple-system,
>>>> Roboto, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif; font-size: 12pt; color: rgb(0,
>>>> 0, 0);" id="ms-outlook-mobile-signature" dir="ltr"> </div> <div
>>>> id="mail-editor-reference-message-container"
>>>> class="ms-outlook-mobile-reference-message">
>>>> <div id="mail-editor-reference-message-container">
>>>> <hr style="display: inline-block; width: 98%;"> <div
>>>> id="divRplyFwdMsg" dir="ltr"><span style="font-family: Calibri,
>>>> sans-serif;"><b>Von:</b> Dan Voyer IETF
>>>> &lt;danvoyerwork@gmail.com&gt;<br>
>>>> <b>Gesendet:</b> Mittwoch, Juli 22, 2026 9:26 AM<br> <b>An:</b> Mahesh
>>>> Jethanandani &lt;mjethanandani@gmail.com&gt;<br>
>>>> <b>Cc:</b> ainetops@ietf.org &lt;ainetops@ietf.org&gt;; nmop@ietf.org
>>>> &lt;nmop@ietf.org&gt;; opsawg &lt;opsawg@ietf.org&gt;<br>
>>>> <b>Betreff:</b> [ainetops] Re: [OPSAWG]AIOPS Side Meeting [Was Re:
>>>> Agenda for the Side Meeting: AI-Driven Network Operations — IETF 126,
>>>> Fri 24 Jul, 08:00 CEST]</span> <div style="font-family: Calibri,
>>>> sans-serif;">&nbsp;</div> </div> <div dir="ltr">H Mahesh,</div> <div
>>>> dir="ltr"><br> </div> <div dir="ltr">Is the side-meeting going or did
>>>> you shut it down since no one took charge ?</div> <div dir="ltr"><br>
>>>> </div> <div dir="ltr">And, perhaps since you proposed that
>>>> side-meeting, is there any possibility that you run it ?&nbsp;</div>
>>>> <div dir="ltr"><br> </div> <div dir="ltr">Dan</div> <br> <div
>>>> dir="ltr" class="gmail_attr">On Sun, Jul 19, 2026 at 9:08 PM Mahesh
>>>> Jethanandani &lt;<a
>>>> href="mailto:mjethanandani@gmail.com">mjethanandani@gmail.com</a>&gt;
>>>> wrote:</div> <blockquote style="margin: 0px 0px 0px 0.8ex;
>>>> padding-left: 1ex; border-left: 1px solid rgb(204, 204, 204);"> <div
>>>> class="gmail_quote">Hi All,</div> <div dir="ltr"
>>>> class="gmail_quote"><br> </div> <div class="gmail_quote">When I
>>>> proposed the AIOPS side meeting, I asked if anyone was willing to step
>>>> up and fill the roles needed to run it. To date, no one has
>>>> volunteered for any of them. I understand the turnaround has been
>>>> short, but without these roles  filled, the meeting has no one driving
>>>> it and won't be worth holding.</div> <div dir="ltr"
>>>> class="gmail_quote"><br> </div> <div class="gmail_quote">If you're a
>>>> would-be proponent and want to see AIOPS work happen in the IETF, this
>>>> is the moment to step up:</div> <div dir="ltr"
>>>> class="gmail_quote"><br> </div> <div class="gmail_quote">Take charge
>>>> of the agenda</div> <div class="gmail_quote">Work the draft of a
>>>> problem statement</div> <div class="gmail_quote">Own the pen on the
>>>> charter text</div> <div class="gmail_quote">Show up and demonstrate
>>>> real interest</div> <div dir="ltr" class="gmail_quote"><br> </div>
>>>> <div class="gmail_quote">If a core group hasn't formed by Wednesday,
>>>> July 22, I will cancel the side meeting.</div> <div dir="ltr"
>>>> class="gmail_quote"><br> </div> <div class="gmail_quote">Cheers,</div>
>>>> <div dir="ltr" class="gmail_quote"><br> </div> <blockquote> <div
>>>> class="gmail_quote">On Jul 13, 2026, at 9:16 PM, Mahesh Jethanandani
>>>> &lt;<a href="mailto:mjethanandani@gmail.com"
>>>> target="_blank">mjethanandani@gmail.com</a>&gt; wrote:</div> <div
>>>> dir="ltr" class="gmail_quote"><br> </div> <div class="gmail_quote"
>>>> style="text-align: left; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none;
>>>> font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 12px;"> Volunteers needed to help
>>>> run the meeting</div> <div class="gmail_quote" style="text-align:
>>>> left; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; font-family: Helvetica;
>>>> font-size: 12px;"> ------------------------------------------</div>
>>>> <div class="gmail_quote" style="text-align: left; text-indent: 0px;
>>>> text-transform: none; font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 12px;"> A few
>>>> operational roles are still open for running this session -
>>>> separate</div> <div class="gmail_quote" style="text-align: left;
>>>> text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; font-family: Helvetica;
>>>> font-size: 12px;"> from chairing the proposed working group itself.
