Re: [DNSOP] extension of DoH to authoritative servers

Benno Overeinder <benno@NLnetLabs.nl> Wed, 13 February 2019 08:44 UTC

Return-Path: <benno@NLnetLabs.nl>
X-Original-To: dnsop@ietfa.amsl.com
Delivered-To: dnsop@ietfa.amsl.com
Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id D5DB812D84C for <dnsop@ietfa.amsl.com>; Wed, 13 Feb 2019 00:44:13 -0800 (PST)
X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com
X-Spam-Flag: NO
X-Spam-Score: -7
X-Spam-Level:
X-Spam-Status: No, score=-7 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_HI=-5, SPF_PASS=-0.001, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no
Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (1024-bit key) header.d=nlnetlabs.nl
Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id TxJ0MhPUFLQH for <dnsop@ietfa.amsl.com>; Wed, 13 Feb 2019 00:44:11 -0800 (PST)
Received: from dicht.nlnetlabs.nl (dicht.nlnetlabs.nl [IPv6:2a04:b900::1:0:0:10]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES256-GCM-SHA384 (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 6CEAE128CB7 for <dnsop@ietf.org>; Wed, 13 Feb 2019 00:44:11 -0800 (PST)
Received: from hydrogen.nlnetlabs.nl (unknown [IPv6:2a04:b900:0:1:60b2:a02d:a191:50b5]) by dicht.nlnetlabs.nl (Postfix) with ESMTPSA id 7DEE110302; Wed, 13 Feb 2019 09:44:08 +0100 (CET)
Authentication-Results: dicht.nlnetlabs.nl; dmarc=pass (p=none dis=none) header.from=NLnetLabs.nl
Authentication-Results: dicht.nlnetlabs.nl; spf=pass smtp.mailfrom=benno@NLnetLabs.nl
DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/simple; d=nlnetlabs.nl; s=default; t=1550047448; bh=oMJ8OfdN+0fjj9vl283voA5vjQC5fVCphZdi2EB7SU0=; h=Subject:To:Cc:References:From:Date:In-Reply-To; b=zPb7vV2BIqRpNtXDO7wEQYOgodPM+1PG/yO3ekPwWC3VebiJVuOqkwzjfd+GAX951 hIZYvMdG7/81dup+5l4OMs5vHjEWUJUw2D6Edz4Wmiqm4vWVbtwihILgwmd/xY4fU3 hFvflsZ6oYnGVKeCauftQxrNgQkOXW8niPpPMc7M=
To: Stephane Bortzmeyer <bortzmeyer@nic.fr>, "zuopeng@cnnic.cn" <zuopeng@cnnic.cn>
Cc: dnsop <dnsop@ietf.org>
References: <2019021215560470371417@cnnic.cn> <20190212083436.5uab52hesymxzuur@nic.fr>
From: Benno Overeinder <benno@NLnetLabs.nl>
Openpgp: preference=signencrypt
Message-ID: <fb78b80b-90d6-8bed-2a3f-10063f6206ba@NLnetLabs.nl>
Date: Wed, 13 Feb 2019 09:44:08 +0100
User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Macintosh; Intel Mac OS X 10.14; rv:60.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/60.5.0
MIME-Version: 1.0
In-Reply-To: <20190212083436.5uab52hesymxzuur@nic.fr>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8
Content-Language: en-US
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
Archived-At: <https://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/msg/dnsop/VoBMnh5JEEuOlXW1jBdrcH9IWFg>
Subject: Re: [DNSOP] extension of DoH to authoritative servers
X-BeenThere: dnsop@ietf.org
X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29
Precedence: list
List-Id: IETF DNSOP WG mailing list <dnsop.ietf.org>
List-Unsubscribe: <https://www.ietf.org/mailman/options/dnsop>, <mailto:dnsop-request@ietf.org?subject=unsubscribe>
List-Archive: <https://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/browse/dnsop/>
List-Post: <mailto:dnsop@ietf.org>
List-Help: <mailto:dnsop-request@ietf.org?subject=help>
List-Subscribe: <https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/dnsop>, <mailto:dnsop-request@ietf.org?subject=subscribe>
X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 13 Feb 2019 08:44:14 -0000

On 12/02/2019 09:34, Stephane Bortzmeyer wrote:
> On Tue, Feb 12, 2019 at 03:56:04PM +0800,
>  zuopeng@cnnic.cn <zuopeng@cnnic.cn>; wrote 
>  a message of 546 lines which said:
> 
>> DNSSEC is not necessary anymore
> 
> This is clearly false. DoH provides _channel security_ DNSSEC provides
> _content security_ (or object security). This is a very important
> difference in security (we have JWS even if we have HTTPS, for
> instance).

Indeed, you might want to look at one of the presentations by Willem
Toorop and myself.  In respect of channel security, DoH and DoT with
authenticated TLS are similar.

- RIPE 76 DNS WG
  https://ripe76.ripe.net/presentations/56-sunrise-DoT-sunset-DNSSEC.pdf
  https://ripe76.ripe.net/archives/video/67

- ICANN DNS Symposium 2018

https://www.icann.org/en/system/files/files/presentation-sunrise-dns-tls-sunset-dnssec-13jul18-en.pdf

- APNIC/RIPE blog post: Sunrise DNS over TLS, sunset DNSSEC?
  https://blog.apnic.net/2018/08/17/sunrise-dns-over-tls-sunset-dnssec/

https://labs.ripe.net/Members/willem_toorop/sunrise-dns-over-tls-sunset-dnssec

-- Benno

-- 
Benno J. Overeinder
NLnet Labs
https://www.nlnetlabs.nl/