[Tools-discuss] tools-discuss: side meetings vanishing (was: Re: Does it exist? (RE: [nmrg] Re: [OPSAWG]Re: [ainetops] Re: AIOPS Side Meeting [Was Re: Agenda for the Side Meeting: AI-Driven Network) Operations

[Tools-discuss] tools-discuss: side meetings vanishing (was: Re: Does it exist? (RE: [nmrg] Re: [OPSAWG]Re: [ainetops] Re: AIOPS Side Meeting [Was Re: Agenda for the Side Meeting: AI-Driven Network) Operations — IETF 126, Fri 24 Jul, 08:00 CEST])

'Toerless Eckert' <tte@cs.fau.de> Fri, 24 July 2026 07:43 UTC

Date: Fri, 24 Jul 2026 09:43:45 +0200
From: 'Toerless Eckert' <tte@cs.fau.de>
To: Alexander Clemm <ludwig@clemm.org>, 126attendees@ietf.org, tools-discuss@ietf.org
Message-ID: <amMXsTryXyACC8Sw@faui48e.informatik.uni-erlangen.de>
References: <BEXP281MB00556110DF8A81146F816D4387C12@BEXP281MB0055.DEUP281.PROD.OUTLOOK.COM> <D310AD16-5C3D-4333-BFDF-7442F2ECD6CC@gmail.com> <amCZzyHEivTzFJxe@faui48e.informatik.uni-erlangen.de> <001c01dd1b3e$43d8b1e0$cb8a15a0$@clemm.org>
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Subject: [Tools-discuss] tools-discuss: side meetings vanishing (was: Re: Does it exist? (RE: [nmrg] Re: [OPSAWG]Re: [ainetops] Re: AIOPS Side Meeting [Was Re: Agenda for the Side Meeting: AI-Driven Network) Operations — IETF 126, Fri 24 Jul, 08:00 CEST])
Archived-At: <https://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/msg/tools-discuss/uzMTzxClwdHCelnal6G5hfckRNs>

This is the second time we are seeing a side meeting WHILE IT IS GOING ON to vanish from
sidemeetings.ietf.org. Yesterday we had the same effect during "Agent Operations" - and it started
to show up again after the end of the side meeting.

It kinda makes joining late difficult.

So there is something strangely broken i think in the sidemeetings.ietf.org web page logic...

I've added this as an issue on:

https://github.com/ietf-tools/sidemeetings/issues/5

Also. To look up side meetings as if you where an AI agent, use the json, that is always ocrrect it seems:

https://github.com/ietf-tools/sidemeetings/blob/v1/past-meetings/126.json

Cheers
    Toerless

On Fri, Jul 24, 2026 at 09:30:11AM +0200, Alexander Clemm wrote:
> Hallo Toerless
> I do not see this AINETOPS / AIOPS side meeting in the list of side meetings - was this a public side meeting, did it actually take place?
> I see another meeting "Agent Ops" that sounds related taking place yesterday afternoon?  
> Thanks
> --- Alex
> 
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Toerless Eckert <tte@cs.fau.de> 
> Sent: Wednesday, July 22, 2026 12:22 PM
> To: Mahesh Jethanandani <mjethanandani@gmail.com>
> Cc: Roland.Schott@telekom.de; danvoyerwork@gmail.com; ainetops@ietf.org; nmop@ietf.org; opsawg@ietf.org; nmrg@irtf.org
> Subject: [nmrg] Re: [OPSAWG]Re: [ainetops] Re: AIOPS Side Meeting [Was Re: Agenda for the Side Meeting: AI-Driven Network Operations — IETF 126, Fri 24 Jul, 08:00 CEST]
> 
> [adding NMRG]
> 
> Thanks, Mahesh
> 
> Yes, indeed, NMRG meeting starting at 9AM, so lets try to get the most out of the first hour of our side-meeting at 8AM. There are a couple of documents proposed/discussed for the NMRG meeting including yours truly  draft-cxxx-nmrg-ai4ibn-00 that should be also of interest to folks interested in AINETOPS.
> 
> Even more so, similar to how NMRG work product (RFCs)  was a justification in support of chartering ANIMA (by Benoit back then), such work in NMRG could equally support justifying AINETOPS - or help it to scope. And that's definitely also a question i would like to raise in NMRG:
> 
> "which of the stuff here in NMRG do you see of interest to you (when you are an operator
>  specifically) to be brought to the IETF, specifically a group scoped such as proposed for  AINETOPS".
> 
> So maybe we'll get even more time and interest in the topic, even if some of of it will be in NMRG on friday. But there are a lot of operator participants in there.
> 
> Cheers
>    Toerless                
> 
> On Wed, Jul 22, 2026 at 12:02:17PM +0200, Mahesh Jethanandani wrote:
> > <html class="apple-mail-supports-explicit-dark-mode"><head><meta 
> > http-equiv="content-type" content="text/html; 
> > charset=utf-8"></head><body dir="auto">Hi Dan, et 
> > al,<div><br></div><div>Based on talking to quite a few of you, there 
> > is clearly a lot of interest in having the meeting. We will therefore 
> > go ahead and have the meeting.</div><div><br></div><div>A few have 
> > indicated a conflict starting at 9 am. I expect that we will start 
> > losing the quorum by that time. So participants, should plan on 
> > getting a few core things sorted out in the first hour itself. I will 
> > hang around after the first hour.</div><div><br></div><div>Look 
> > forward to seeing you all on 
> > Friday.</div><div><br></div><div>Cheers.</div><div><br 
> > id="lineBreakAtBeginningOfSignature"><div dir="ltr">Mahesh 
> > Jethanandani<div>mjethanandani@gmail.com</div></div><div 
> > dir="ltr"><br><blockquote type="cite">On Jul 22, 2026, at 9:31 AM, 
> > Roland.Schott@telekom.de wrote:<br><br></blockquote></div><blockquote 
> > type="cite"><div dir="ltr">
> > 
> > <meta http-equiv="Content-Type" content="text/html; charset=utf-8">
> > 
> > 
> > <div dir="ltr" style="font-family: Aptos, Aptos_MSFontService, 
> > -apple-system, Roboto, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif; font-size: 12pt; 
> > color: rgb(0, 0, 0);"> Hi Dan,</div> <div dir="ltr" 
> > style="font-family: Aptos, Aptos_MSFontService, -apple-system, Roboto, 
> > Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif; font-size: 12pt; color: rgb(0, 0, 0);"> 
> > <br> </div> <div dir="ltr" style="font-family: Aptos, 
> > Aptos_MSFontService, -apple-system, Roboto, Arial, Helvetica, 
> > sans-serif; font-size: 12pt; color: rgb(0, 0, 0);"> I want to meet 
> > with Mahesh to clarify, if I can support.</div> <div dir="ltr" 
> > style="font-family: Aptos, Aptos_MSFontService, -apple-system, Roboto, 
> > Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif; font-size: 12pt; color: rgb(0, 0, 0);"> 
> > <br> </div> <div dir="ltr" style="font-family: Aptos, 
> > Aptos_MSFontService, -apple-system, Roboto, Arial, Helvetica, 
> > sans-serif; font-size: 12pt; color: rgb(0, 0, 0);"> In case community 