>>>> Room capacity is limited;</div> <div class="gmail_quote"
>>>> style="text-align: left; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none;
>>>> font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 12px;"> preference for in-room
>>>> seating will be given to those who take one of</div> <div
>>>> class="gmail_quote" style="text-align: left; text-indent: 0px;
>>>> text-transform: none; font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 12px;"> these
>>>> on:</div> <div dir="ltr" class="gmail_quote" style="text-align: left;
>>>> text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; font-family: Helvetica;
>>>> font-size: 12px;"> <br> </div> <div class="gmail_quote"
>>>> style="text-align: left; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none;
>>>> font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 12px;"> &nbsp; - Co-chair
>>>> (checklist owner): tracks the Part B checklist live so the</div> <div
>>>> class="gmail_quote" style="text-align: left; text-indent: 0px;
>>>> text-transform: none; font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 12px;">
>>>> &nbsp; &nbsp; co-chair can stay focused on the room</div> <div
>>>> class="gmail_quote" style="text-align: left; text-indent: 0px;
>>>> text-transform: none; font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 12px;">
>>>> &nbsp; - Co-chair (clock &amp; consensus): runs the clock at each
>>>> agenda-block</div> <div class="gmail_quote" style="text-align: left;
>>>> text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; font-family: Helvetica;
>>>> font-size: 12px;"> &nbsp; &nbsp; boundary and calls rough consensus
>>>> alongside the co-chair</div> <div class="gmail_quote"
>>>> style="text-align: left; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none;
>>>> font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 12px;"> &nbsp; - Notes-pad owner:
>>>> opens a shared pad before the meeting and captures</div> <div
>>>> class="gmail_quote" style="text-align: left; text-indent: 0px;
>>>> text-transform: none; font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 12px;">
>>>> &nbsp; &nbsp; the roll call, deliverables, and objections live</div>
>>>> <div class="gmail_quote" style="text-align: left; text-indent: 0px;
>>>> text-transform: none; font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 12px;">
>>>> &nbsp; - Jabber/WebEx monitor: relays remote comments and hands into
>>>> the room</div> <div class="gmail_quote" style="text-align: left;
>>>> text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; font-family: Helvetica;
>>>> font-size: 12px;"> &nbsp; &nbsp; queue</div> <div class="gmail_quote"
>>>> style="text-align: left; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none;
>>>> font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 12px;"> &nbsp; - Breakout group
>>>> leads (4 needed): one each for YANG data models,</div> <div
>>>> class="gmail_quote" style="text-align: left; text-indent: 0px;
>>>> text-transform: none; font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 12px;">
>>>> &nbsp; &nbsp; protocol extensions, MCP, and BCP/governance, to keep
>>>> the 09:10</div> <div class="gmail_quote" style="text-align: left;
>>>> text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; font-family: Helvetica;
>>>> font-size: 12px;"> &nbsp; &nbsp; deliverables breakout focused and
>>>> report back</div> <div class="gmail_quote" style="text-align: left;
>>>> text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; font-family: Helvetica;
>>>> font-size: 12px;"> &nbsp; - Charter text owners (2 needed): own the
>>>> charter text draft and</div> <div class="gmail_quote"
>>>> style="text-align: left; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none;
