Re: [Cfrg] Response to the request to remove CFRG co-chair

"Dan Harkins" <dharkins@lounge.org> Fri, 10 January 2014 18:31 UTC

Return-Path: <dharkins@lounge.org>
X-Original-To: cfrg@ietfa.amsl.com
Delivered-To: cfrg@ietfa.amsl.com
Received: from localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id B87FE1AE155; Fri, 10 Jan 2014 10:31:08 -0800 (PST)
X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com
X-Spam-Flag: NO
X-Spam-Score: -3.867
X-Spam-Level:
X-Spam-Status: No, score=-3.867 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, IP_NOT_FRIENDLY=0.334, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-2.3, SPF_HELO_PASS=-0.001] autolearn=unavailable
Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id lrA9n3qvW_pA; Fri, 10 Jan 2014 10:31:07 -0800 (PST)
Received: from colo.trepanning.net (colo.trepanning.net [69.55.226.174]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1F3381AE037; Fri, 10 Jan 2014 10:31:07 -0800 (PST)
Received: from www.trepanning.net (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by colo.trepanning.net (Postfix) with ESMTP id F1EE7A88812E; Fri, 10 Jan 2014 10:30:41 -0800 (PST)
Received: from 69.12.173.8 (SquirrelMail authenticated user dharkins@lounge.org) by www.trepanning.net with HTTP; Fri, 10 Jan 2014 10:30:42 -0800 (PST)
Message-ID: <43f376df89848f630fd3b98aeca24ac9.squirrel@www.trepanning.net>
In-Reply-To: <CACsn0cnMuon3h8uHGVWLraF8wu1x=K-vKdQQeW-6uAfz4F6psA@mail.gmail.com>
References: <492D56BD-6F33-480D-877E-02D907C5F4AA@netapp.com> <CAGZ8ZG37MoEMaPwjJynCceGpjoPASXd5CC9AG1bzdm8ZFPpDtA@mail.gmail.com> <52CD4637.2070207@cisco.com> <20140108134213.GA26603@netbook.cypherspace.org> <853B0E5F-E5AC-4CE0-BCBC-602828D4AEE7@viega.org> <20140108151722.GA4441@netbook.cypherspace.org> <52CD7ACC.4060305@cs.tcd.ie> <CAGZ8ZG3ARN0AzPcRTKdnCJ0ndhxRUV6aVy2nrVWm-wGH20gsFA@mail.gmail.com> <52CE7744.7010904@cs.tcd.ie> <CAGZ8ZG3S-rtsu-Kgwkb_XVPbvS0HGzzsc6hwcs2xqeThHcbg5Q@mail.gmail.com> <52D01D6B.6040008@cs.tcd.ie> <CACsn0cnMuon3h8uHGVWLraF8wu1x=K-vKdQQeW-6uAfz4F6psA@mail.gmail.com>
Date: Fri, 10 Jan 2014 10:30:42 -0800 (PST)
From: "Dan Harkins" <dharkins@lounge.org>
To: "Watson Ladd" <watsonbladd@gmail.com>
User-Agent: SquirrelMail/1.4.14 [SVN]
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain;charset=iso-8859-1
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit
X-Priority: 3 (Normal)
Importance: Normal
Cc: Adam Back <adam@cypherspace.org>, "cfrg@irtf.org" <cfrg@irtf.org>, David McGrew <mcgrew@cisco.com>, "irtf-chair@irtf.org" <irtf-chair@irtf.org>, Trevor Perrin <trevp@trevp.net>, IAB IAB <iab@iab.org>
Subject: Re: [Cfrg] Response to the request to remove CFRG co-chair
X-BeenThere: cfrg@irtf.org
X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.15
Precedence: list
List-Id: Crypto Forum Research Group <cfrg.irtf.org>
List-Unsubscribe: <http://www.irtf.org/mailman/options/cfrg>, <mailto:cfrg-request@irtf.org?subject=unsubscribe>
List-Archive: <http://www.irtf.org/mail-archive/web/cfrg/>
List-Post: <mailto:cfrg@irtf.org>
List-Help: <mailto:cfrg-request@irtf.org?subject=help>
List-Subscribe: <http://www.irtf.org/mailman/listinfo/cfrg>, <mailto:cfrg-request@irtf.org?subject=subscribe>
X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 10 Jan 2014 18:31:08 -0000

On Fri, January 10, 2014 8:33 am, Watson Ladd wrote:
> On Fri, Jan 10, 2014 at 8:18 AM, Stephen Farrell
> <stephen.farrell@cs.tcd.ie> wrote:
>>
>> Trevor,
>>
>> Some responses below but I honestly think this exchange has
>> otherwise run its course.
>>
>> On 01/10/2014 03:35 AM, Trevor Perrin wrote:
>>> It's time
>>> for our leadership to summon their courage and take a stand.
>>
>> Taking a stand sounds lovely, but ineffective. I prefer that
>> we try to improve the Internet and harden it against pervasive
>> monitoring. If you think the IETF hasn't been working on that
>> then perhaps you need to pay more attention, for example, I
>> didn't notice any comment from you on the IETF LC for [1], nor
>> on the perpass list [2] since October, nor on the UTA list [3]
>> nor have I seen a submission from you for the upcoming IAB/W3C
>> workshop [4] on this topic that'll happen before IETF-89 (but
>> you do still have time for that last so why not shoot one in:-).
>>
>>    [1] https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-farrell-perpass-attack
>>    [2] https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/perpass
>>    [3] https://tools.ietf.org/wg/uta/charters
>>    [4] https://www.w3.org/2014/strint/
>
> And this has made mass surveillance harder how?

  It will; it is work in that direction. Defining the problem and getting
people to think about various solutions are the first step towards
actually reaching that goal.

  You should note that Lao-tzu didn't say that the journey of a
thousand miles begins by taking a fashionable stand or by rebuking
something. It starts with a step. That step has been made.

  Dan.