> > has interest we will find a way to run it.</div> <div dir="ltr" 
> > style="font-family: Aptos, Aptos_MSFontService, -apple-system, Roboto, 
> > Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif; font-size: 12pt; color: rgb(0, 0, 0);"> 
> > <br> </div> <div dir="ltr" style="font-family: Aptos, 
> > Aptos_MSFontService, -apple-system, Roboto, Arial, Helvetica, 
> > sans-serif; font-size: 12pt; color: rgb(0, 0, 0);"> Best Regards</div> 
> > <div dir="ltr" style="font-family: Aptos, Aptos_MSFontService, 
> > -apple-system, Roboto, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif; font-size: 12pt; 
> > color: rgb(0, 0, 0);"> <br> </div> <div dir="ltr" style="font-family: 
> > Aptos, Aptos_MSFontService, -apple-system, Roboto, Arial, Helvetica, 
> > sans-serif; font-size: 12pt; color: rgb(0, 0, 0);"> Roland&nbsp;</div> 
> > <div dir="ltr" style="font-family: Aptos, Aptos_MSFontService, 
> > -apple-system, Roboto, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif; font-size: 12pt; 
> > color: rgb(0, 0, 0);"> <br> </div> <div 
> > id="ms-outlook-mobile-body-separator-line" 
> > data-applydefaultfontstyles="true" style="font-family: Aptos, 
> > Aptos_MSFontService, -apple-system, Roboto, Arial, Helvetica, 
> > sans-serif; font-size: 12pt;" dir="ltr"> <div dir="ltr" 
> > style="font-family: Aptos, Aptos_MSFontService, -apple-system, Roboto, 
> > Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif; font-size: 12pt;"> <br> </div> </div> 
> > <div style="font-family: Aptos, Aptos_MSFontService, -apple-system, 
> > Roboto, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif; font-size: 12pt; color: rgb(0, 
> > 0, 0);" id="ms-outlook-mobile-signature" dir="ltr"> </div> <div 
> > id="mail-editor-reference-message-container" 
> > class="ms-outlook-mobile-reference-message">
> > <div id="mail-editor-reference-message-container">
> > <hr style="display: inline-block; width: 98%;"> <div 
> > id="divRplyFwdMsg" dir="ltr"><span style="font-family: Calibri, 
> > sans-serif;"><b>Von:</b> Dan Voyer IETF 
> > &lt;danvoyerwork@gmail.com&gt;<br>
> > <b>Gesendet:</b> Mittwoch, Juli 22, 2026 9:26 AM<br> <b>An:</b> Mahesh 
> > Jethanandani &lt;mjethanandani@gmail.com&gt;<br>
> > <b>Cc:</b> ainetops@ietf.org &lt;ainetops@ietf.org&gt;; nmop@ietf.org 
> > &lt;nmop@ietf.org&gt;; opsawg &lt;opsawg@ietf.org&gt;<br> 
> > <b>Betreff:</b> [ainetops] Re: [OPSAWG]AIOPS Side Meeting [Was Re: 
> > Agenda for the Side Meeting: AI-Driven Network Operations — IETF 126, 
> > Fri 24 Jul, 08:00 CEST]</span> <div style="font-family: Calibri, 
> > sans-serif;">&nbsp;</div> </div> <div dir="ltr">H Mahesh,</div> <div 
> > dir="ltr"><br> </div> <div dir="ltr">Is the side-meeting going or did 
> > you shut it down since no one took charge ?</div> <div dir="ltr"><br> 
> > </div> <div dir="ltr">And, perhaps since you proposed that 
> > side-meeting, is there any possibility that you run it ?&nbsp;</div> 
> > <div dir="ltr"><br> </div> <div dir="ltr">Dan</div> <br> <div 
> > dir="ltr" class="gmail_attr">On Sun, Jul 19, 2026 at 9:08 PM Mahesh 
> > Jethanandani &lt;<a 
> > href="mailto:mjethanandani@gmail.com">mjethanandani@gmail.com</a>&gt; 
> > wrote:</div> <blockquote style="margin: 0px 0px 0px 0.8ex; 
> > padding-left: 1ex; border-left: 1px solid rgb(204, 204, 204);"> <div 
> > class="gmail_quote">Hi All,</div> <div dir="ltr" 
> > class="gmail_quote"><br> </div> <div class="gmail_quote">When I 
> > proposed the AIOPS side meeting, I asked if anyone was willing to step 
> > up and fill the roles needed to run it. To date, no one has 
> > volunteered for any of them. I understand the turnaround has been 
> > short, but without these roles  filled, the meeting has no one driving 
> > it and won't be worth holding.</div> <div dir="ltr" 
> > class="gmail_quote"><br> </div> <div class="gmail_quote">If you're a 
> > would-be proponent and want to see AIOPS work happen in the IETF, this 
> > is the moment to step up:</div> <div dir="ltr" 
> > class="gmail_quote"><br> </div> <div class="gmail_quote">Take charge 
> > of the agenda</div> <div class="gmail_quote">Work the draft of a 
> > problem statement</div> <div class="gmail_quote">Own the pen on the 
> > charter text</div> <div class="gmail_quote">Show up and demonstrate 