>>>> font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 12px;"> &nbsp; &nbsp; drive it
>>>> toward consensus, on-list before the next meeting and through</div>
>>>> <div class="gmail_quote" style="text-align: left; text-indent: 0px;
>>>> text-transform: none; font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 12px;">
>>>> &nbsp; &nbsp; to a final version after</div> </blockquote> <div
>>>> dir="ltr" class="gmail_quote"><br> </div> <div dir="auto"
>>>> class="gmail_quote" style="text-align: left; text-indent: 0px;
>>>> text-transform: none; font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 12px; color:
>>>> rgb(0, 0, 0);"> <br> Mahesh Jethanandani</div> <div dir="auto"
>>>> class="gmail_quote" style="text-align: left; text-indent: 0px;
>>>> text-transform: none; font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 12px; color:
>>>> rgb(0, 0, 0);"> <a href="mailto:mjethanandani@gmail.com"
>>>> target="_blank">mjethanandani@gmail.com</a></div>
>>>> <div dir="ltr" class="gmail_quote" style="text-align: left;
>>>> text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; font-family: Helvetica;
>>>> font-size: 12px; color: rgb(0, 0, 0);"> <br> </div> <div dir="ltr"
>>>> class="gmail_quote" style="text-align: left; text-transform: none;
>>>> font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 12px; color: rgb(0, 0, 0);"> <br>
>>>> </div> <div dir="ltr" class="gmail_quote" style="text-align: left;
>>>> text-transform: none; font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 12px; color:
>>>> rgb(0, 0, 0);"> <br> </div> <div dir="ltr" class="gmail_quote"><br>
>>>> <br> </div> <div dir="ltr" class="gmail_quote"><br> </div> <div
>>>> class="gmail_quote">_______________________________________________<br
>>>>> OPSAWG mailing list -- <a href="mailto:opsawg@ietf.org"
>>>> target="_blank">opsawg@ietf.org</a><br>
>>>> To unsubscribe send an email to <a href="mailto:opsawg-leave@ietf.org"
>>>> target="_blank"> opsawg-leave@ietf.org</a></div> </blockquote> </div>
>>>> </div>
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> </div></blockquote></div></body></html>
>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>> OPSAWG mailing list -- opsawg@ietf.org To unsubscribe send an email to
>>>> opsawg-leave@ietf.org
>>> 
>>> 
>>> --
>>> ---
>>> tte@cs.fau.de
>>> 
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> nmrg mailing list -- nmrg@irtf.org
>>> To unsubscribe send an email to nmrg-leave@irtf.org
>> 
>> --
>> ---
>> tte@cs.fau.de
>> 
>> -----------------------------------------------
>> Tools-discuss mailing list -- tools-discuss@ietf.org
>> To unsubscribe send an email to tools-discuss-leave@ietf.org
>> https://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/browse/tools-discuss/
>> _______________________________________________
>> 126attendees mailing list -- 126attendees@ietf.org
>> To unsubscribe send an email to 126attendees-leave@ietf.org
> 
> _______________________________________________
> 126attendees mailing list -- 126attendees@ietf.org
> To unsubscribe send an email to 126attendees-leave@ietf.org

[Tools-discuss] tools-discuss: side meetings vani… 'Toerless Eckert'
[Tools-discuss] Re: tools-discuss: side meetings … Nicolas Giard
[Tools-discuss] Re: [126attendees] tools-discuss:… Marc Blanchet
[Tools-discuss] Re: [126attendees] tools-discuss:… Marc Blanchet
[Tools-discuss] Re: [126attendees] tools-discuss:… Jay Daley
[Tools-discuss] Re: [126attendees] Re: tools-disc… Grace Rachmany
[Tools-discuss] Re: [126attendees] Re: tools-disc… Nicolas Giard
[Tools-discuss] Re: [126attendees] Re: tools-disc… Mirja Kuehlewind
[Tools-discuss] Re: tools-discuss: side meetings … Toerless Eckert
[Tools-discuss] Re: tools-discuss: side meetings … Yaron Sheffer
[Tools-discuss] Re: tools-discuss: side meetings … Nicolas Giard