Re: 'Geek' image scares women away from tech industry ? The Register
Janet P Gunn <jgunn6@csc.com> Tue, 01 May 2012 17:44 UTC
Return-Path: <jgunn6@csc.com>
X-Original-To: ietf@ietfa.amsl.com
Delivered-To: ietf@ietfa.amsl.com
Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id DD31B21E83D0; Tue, 1 May 2012 10:44:21 -0700 (PDT)
X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com
X-Spam-Flag: NO
X-Spam-Score: -5.854
X-Spam-Level:
X-Spam-Status: No, score=-5.854 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=-0.744, BAYES_05=-1.11, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, RCVD_IN_DNSWL_MED=-4]
Received: from mail.ietf.org ([12.22.58.30]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id R6Xh2Ru+EI8N; Tue, 1 May 2012 10:44:21 -0700 (PDT)
Received: from mail170.messagelabs.com (mail170.messagelabs.com [216.82.253.227]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 28E9A21E83C7; Tue, 1 May 2012 10:44:21 -0700 (PDT)
X-Env-Sender: jgunn6@csc.com
X-Msg-Ref: server-14.tower-170.messagelabs.com!1335894259!14734717!1
X-Originating-IP: [20.137.2.87]
X-StarScan-Version: 6.5.7; banners=-,-,-
X-VirusChecked: Checked
Received: (qmail 16742 invoked from network); 1 May 2012 17:44:20 -0000
Received: from amer-mta101.csc.com (HELO amer-mta101.csc.com) (20.137.2.87) by server-14.tower-170.messagelabs.com with DHE-RSA-AES256-SHA encrypted SMTP; 1 May 2012 17:44:20 -0000
Received: from amer-gw09.amer.csc.com (amer-gw09.amer.csc.com [20.6.39.245]) by amer-mta101.csc.com (Switch-3.4.3/Switch-3.4.3) with ESMTP id q41HiId2012696; Tue, 1 May 2012 13:44:19 -0400
In-Reply-To: <C6E91163-E7C8-4813-A1B5-4F2D7155E35A@checkpoint.com>
References: <CAHBDyN7SNAyW_Y5bPSq+hNOhw2vzRCSX07idtefE50SWYN1_2A@mail.gmail.com> <CAHBDyN4eYD7yAEzUaAbDR4J61JKEW44XVM-QVZAXF7zPBpPFDw@mail.gmail.com> <0BE07CF6-DA94-42B7-B96F-C9CCD241B8FC@checkpoint.com> <CAHBDyN5=5ngyxhc=u+ciXsQ=RGEytan6j4X+bKL5X=2-B6Eajw@mail.gmail.com> <C6E91163-E7C8-4813-A1B5-4F2D7155E35A@checkpoint.com>
To: Yoav Nir <ynir@checkpoint.com>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Subject: Re: 'Geek' image scares women away from tech industry ? The Register
X-KeepSent: 0C2E8AF0:171B1CFD-852579F1:0060527C; type=4; name=$KeepSent
X-Mailer: Lotus Notes Release 8.5.2FP3 July 11, 2011
From: Janet P Gunn <jgunn6@csc.com>
Message-ID: <OF0C2E8AF0.171B1CFD-ON852579F1.0060527C-852579F1.006171DB@csc.com>
Date: Tue, 01 May 2012 13:44:20 -0400
X-MIMETrack: Serialize by Router on AMER-GW09/SRV/CSC(Release 8.5.2FP3 HF204|September 20, 2011) at 05/01/2012 01:41:02 PM, Serialize complete at 05/01/2012 01:41:02 PM
Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="=_alternative 00616EF6852579F1_="
Cc: ietf-bounces@ietf.org, IETF-Discussion list <ietf@ietf.org>
X-BeenThere: ietf@ietf.org
X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.12
Precedence: list
List-Id: IETF-Discussion <ietf.ietf.org>
List-Unsubscribe: <https://www.ietf.org/mailman/options/ietf>, <mailto:ietf-request@ietf.org?subject=unsubscribe>
List-Archive: <http://www.ietf.org/mail-archive/web/ietf>
List-Post: <mailto:ietf@ietf.org>
List-Help: <mailto:ietf-request@ietf.org?subject=help>
List-Subscribe: <https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ietf>, <mailto:ietf-request@ietf.org?subject=subscribe>
X-List-Received-Date: Tue, 01 May 2012 17:44:22 -0000