> > real interest</div> <div dir="ltr" class="gmail_quote"><br> </div> 
> > <div class="gmail_quote">If a core group hasn't formed by Wednesday, 
> > July 22, I will cancel the side meeting.</div> <div dir="ltr" 
> > class="gmail_quote"><br> </div> <div class="gmail_quote">Cheers,</div> 
> > <div dir="ltr" class="gmail_quote"><br> </div> <blockquote> <div 
> > class="gmail_quote">On Jul 13, 2026, at 9:16 PM, Mahesh Jethanandani 
> > &lt;<a href="mailto:mjethanandani@gmail.com" 
> > target="_blank">mjethanandani@gmail.com</a>&gt; wrote:</div> <div 
> > dir="ltr" class="gmail_quote"><br> </div> <div class="gmail_quote" 
> > style="text-align: left; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; 
> > font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 12px;"> Volunteers needed to help 
> > run the meeting</div> <div class="gmail_quote" style="text-align: 
> > left; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; font-family: Helvetica; 
> > font-size: 12px;"> ------------------------------------------</div>
> > <div class="gmail_quote" style="text-align: left; text-indent: 0px; 
> > text-transform: none; font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 12px;"> A few 
> > operational roles are still open for running this session - 
> > separate</div> <div class="gmail_quote" style="text-align: left; 
> > text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; font-family: Helvetica; 
> > font-size: 12px;"> from chairing the proposed working group itself. 
> > Room capacity is limited;</div> <div class="gmail_quote" 
> > style="text-align: left; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; 
> > font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 12px;"> preference for in-room 
> > seating will be given to those who take one of</div> <div 
> > class="gmail_quote" style="text-align: left; text-indent: 0px; 
> > text-transform: none; font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 12px;"> these 
> > on:</div> <div dir="ltr" class="gmail_quote" style="text-align: left; 
> > text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; font-family: Helvetica; 
> > font-size: 12px;"> <br> </div> <div class="gmail_quote" 
> > style="text-align: left; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; 
> > font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 12px;"> &nbsp; - Co-chair 
> > (checklist owner): tracks the Part B checklist live so the</div> <div 
> > class="gmail_quote" style="text-align: left; text-indent: 0px; 
> > text-transform: none; font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 12px;"> 
> > &nbsp; &nbsp; co-chair can stay focused on the room</div> <div 
> > class="gmail_quote" style="text-align: left; text-indent: 0px; 
> > text-transform: none; font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 12px;"> 
> > &nbsp; - Co-chair (clock &amp; consensus): runs the clock at each 
> > agenda-block</div> <div class="gmail_quote" style="text-align: left; 
> > text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; font-family: Helvetica; 
> > font-size: 12px;"> &nbsp; &nbsp; boundary and calls rough consensus 
> > alongside the co-chair</div> <div class="gmail_quote" 
> > style="text-align: left; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; 
> > font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 12px;"> &nbsp; - Notes-pad owner: 
> > opens a shared pad before the meeting and captures</div> <div 
> > class="gmail_quote" style="text-align: left; text-indent: 0px; 
> > text-transform: none; font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 12px;"> 
> > &nbsp; &nbsp; the roll call, deliverables, and objections live</div> 
> > <div class="gmail_quote" style="text-align: left; text-indent: 0px; 
> > text-transform: none; font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 12px;"> 
> > &nbsp; - Jabber/WebEx monitor: relays remote comments and hands into 
> > the room</div> <div class="gmail_quote" style="text-align: left; 
> > text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; font-family: Helvetica; 
> > font-size: 12px;"> &nbsp; &nbsp; queue</div> <div class="gmail_quote" 
> > style="text-align: left; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; 
