Re: [hybi] Protocol simplicity and the "amateur programmer" standard

Greg Wilkins <gregw@webtide.com> Mon, 26 July 2010 16:52 UTC

Return-Path: <gregw@webtide.com>
X-Original-To: hybi@core3.amsl.com
Delivered-To: hybi@core3.amsl.com
Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 895723A6816 for <hybi@core3.amsl.com>; Mon, 26 Jul 2010 09:52:54 -0700 (PDT)
X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com
X-Spam-Flag: NO
X-Spam-Score: -1.742
X-Spam-Level:
X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.742 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=0.234, BAYES_00=-2.599, FM_FORGED_GMAIL=0.622, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001]
Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id y1AFQxPE5sES for <hybi@core3.amsl.com>; Mon, 26 Jul 2010 09:52:53 -0700 (PDT)
Received: from mail-fx0-f44.google.com (mail-fx0-f44.google.com [209.85.161.44]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 7FB7C3A6407 for <hybi@ietf.org>; Mon, 26 Jul 2010 09:52:53 -0700 (PDT)
Received: by fxm1 with SMTP id 1so244449fxm.31 for <hybi@ietf.org>; Mon, 26 Jul 2010 09:53:14 -0700 (PDT)
MIME-Version: 1.0
Received: by 10.223.123.145 with SMTP id p17mr6624836far.90.1280163194130; Mon, 26 Jul 2010 09:53:14 -0700 (PDT)
Received: by 10.223.112.129 with HTTP; Mon, 26 Jul 2010 09:53:13 -0700 (PDT)
In-Reply-To: <4C4DACCC.3050900@opera.com>
References: <ECF0E97F-1DA2-4662-BA48-F68B65AA8179@apple.com> <4C4D66AF.9030905@opera.com> <DAA95AEE-300E-4C2D-BBCA-02D0385EE482@apple.com> <4C4D760A.9060906@opera.com> <C1B1A36F-55E1-4526-B535-3F9CF27F1EB7@brandedcode.com> <AANLkTikWb1w5PrH2XoB4kVHY+u=BZxwh1Bm3oPwdZhbf@mail.gmail.com> <4C4DA92D.8010105@opera.com> <AANLkTikobVGTxbs3XqLv25WXd9VkZtB4vmxUJGc5uwE1@mail.gmail.com> <4C4DACCC.3050900@opera.com>
Date: Tue, 27 Jul 2010 02:53:13 +1000
Message-ID: <AANLkTi=5ATVGxwJFHvBJ62GAXaUoZ2dn8OM98mc6S3uq@mail.gmail.com>
From: Greg Wilkins <gregw@webtide.com>
To: James Graham <jgraham@opera.com>
Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="0016368e33ec70d31f048c4d389d"
Cc: hybi@ietf.org
Subject: Re: [hybi] Protocol simplicity and the "amateur programmer" standard
X-BeenThere: hybi@ietf.org
X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9
Precedence: list
List-Id: Server-Initiated HTTP <hybi.ietf.org>
List-Unsubscribe: <https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/hybi>, <mailto:hybi-request@ietf.org?subject=unsubscribe>
List-Archive: <http://www.ietf.org/mail-archive/web/hybi>
List-Post: <mailto:hybi@ietf.org>
List-Help: <mailto:hybi-request@ietf.org?subject=help>
List-Subscribe: <https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/hybi>, <mailto:hybi-request@ietf.org?subject=subscribe>
X-List-Received-Date: Mon, 26 Jul 2010 16:52:54 -0000

On 27 July 2010 01:42, James Graham <jgraham@opera.com> wrote:

>
> Will people still be willing to make breaking changes in, say, a year, if
> it has come to pass that Mozilla, Google, Apple and Opera are all shipping
> something like the current protocol and a non-trivial amount of content is
> using it?
>

Code running in the browsers should be dependent only on the API and the
behavioural contract that it makes.  I think that there is a large amount of
freedom to change the protocol beneath the websocket API and the application
code will hardly notice (except maybe it will work more reliably).

The servers will have to change, but they should also be protecting their
applications with APIs.  Yet another reason that it would be crazy for
applications to develop their own protocol implementations.

regards