Re: [v6ops] IPv6-Only Preferred DHCPv4 option

Lorenzo Colitti <lorenzo@google.com> Wed, 04 December 2019 23:57 UTC

Return-Path: <lorenzo@google.com>
X-Original-To: v6ops@ietfa.amsl.com
Delivered-To: v6ops@ietfa.amsl.com
Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6872B12004D for <v6ops@ietfa.amsl.com>; Wed, 4 Dec 2019 15:57:34 -0800 (PST)
X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com
X-Spam-Flag: NO
X-Spam-Score: -17.499
X-Spam-Level:
X-Spam-Status: No, score=-17.499 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIMWL_WL_MED=-0.001, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, ENV_AND_HDR_SPF_MATCH=-0.5, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE=-0.0001, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001, USER_IN_DEF_DKIM_WL=-7.5, USER_IN_DEF_SPF_WL=-7.5] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no
Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (2048-bit key) header.d=google.com
Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id sfpZLMTv0yMW for <v6ops@ietfa.amsl.com>; Wed, 4 Dec 2019 15:57:32 -0800 (PST)
Received: from mail-io1-xd33.google.com (mail-io1-xd33.google.com [IPv6:2607:f8b0:4864:20::d33]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 6D49012002F for <v6ops@ietf.org>; Wed, 4 Dec 2019 15:57:32 -0800 (PST)
Received: by mail-io1-xd33.google.com with SMTP id j13so1681062ioe.0 for <v6ops@ietf.org>; Wed, 04 Dec 2019 15:57:32 -0800 (PST)
DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=google.com; s=20161025; h=mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date:message-id:subject:to :cc; bh=/yEbqBuhc7VHdPgsut9MqT3uP6N04RwPbRCymkbTyhU=; b=ptWpZA0Vs1cgbyf8rwchMk4nMjP08cOFnU2rC83QDG2Z+ryAZOckcyKJWKaIpTOVAY E7u0+QhD6AER3QIAtrGferUaf4A4Hl2OpFo1PDWsnV740ppsq749PKLmgpnKOByFg4K4 +qZ2n+mWHi9zlxYG+hyyVyhE8X/ZUVvCILtDT/gVs+05qNpqe2MwSopQQZxjNRlnaKwd Z6vPKlZKL1N7NfBmt6gRdUR7M1OQIA2r7CoEJ95zK5fA9gyXt/4ILd//bYYyiDHoUmvq lZhp6/sQHO0byXDFwy/Ib1e825mvNXmRb+ixjYiF+G4ekdw+UFKEtSCkYWk1CDunaObZ dk9A==
X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date :message-id:subject:to:cc; bh=/yEbqBuhc7VHdPgsut9MqT3uP6N04RwPbRCymkbTyhU=; b=cPwtgpuUyE0IOem0bEVNpIp5bszgkMuEr45Eo9nZZvK7L0us9u/0aJ3DcdH25zMfyC xnNHWGPZfLD6ZbAArR9tK2qRcNrwANj4zoVneg3NdHbuDn/mfxVo5T0N8m6EYm3S0LfR FwO5y4e4E4JU7g2P7deoTUZ2WRLxYITzj1xry2C2zeI5zE6WmQyKHEeBcm5sTKjd5G+V lWQRRu774Myu3fOZTbD7UdfrF1+RTIV69jaSgCEJH1/L/OhVRNpKGj03vtznhksdthOk n/jLhMfy2LlCU2t6OMIP0wuMhzm+xMDdVsIk6Hm6PALrB9RlKLL3LHc0kEww/exL1Atz ji3Q==
X-Gm-Message-State: APjAAAW5eZLVlJ0laoX7CF4Wx+GJRql4ypkqIenbjI5CSYwmJT84h4he Kj8aVQ2SRMDdlkAgasmQ+d2fksrTHHCBiwiHG6on3w==
X-Google-Smtp-Source: APXvYqw1Lk03nCcQlxoVDk1+6d3LXziHnXzFJqR2X3fPbrnc36wYvbPsYvvHb7UtKME8/H1KkdiaM4wRv7lT3OfW/gQ=
X-Received: by 2002:a6b:ee17:: with SMTP id i23mr4491321ioh.0.1575503851402; Wed, 04 Dec 2019 15:57:31 -0800 (PST)
MIME-Version: 1.0
References: <CAFU7BAR1JLUZps=CAqJfeQtUf-xQ88RYvgYrPCP+QP0Ter7YFg@mail.gmail.com> <E03BBE6C-3BED-4D49-8F79-0A1B313EFD9D@apple.com> <28594.1575483729@localhost> <7ac18a46-31d9-74cc-117a-0fd908413aac@gmail.com> <9bd73ee1-46f7-5084-06a6-59c7b391f9cb@foobar.org>
In-Reply-To: <9bd73ee1-46f7-5084-06a6-59c7b391f9cb@foobar.org>
From: Lorenzo Colitti <lorenzo@google.com>
Date: Thu, 05 Dec 2019 08:57:19 +0900
Message-ID: <CAKD1Yr0KPfFvk7Y49WkiVnm1q0E6i1u1hi4p_x56=p+kP9g=0g@mail.gmail.com>
To: Nick Hilliard <nick@foobar.org>
Cc: Brian E Carpenter <brian.e.carpenter@gmail.com>, "v6ops@ietf.org WG" <v6ops@ietf.org>
Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="00000000000068481d0598e993b1"
Archived-At: <https://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/msg/v6ops/BNbt9fcL_QZm0IaOv9voeXIG78w>
Subject: Re: [v6ops] IPv6-Only Preferred DHCPv4 option
X-BeenThere: v6ops@ietf.org
X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29
Precedence: list
List-Id: v6ops discussion list <v6ops.ietf.org>
List-Unsubscribe: <https://www.ietf.org/mailman/options/v6ops>, <mailto:v6ops-request@ietf.org?subject=unsubscribe>
List-Archive: <https://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/browse/v6ops/>
List-Post: <mailto:v6ops@ietf.org>
List-Help: <mailto:v6ops-request@ietf.org?subject=help>
List-Subscribe: <https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/v6ops>, <mailto:v6ops-request@ietf.org?subject=subscribe>
X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 04 Dec 2019 23:57:34 -0000

On Thu, Dec 5, 2019 at 5:43 AM Nick Hilliard <nick@foobar.org> wrote:

> > As an ex-author of an ex-draft that suggested using IPv6 to tell
> > hosts to avoid IPv4, I'm curious to know whether a draft that
> > suggests using IPv4 to tell hosts to prefer IPv6 will also be accused
> > of being an operational nightmare.
>
> I haven't read the draft yet - and won't get to it for a couple of days
> - but am also curious about why this approach is better than the other
> way around :-)
>

Here are a couple of reasons why we believe this proposal will fare better
than the IPv6-only flag:

   1. It has a clear goal and clear semantics.  There was little consensus
   on the meaning of the IPv6-only flag. Did it mean that there was no IPv4 on
   the link? That the network should not provide IPv4 addresses? Or that hosts
   should never send packets with IPv4 ethertypes? If the latter, why not drop
   the packets in the infrastructure? But then, what about link-local? And so
   on. In contrast, this option's goal is very clear (conserve IPv4 addresses)
   and its meaning is very clear: here's an IPv4 address if you want it, but
   please don't use it if you don't need it.
   2. It is using a protocol that already configures IPv4 to configure
   IPv4. The IPv6-only flag was trying to affect IPv4 using an IPv6 protocol,
   and that allows attackers to mount attacks on existing networks that have
   not deployed IPv6 and thus have no IPv6 security measures in place.