> > font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 12px;"> &nbsp; - Breakout group 
> > leads (4 needed): one each for YANG data models,</div> <div 
> > class="gmail_quote" style="text-align: left; text-indent: 0px; 
> > text-transform: none; font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 12px;"> 
> > &nbsp; &nbsp; protocol extensions, MCP, and BCP/governance, to keep 
> > the 09:10</div> <div class="gmail_quote" style="text-align: left; 
> > text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; font-family: Helvetica; 
> > font-size: 12px;"> &nbsp; &nbsp; deliverables breakout focused and 
> > report back</div> <div class="gmail_quote" style="text-align: left; 
> > text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; font-family: Helvetica; 
> > font-size: 12px;"> &nbsp; - Charter text owners (2 needed): own the 
> > charter text draft and</div> <div class="gmail_quote" 
> > style="text-align: left; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; 
> > font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 12px;"> &nbsp; &nbsp; drive it 
> > toward consensus, on-list before the next meeting and through</div> 
> > <div class="gmail_quote" style="text-align: left; text-indent: 0px; 
> > text-transform: none; font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 12px;"> 
> > &nbsp; &nbsp; to a final version after</div> </blockquote> <div 
> > dir="ltr" class="gmail_quote"><br> </div> <div dir="auto" 
> > class="gmail_quote" style="text-align: left; text-indent: 0px; 
> > text-transform: none; font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 12px; color: 
> > rgb(0, 0, 0);"> <br> Mahesh Jethanandani</div> <div dir="auto" 
> > class="gmail_quote" style="text-align: left; text-indent: 0px; 
> > text-transform: none; font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 12px; color: 
> > rgb(0, 0, 0);"> <a href="mailto:mjethanandani@gmail.com" 
> > target="_blank">mjethanandani@gmail.com</a></div>
> > <div dir="ltr" class="gmail_quote" style="text-align: left; 
> > text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; font-family: Helvetica; 
> > font-size: 12px; color: rgb(0, 0, 0);"> <br> </div> <div dir="ltr" 
> > class="gmail_quote" style="text-align: left; text-transform: none; 
> > font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 12px; color: rgb(0, 0, 0);"> <br> 
> > </div> <div dir="ltr" class="gmail_quote" style="text-align: left; 
> > text-transform: none; font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 12px; color: 
> > rgb(0, 0, 0);"> <br> </div> <div dir="ltr" class="gmail_quote"><br> 
> > <br> </div> <div dir="ltr" class="gmail_quote"><br> </div> <div 
> > class="gmail_quote">_______________________________________________<br
> > > OPSAWG mailing list -- <a href="mailto:opsawg@ietf.org" 
> > target="_blank">opsawg@ietf.org</a><br>
> > To unsubscribe send an email to <a href="mailto:opsawg-leave@ietf.org" 
> > target="_blank"> opsawg-leave@ietf.org</a></div> </blockquote> </div> 
> > </div>
> > 
> > 
> > </div></blockquote></div></body></html>
> > _______________________________________________
> > OPSAWG mailing list -- opsawg@ietf.org To unsubscribe send an email to 
> > opsawg-leave@ietf.org
> 
> 
> --
> ---
> tte@cs.fau.de
> 
> _______________________________________________
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> To unsubscribe send an email to nmrg-leave@irtf.org

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---
tte@cs.fau.de

[Tools-discuss] tools-discuss: side meetings vani… 'Toerless Eckert'
[Tools-discuss] Re: tools-discuss: side meetings … Nicolas Giard
[Tools-discuss] Re: [126attendees] tools-discuss:… Marc Blanchet
[Tools-discuss] Re: [126attendees] tools-discuss:… Marc Blanchet
[Tools-discuss] Re: [126attendees] tools-discuss:… Jay Daley
[Tools-discuss] Re: [126attendees] Re: tools-disc… Grace Rachmany
[Tools-discuss] Re: [126attendees] Re: tools-disc… Nicolas Giard
[Tools-discuss] Re: [126attendees] Re: tools-disc… Mirja Kuehlewind
[Tools-discuss] Re: tools-discuss: side meetings … Toerless Eckert
[Tools-discuss] Re: tools-discuss: side meetings … Yaron Sheffer
[Tools-discuss] Re: tools-discuss: side meetings … Nicolas Giard