Re: [dmarc-ietf] Ticket #39 - remove p=quarantine
Dotzero <dotzero@gmail.com> Wed, 02 December 2020 03:02 UTC
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From: Dotzero <dotzero@gmail.com>
Date: Tue, 01 Dec 2020 22:01:53 -0500
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To: Steven M Jones <smj@crash.com>
Cc: IETF DMARC WG <dmarc@ietf.org>
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Subject: Re: [dmarc-ietf] Ticket #39 - remove p=quarantine
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On Tue, Dec 1, 2020 at 8:43 PM Steven M Jones <smj@crash.com> wrote: > On 12/1/20 4:16 PM, Douglas Foster wrote: > > > > I have always assumed that p=quarantine and pct<>100 were included to > > provide political cover for "Nervous Nellies" who were afraid to > > enable p=reject. > > p=none, p=quarantine, and the pct= option were all included so that > organizations could set policies according to their own risk/reward > evaluation, including changes to those evaluations over time. > Absolutely agree with Steve on this. The key phrase is "risk/reward evaluation". As about the first person to publish DMARC records (before the specification was public), I went straight to p=reject, but I had the benefit of feedback from participating mailbox providers before we even had an agreed upon reporting format. Even with that, I missed one oddball server for both DKIM signing and SPF. The organization I worked for had a number of heavily abused domains from a direct domain abuse perspective. None of the mail was going through mailing lists or other intermediaries other than a very small fraction of a percent going through vanity domains, etc. My point is that if my circumstances were different I might have gone through p=quarantine or even stayed there permanently. > > > > Pct<>100 is pretty much similar. A sender can specify pct=20, but > > that does not mean that I am going to allow spam into my system 80% of > > the time simply to make the sender happy. > > I really hope no casual readers get the impression that DMARC bypasses > spam filtering. DMARC evaluations are expected to be independent of spam > evaluations. If there's any overlap here, perhaps it would be for DMARC > (and/or underlying protocols) to provide reliable domain attribution to > drive a local policy decision about filtering. > DMARC does one thing and one thing only - It mitigates direct domain abuse. It does not stop spam, phishing or a multitude of other problems. > > > > Leaving it deployed is a useful ruse to promote deployment. I favor > > leaving both mechanisms in place. > > While I deplore characterizing these policy elements as a "ruse," I > agree that p=quarantine should be kept. > Again, I agree with Steve on this. Michael Hammer
- [dmarc-ietf] Ticket #39 - remove p=quarantine John R Levine
- Re: [dmarc-ietf] Ticket #39 - remove p=quarantine Dave Crocker
- Re: [dmarc-ietf] Ticket #39 - remove p=quarantine Douglas Foster
- Re: [dmarc-ietf] Ticket #39 - remove p=quarantine Steven M Jones
- Re: [dmarc-ietf] Ticket #39 - remove p=quarantine Seth Blank
- Re: [dmarc-ietf] Ticket #39 - remove p=quarantine John Levine
- Re: [dmarc-ietf] Ticket #39 - remove p=quarantine Dotzero
- Re: [dmarc-ietf] Ticket #39 - remove p=quarantine Steven M Jones
- Re: [dmarc-ietf] Ticket #39 - remove p=quarantine Dave Crocker
- Re: [dmarc-ietf] Ticket #39 - remove p=quarantine Dave Crocker
- Re: [dmarc-ietf] Ticket #39 - remove p=quarantine John Levine
- Re: [dmarc-ietf] Ticket #39 - remove p=quarantine Laura Atkins
- Re: [dmarc-ietf] Ticket #39 - remove p=quarantine Steven M Jones
- Re: [dmarc-ietf] Ticket #39 - remove p=quarantine Дилян Палаузов
- Re: [dmarc-ietf] Ticket #39 - remove p=quarantine Alessandro Vesely
- Re: [dmarc-ietf] Ticket #39 - remove p=quarantine Dotzero
- Re: [dmarc-ietf] Ticket #39 - remove p=quarantine Dave Crocker
- Re: [dmarc-ietf] Ticket #39 - remove p=quarantine Dave Crocker
- Re: [dmarc-ietf] Ticket #39 - remove p=quarantine Dave Crocker
- Re: [dmarc-ietf] Ticket #39 - remove p=quarantine Benny Lyne Amorsen
- Re: [dmarc-ietf] Ticket #39 - remove p=quarantine Dave Crocker
- Re: [dmarc-ietf] Ticket #39 - remove p=quarantine Dotzero
- Re: [dmarc-ietf] Ticket #39 - remove p=quarantine Murray S. Kucherawy
- Re: [dmarc-ietf] Ticket #39 - remove p=quarantine Benny Lyne Amorsen
- Re: [dmarc-ietf] Ticket #39 - remove p=quarantine Dotzero
- Re: [dmarc-ietf] Ticket #39 - remove p=quarantine Jim Fenton
- Re: [dmarc-ietf] Ticket #39 - remove p=quarantine Jim Fenton
- Re: [dmarc-ietf] Ticket #39 - remove p=quarantine Jim Fenton
- Re: [dmarc-ietf] Ticket #39 - remove p=quarantine Laura Atkins
- Re: [dmarc-ietf] Ticket #39 - remove p=quarantine Dave Crocker
- Re: [dmarc-ietf] Ticket #39 - remove p=quarantine Todd Herr
- Re: [dmarc-ietf] Ticket #39 - remove p=quarantine Michael Thomas
- Re: [dmarc-ietf] Ticket #39 - remove p=quarantine Дилян Палаузов
- Re: [dmarc-ietf] Ticket #39 - remove p=quarantine John Levine
- Re: [dmarc-ietf] Ticket #39 - remove p=quarantine Brandon Long
- Re: [dmarc-ietf] Ticket #39 - remove p=quarantine John Levine
- Re: [dmarc-ietf] Ticket #39 - remove p=quarantine Дилян Палаузов
- Re: [dmarc-ietf] Ticket #39 - remove p=quarantine Hector Santos
- Re: [dmarc-ietf] Ticket #39 - remove p=quarantine Jesse Thompson
- Re: [dmarc-ietf] Ticket #39 - remove p=quarantine Brandon Long
- Re: [dmarc-ietf] Ticket #39 - remove p=quarantine Michael Thomas
- Re: [dmarc-ietf] Ticket #39 - remove p=quarantine Alessandro Vesely