Re: [rfc-i] What do do about SVG

Michael Richardson <mcr+ietf@sandelman.ca> Wed, 16 December 2020 22:02 UTC

Return-Path: <rfc-interest-bounces@rfc-editor.org>
X-Original-To: ietfarch-rfc-interest-archive@ietfa.amsl.com
Delivered-To: ietfarch-rfc-interest-archive@ietfa.amsl.com
Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id E245F3A1153; Wed, 16 Dec 2020 14:02:41 -0800 (PST)
X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com
X-Spam-Flag: NO
X-Spam-Score: -2.65
X-Spam-Level:
X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.65 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, HEADER_FROM_DIFFERENT_DOMAINS=0.25, MAILING_LIST_MULTI=-1, SPF_PASS=-0.001, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no
Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id vp82wMs_3wK2; Wed, 16 Dec 2020 14:02:40 -0800 (PST)
Received: from rfc-editor.org (rfc-editor.org [4.31.198.49]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher AECDH-AES256-SHA (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 34F893A113D; Wed, 16 Dec 2020 14:02:40 -0800 (PST)
Received: from rfcpa.amsl.com (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by rfc-editor.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5A6C6F40764; Wed, 16 Dec 2020 14:02:32 -0800 (PST)
X-Original-To: rfc-interest@rfc-editor.org
Delivered-To: rfc-interest@rfc-editor.org
Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by rfc-editor.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id BA77CF40764 for <rfc-interest@rfc-editor.org>; Wed, 16 Dec 2020 14:02:30 -0800 (PST)
X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at rfc-editor.org
Received: from rfc-editor.org ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (rfcpa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id Rdpz10eYjVxy for <rfc-interest@rfc-editor.org>; Wed, 16 Dec 2020 14:02:26 -0800 (PST)
Received: from tuna.sandelman.ca (tuna.sandelman.ca [IPv6:2607:f0b0:f:3:216:3eff:fe7c:d1f3]) by rfc-editor.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 7EF7AF40763 for <rfc-interest@rfc-editor.org>; Wed, 16 Dec 2020 14:02:25 -0800 (PST)
Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by tuna.sandelman.ca (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5CE16389A9; Wed, 16 Dec 2020 17:05:12 -0500 (EST)
Received: from tuna.sandelman.ca ([127.0.0.1]) by localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with LMTP id VHhH9_KnDdAS; Wed, 16 Dec 2020 17:05:11 -0500 (EST)
Received: from sandelman.ca (obiwan.sandelman.ca [IPv6:2607:f0b0:f:2::247]) by tuna.sandelman.ca (Postfix) with ESMTP id 480CC389A8; Wed, 16 Dec 2020 17:05:11 -0500 (EST)
Received: from localhost (localhost [IPv6:::1]) by sandelman.ca (Postfix) with ESMTP id D974BAA9; Wed, 16 Dec 2020 17:02:28 -0500 (EST)
From: Michael Richardson <mcr+ietf@sandelman.ca>
To: Michael StJohns <msj@nthpermutation.com>
In-Reply-To: <d8d69f8b-8ff3-7f23-b228-02686df2340b@nthpermutation.com>
References: <f564019-d8b1-76c2-2768-c135d834dc32@iecc.com> <763b8195-6139-fb20-aa4e-2b4d89b5681c@gmail.com> <7b8ef1d3-f33b-fc1b-88d3-c399c7cb6279@alum.mit.edu> <0d979304-d3d6-3b8b-acab-7cbc37276250@joelhalpern.com> <916267c9-bf4c-7c0c-eb99-a24e73fc22df@gmail.com> <dca14b37-525a-ac60-20c2-8c8cbfb2830d@nostrum.com> <d8d69f8b-8ff3-7f23-b228-02686df2340b@nthpermutation.com>
X-Mailer: MH-E 8.6+git; nmh 1.7+dev; GNU Emacs 26.1
X-Face: $\n1pF)h^`}$H>Hk{L"x@)JS7<%Az}5RyS@k9X%29-lHB$Ti.V>2bi.~ehC0; <'$9xN5Ub# z!G,p`nR&p7Fz@^UXIn156S8.~^@MJ*mMsD7=QFeq%AL4m<nPbLgmtKK-5dC@#:k
MIME-Version: 1.0
Date: Wed, 16 Dec 2020 17:02:28 -0500
Message-ID: <7884.1608156148@localhost>
Subject: Re: [rfc-i] What do do about SVG
X-BeenThere: rfc-interest@rfc-editor.org
X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29
Precedence: list
List-Id: "A list for discussion of the RFC series and RFC Editor functions." <rfc-interest.rfc-editor.org>
List-Unsubscribe: <https://www.rfc-editor.org/mailman/options/rfc-interest>, <mailto:rfc-interest-request@rfc-editor.org?subject=unsubscribe>
List-Archive: <http://www.rfc-editor.org/pipermail/rfc-interest/>
List-Post: <mailto:rfc-interest@rfc-editor.org>
List-Help: <mailto:rfc-interest-request@rfc-editor.org?subject=help>
List-Subscribe: <https://www.rfc-editor.org/mailman/listinfo/rfc-interest>, <mailto:rfc-interest-request@rfc-editor.org?subject=subscribe>
Cc: rfc-interest@rfc-editor.org
Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="===============5155312872625578976=="
Errors-To: rfc-interest-bounces@rfc-editor.org
Sender: rfc-interest <rfc-interest-bounces@rfc-editor.org>

Michael StJohns <msj@nthpermutation.com> wrote:
    >> Perhaps rather than using syntax to enforce policy, we could shift to using
    >> editorial control to enforce policy. That is, we specify that non-ASCII
    >> diagrams in RFCs are in full-fledged SVG, which has really, *really* good
    >> support in a lot of tools. And then put have in place instructions to the
    >> authors and to the RPC that describe the policy restrictions (such as those
    >> I list above), along with a tool -- in the style of id-nits -- that helps
    >> identify (in an advisory way) when those policies might not have been
    >> followed.

    > I think this is an interesting idea that misses at least one point of the SVG
    > profile.  E.g.  Your tool might be able to produce SVG that the RPC's tools
    > might not be able to render.

    > Before we head off in this direction, perhaps someone can do a table that has
    > the tools proposed for authoring on one axis, and the tools proposed for
    > rendering on the second axis (could be the same group) and see if the export
    > from one will work as an import for the other.

To first order, the "rendering" will be browsers, and we have pretty good
interoperability there.

The problem is that the second order group is black and white printers
printing paper which will be viewed by people with various amounts of
differentially abled vision.

The archival goals of our series say that we need to accomodate the second
order group.

So you are right that we need to match tools to "viewers", but our problem is
that the viewers in the second group are difficult to simulate today.

--
Michael Richardson <mcr+IETF@sandelman.ca>   . o O ( IPv6 IøT consulting )
           Sandelman Software Works Inc, Ottawa and Worldwide




_______________________________________________
rfc-interest mailing list
rfc-interest@rfc-editor.org
https://www.rfc-editor.org/mailman/listinfo/rfc-interest