Re: [ipwave] [117attendees] Response to: Announcement for IETF-117 IPMON Side Meeting

[Robert Moskowitz <[e-mail]>]

Here is a reply from a colleague:

Crash avoidance on the ground is done by exchanging individual vehicle 
state data using the SAE J2735 Basic Safety Message data unit.  The 
actual strategy that makes use of the data unit is up to the equipment 
in the receiving unit.  There is no standard for strategy but there are 
several reference implementations including the one available from 
Danlaw https://www.danlawinc.com/

=================================

this is 2D and for "Aerial Vehicles", the data model will need enhancements.

On 7/25/23 15:44, Robert Moskowitz wrote:
> I am sadden that I will miss this gathering.  I will be in CFRG.
>
> That said, this is interesting work, BUT how does it conform with work 
> in SAE for proactive collision prevention and the SAE messaging for same?
>
> I am aware of the SAE work but do not have any of the document and 
> packet terms here.  I have reached out to a colleague and don't know 
> if they will answer in time.
>
> Now on to things in the air...
>
> We are entering into the Religious layer of the stacks.   Are they 
> Uncrewed Aircraft Systems and part of the National Air Space that need 
> to interact with other Aircraft, or are they Uncrewed Aerial Vehicles 
> that need to interact with things within the Urban framework.  This is 
> truly at the Religious layer (and also Financial!).
>
> If we are talking about Air Taxis, it is a little of each.
>
> If we are talking about small delivery UA, hobbyist UA, long-range 
> cargo UA, the CAAs view them needing to interact in the NAS and sc&%! 
> the rest.  That this focus on Urban Air Mobility is distracting from 
> safe management of the NAS.
>
> Air Taxis are a little of both so they are caught having to do both.
>
> There is the concept of Operations Over People, and if you want to run 
> your UA in OOP (and yes, no oops!), there are regulations to follow.  
> Better air-to-ground communications MAY help, but.
>
> Look at package delivery; it should be easy.  But
>
>
> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=J-M98KLgaUU
> 5 minutes in, shows how Pheonix would never work.  As things stand 
> now.  This work IMO will not fix this problem.
>
> To 'fix' this we need Tactical, A2A, Detect And Avoid (DAA) with UA 
> and Civil/General Aviation.  Not UA to cars.  So see:
>
> https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-moskowitz-drip-a2x-adhoc-session/
> and
> https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-moskowitz-drip-efficient-a2g-comm/
>
> I already have some UA vendors working on a2x-adhoc.
>
> The later will probably of more interest/value in rural/long haul.  
> Cellular has pretty much already won in urban.
>
> Then for safety in the NAS until we get serious Network Remote ID (and 
> even then, as much will never really pay up for that), see:
>
> https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-moskowitz-drip-crowd-sourced-rid/
>
> My colleagues at AX Enterprize are already working on deploying parts 
> of this in critical areas.  It is technology like that that will 
> change where the geo-fencing is to permit delivery service to operate 
> close to airports and the like.  To the point that FAA has awarded a 
> lot of money to one of their favorite companies to develop what I have 
> already shown how to do.  Sigh.
>
> In conclusion:
>
> This is interesting work with caveats.
>
> What is the auto industry doing on their own?
>
> What aspects of airspace usage makes sense to include.  (here be 
> dragons.  :) ).
>
> Thank you.
>
> Bob
>
> On 7/24/23 22:18, Mr. Jaehoon Paul Jeong wrote:
>> Hi all,
>> Here are the slides for the IPMON Side Meeting tomorrow.
>>
>> Thanks for your interest and support.
>>
>> Best Regards,
>> Paul
>>
>>
>> On Sun, Jul 23, 2023 at 10:54 PM Mr. Jaehoon Paul Jeong 
>> <[e-mail]> wrote:
>>
>>     Hi IPWAVE WG,
>>     We will have the 3rd side meeting for IPMON (IPv6 Mobile Object
>>     Networking).
>>
>>     This is the time and place for an on-off hybrid meeting.
>>     --------------------------------------------------------------------------------
>>     Time: 3:00-4:30pm on July 25 (Tuesday), 2023 (GMT-7)
>>     Place: Continental 2-3 in Headquarter Hotel - Hilton San
>>     Francisco Union Square
>>
>>     Zoom Meeting ID: 882 4446 1841
>>     Password: 500695
>>     Link:
>>     https://us02web.zoom.us/j/88244461841?pwd=aGlWQkF2UUhBYWNVbTBMdnkxeWhvUT09
>>     --------------------------------------------------------------------------------
>>
>>     The agenda of IPMON side meeting is as follows:
>>     - Welcome and Agenda Bashing in the IPMON Side Meeting - Jaehoon
>>     Paul Jeong (5 min)
>>
>>     - IETF-117 IPMON Hackathon Project - Hyeonah Jung (10 min)
>>     .
>>     https://github.com/IETF-Hackathon/ietf117-project-presentations/blob/main/IETF117-IPMON-Hackathon-Project-v05.pdf
>>
>>     - IPv6 Mobile Object Networking (IPMON): Problem Statement and
>>     Use Cases - Jaehoon Paul Jeong (30 min)
>>     .
>>     https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-jeong-6man-ipmon-problem-statement/
>>     . https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-jeong-6man-ipv6-over-5g-v2x/
>>
>>     - Context-Aware Navigation Protocol for IP-Based Vehicular
>>     Networks - Junhee Kwon and Jaehoon Paul Jeong (15 min)
>>     .
>>     https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-jeong-ipwave-context-aware-navigator/
>>
>>     - Discussion and Next Step: Jaehoon Paul Jeong (30 min)
>>     --------------------------------------------------------------------------------
>>
>>     You are welcome to this hybrid side meeting for IPMON.
>>
>>     Thanks.
>>
>>     Best Regards,
>>     Paul
>>     -- 
>>     ===========================
>>     Mr. Jaehoon (Paul) Jeong, Ph.D.
>>     Associate Professor
>>     Department of Computer Science and Engineering
>>     Sungkyunkwan University
>>     Office: [phone]
>>     Email: [e-mail], [e-mail]
>>     Personal Homepage:
>>     http://iotlab.skku.edu/people-jaehoon-jeong.php
>>     <http://cpslab.skku.edu/people-jaehoon-jeong.php>
>>
>>
>
>

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