Re: [v6ops] IPv6-Only Preferred DHCPv4 option

Tomek Mrugalski <tomasz.mrugalski@gmail.com> Mon, 09 December 2019 23:41 UTC

Return-Path: <tomasz.mrugalski@gmail.com>
X-Original-To: v6ops@ietfa.amsl.com
Delivered-To: v6ops@ietfa.amsl.com
Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 11959120288; Mon, 9 Dec 2019 15:41:03 -0800 (PST)
X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com
X-Spam-Flag: NO
X-Spam-Score: -1.998
X-Spam-Level:
X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.998 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, FREEMAIL_FROM=0.001, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_NONE=-0.0001, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no
Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (2048-bit key) header.d=gmail.com
Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id c8f7fDehRzal; Mon, 9 Dec 2019 15:41:01 -0800 (PST)
Received: from mail-lj1-x233.google.com (mail-lj1-x233.google.com [IPv6:2a00:1450:4864:20::233]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id E32851200F6; Mon, 9 Dec 2019 15:41:00 -0800 (PST)
Received: by mail-lj1-x233.google.com with SMTP id u17so17698629lja.4; Mon, 09 Dec 2019 15:41:00 -0800 (PST)
DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20161025; h=subject:to:cc:references:from:message-id:date:user-agent :mime-version:in-reply-to:content-language; bh=xOKqOG2GYq0jDkzK4c3nIs57/JEuxzfPzZkXvz9YJeU=; b=KTxZmlJMmuQG2mR8xrJYoNt/IF7mdnMQ/gagAfZELYoYCjIDMT4T40mnwJqlPt0h0h yfgwd8pWkfb8ysYj3J4gr0glcSwGvE9vRGGFPZdQfcjiCVIMXYLZ+XdnjlPgi6YagSR/ h+guw/bBpAy0ad/p1F+Xc66fHAHnC2QZ6TuTwUeoD74Ar6n7QTiv3K7O8h8PgHM2kSTs yeJkgy+JTBoSjMPWREbmSPx0NqBXHSYBLqmAGETkmAuKfmUC4FWiOtlwPwUwmRKwgZvD ASZh6kW1fZcq8mGlVZovOH0slKScQ7pA+CuCP7PNqWWD6nZ1FNCiT6snJTsRJU9Lc9fr olTQ==
X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:subject:to:cc:references:from:message-id:date :user-agent:mime-version:in-reply-to:content-language; bh=xOKqOG2GYq0jDkzK4c3nIs57/JEuxzfPzZkXvz9YJeU=; b=FTrw2BnVQktMNtx4QoWdIKtT386y9KSaiHzfFvcPKSbVG5c5VHbU1oRkxLETYrdXU/ 5+7p87NCwPug8YhqHTZyeD4CbhR+BDUN15T5umxVA8zjGTYd79n2GHOK0SLVBwYTsLcH R0DwYRBah2FImvbLlu3RV91XV8nNiXrkLFxvVO7k4igBM5NOKLrR6lLacUu1uMWt7QnR RYdS3veeSfiFKTSRe/LMNzjlLLOhsLypfq+4lFWKKke0UMyB24BhdJLe7Ju7MVhcW+CY CRQivccEHPs2twk3s3PGmpdP6UMsjR629nFrDDTiaKd0wSVW8b/ZfYloFV1dK5h2QeU+ K01w==
X-Gm-Message-State: APjAAAX4XJRHHge20CazonI2k/GJoL5yembPLG1dOwj6tlPS5p8pOxKI f3vhA9iLh7dVPtj+X06286j/zGhLw05fMw==
X-Google-Smtp-Source: APXvYqyprV3Tub8ry6Z1s0OcwCjRxx1IXdQwAW30/5OMLtWsB1vli8zV/C3QSQdTn9C/gB+yidmJNA==
X-Received: by 2002:a2e:580c:: with SMTP id m12mr18304945ljb.150.1575934858862; Mon, 09 Dec 2019 15:40:58 -0800 (PST)
Received: from [192.168.1.100] (109241079151.gdansk.vectranet.pl. [109.241.79.151]) by smtp.gmail.com with ESMTPSA id 2sm659083ljq.38.2019.12.09.15.40.57 (version=TLS1_3 cipher=TLS_AES_128_GCM_SHA256 bits=128/128); Mon, 09 Dec 2019 15:40:57 -0800 (PST)
To: Ted Lemon <mellon@fugue.com>
Cc: "dhcwg@ietf.org" <dhcwg@ietf.org>, "v6ops@ietf.org" <v6ops@ietf.org>
References: <m1idEJQ-0000KPC@stereo.hq.phicoh.net> <EF1F2FB2-4FA0-4BCC-82B8-948EBE7915A6@fugue.com> <DM6PR11MB413793BCC3AFF44F7B8E101DCF5F0@DM6PR11MB4137.namprd11.prod.outlook.com> <8FD2BAAB-96D1-41F0-97A2-2D16CDAF999E@fugue.com>
From: Tomek Mrugalski <tomasz.mrugalski@gmail.com>
Message-ID: <27eb153c-4340-b79a-6c1e-6c15c9ff7b29@gmail.com>
Date: Tue, 10 Dec 2019 00:40:55 +0100
User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; Linux x86_64; rv:68.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/68.2.1
MIME-Version: 1.0
In-Reply-To: <8FD2BAAB-96D1-41F0-97A2-2D16CDAF999E@fugue.com>
Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="------------9909805CE1EFC048B83C9023"
Content-Language: en-US
Archived-At: <https://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/msg/v6ops/z3PFMNbN2ApWQ0hWKIIoiBB_HF8>
Subject: Re: [v6ops] IPv6-Only Preferred DHCPv4 option
X-BeenThere: v6ops@ietf.org
X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29
Precedence: list
List-Id: v6ops discussion list <v6ops.ietf.org>
List-Unsubscribe: <https://www.ietf.org/mailman/options/v6ops>, <mailto:v6ops-request@ietf.org?subject=unsubscribe>
List-Archive: <https://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/browse/v6ops/>
List-Post: <mailto:v6ops@ietf.org>
List-Help: <mailto:v6ops-request@ietf.org?subject=help>
List-Subscribe: <https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/v6ops>, <mailto:v6ops-request@ietf.org?subject=subscribe>
X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 09 Dec 2019 23:41:03 -0000

On 06.12.2019 17:02, Ted Lemon wrote:
> On Dec 6, 2019, at 6:45 AM, Bernie Volz (volz) <volz@cisco.com
> <mailto:volz@cisco.com>> wrote:
>> which requires fewer changes on the DHCP server implementation
>
> This is almost certainly not true.  In order for this to work, you’re
> going to have to have some special-purpose code to support it.  Better
> to do the clean solution than a hack that minimizes changes to the
> server at the expense of more complication in the client-server
> interaction.
This part of the discussion seems to have been mostly settled. But in
case it isn't, here's another opinion. As a DHCP server vendor, I'd very
much prefer no code changes. For several reasons:

1. You can start using the option now, without any server upgrades, just
tweak the server configuration to send one extra option. This is
expected to be a significant factor in the adoption process.

2. The basic DHCPv4 mechanism of clients requesting options in PRL and
the server sending them is decades old and there are tons of policy
mechanisms around it (send only when requested, force sending to
specific devices or class of devices, treat devices that request that
option as a separate class, etc.) These are all well understood by
network admins.

3. Extra logic requires extra testing. There may be incompatibilities,
especially with firewalls and relays that attempt to track state. Some
of them may be hard to detect.

Having said that, I'm willing to implement code changes if I have to.

Tomek