This is VERY narrow minded, and, to be honest, somewhat insulting. You suggest that "time at work" and "family" are the only important things to women. First off, "working too many hours", and "too much travel" are considerably MORE onerous when you DON'T have a family to back you up - especially if you have a house to be maintained, animals to be fed and exercised, and so on. If you have a family, they can pick up some of the slack when you have to work late or travel. If not, you have to struggle to find a pet sitter and so forth. Furthermore, many of us have extensive non-family commitments outside of work - serious (time consuming) hobby's and competitions, volunteer organizations for which we are part of the management team, to say nothing of exercise and sleep. No! "too much travel and too many hours" is NOT "pretty much the same" as "takes time away from family". Janet . From: Yoav Nir <ynir@checkpoint.com> And then this: Among the common factors that women cited as their reasons for leaving the profession were too much travel, working too many hours, lack of real or perceived opportunities for advancement, and uncivil work environments where women were treated in condescending or patronizing manners. Only 25 percent of the women who left engineering did so for family reasons. So on the one hand they claim that women are not leaving to take care of their families, but on the other the first two correct reasons they mention are too much travel and too many hours. I think these two are pretty much the same, and the primary reason why someone (male or female) would object to travel and long hours is because it takes time away from family.
- Re: 'Geek' image scares women away from tech indu… Mary Barnes
- Re: 'Geek' image scares women away from tech indu… Riccardo Bernardini
- Re: 'Geek' image scares women away from tech indu… Melinda Shore
- Re: 'Geek' image scares women away from tech indu… Mary Barnes
- RE: 'Geek' image scares women away from tech indu… Worley, Dale R (Dale)
- Re: 'Geek' image scares women away from tech indu… Janet P Gunn
- Re: 'Geek' image scares women away from tech indu… Richard L. Barnes
- RE: 'Geek' image scares women away from tech indu… ned+ietf
- Re: 'Geek' image scares women away from tech indu… Ofer Inbar
- Re: 'Geek' image scares women away from tech indu… Fred Baker
- Re: 'Geek' image scares women away from tech indu… Glen Zorn
- Re: 'Geek' image scares women away from tech indu… Yoav Nir
- Re: 'Geek' image scares women away from tech indu… Yoav Nir
- Re: 'Geek' image scares women away from tech indu… Riccardo Bernardini
- RE: 'Geek' image scares women away from tech indu… Yaakov Stein
- Re: 'Geek' image scares women away from tech indu… Mary Barnes
- Re: 'Geek' image scares women away from tech indu… Scott Brim
- Re: 'Geek' image scares women away from tech indu… Monique Morrow
- Re: [IETF] Re: 'Geek' image scares women away fro… Warren Kumari
- Re: 'Geek' image scares women away from tech indu… Yoav Nir
- Re: 'Geek' image scares women away from tech indu… Randy Presuhn
- Re: 'Geek' image scares women away from tech indu… Melinda Shore
- Re: 'Geek' image scares women away from tech indu… John C Klensin
- Re: 'Geek' image scares women away from tech indu… Hector
- Re: 'Geek' image scares women away from tech indu… Melinda Shore
- Re: 'Geek' image scares women away from tech indu… Hector
- Re: 'Geek' image scares women away from tech indu… Janet P Gunn
- Re: 'Geek' image scares women away from tech indu… Hector
- Re: 'Geek' image scares women away from tech indu… Thomas Narten
- Re: 'Geek' image scares women away from tech indu… Yoav Nir
- Re: 'Geek' image scares women away from tech indu… Janet P Gunn
- RE: 'Geek' image scares women away from tech indu… Richard Shockey
- Re: 'Geek' image scares women away from tech indu… Mary Barnes
- Re: 'Geek' image scares women away from tech indu… Hector Santos
- Re: 'Geek' image scares women away from tech indu… Mary Barnes
- Re: 'Geek' image scares women away from tech indu… Rumbidzayi Gadhula
- RE: 'Geek' image scares women away from tech indu… Worley, Dale R (Dale)