Re: [v6ops] Last Call: <draft-ietf-v6ops-mobile-device-profile-04.txt> (Internet Protocol Version 6 (IPv6) Profile for 3GPP Mobile Devices) to Informational RFC

Lorenzo Colitti <lorenzo@google.com> Wed, 04 September 2013 08:04 UTC

Return-Path: <lorenzo@google.com>
X-Original-To: ietf@ietfa.amsl.com
Delivered-To: ietf@ietfa.amsl.com
Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id B6CAD21E80AF for <ietf@ietfa.amsl.com>; Wed, 4 Sep 2013 01:04:49 -0700 (PDT)
X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com
X-Spam-Flag: NO
X-Spam-Score: -1.334
X-Spam-Level:
X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.334 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=0.328, BAYES_00=-2.599, FM_FORGED_GMAIL=0.622, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, NO_RELAYS=-0.001, SARE_MILLIONSOF=0.315]
Received: from mail.ietf.org ([12.22.58.30]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id qGO1gnyNHnee for <ietf@ietfa.amsl.com>; Wed, 4 Sep 2013 01:04:45 -0700 (PDT)
Received: from mail-ie0-x230.google.com (mail-ie0-x230.google.com [IPv6:2607:f8b0:4001:c03::230]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 81ABD21E8082 for <ietf@ietf.org>; Wed, 4 Sep 2013 01:04:45 -0700 (PDT)
Received: by mail-ie0-f176.google.com with SMTP id s9so12357019iec.21 for <ietf@ietf.org>; Wed, 04 Sep 2013 01:04:45 -0700 (PDT)
DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=google.com; s=20120113; h=mime-version:in-reply-to:references:from:date:message-id:subject:to :cc:content-type; bh=5iR8FZC77MBqZ2QeSf35DNiabXfqza7H7wu6N2ilBTk=; b=Wejkvz01QLb7vhwAkTCPqOuIDI0Qu+vLLZ5uiJ4WBPg46KysZ5qIz/RvjRKloapu6s aRwDOPRcA/NvKH+RjLkJEQ3MWsaREeeGXJ5PV+bsRxda2dsx3RHAXmulFR1ZXUDnmWLc eUIyeMGn7nNL0QCGoHI9tKe6yl7GESlxFjeNtou9AmHsoXQhSK4zcJRMvt3va+/UscRs 48jlrnD/y39a78OtB/spfsaLR80WZJ08QivrbKy7G5kNHyCSj6P6ybMzpsJEQ/PxzcLM QQBoVOfZdy4AQvWXb7DAVzLu4qDeQeaceiLvEEKL8pFBRpmQdReZzHqzOytO47pnWIMh Y6Xw==
X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20130820; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:in-reply-to:references:from:date :message-id:subject:to:cc:content-type; bh=5iR8FZC77MBqZ2QeSf35DNiabXfqza7H7wu6N2ilBTk=; b=PWc8wAqOtKrvqbtucT23bYSLO8gWv3wfXdVBDcJIzYH36EWe+2tm/L/YhsFFTkAms/ lccsIEtGzSY13LbmnU+jzYpfGHPDTFeEmUoss55d7CHZm4VEm1k7S/+TJ5wSQoYgQKRB ZDM64Zv+tBzoR6rhVxDRYj7GpTG4mdc2ayQsxYoSS6iG3viOpkrtixG2ZxIdNAXXARAr 32pF8ZwyAFAhZXqAVPXaKFKpznFThKDSI5ecWFER2/hi7SCFA90A7chJi+7yImmQCzYa zQU40iUa3VzusYRHdUA50viwaketBh6FOpXK466ew+6StiLDbNDNRwH58it7CaVGzyj3 gZFw==
X-Gm-Message-State: ALoCoQlavNoVxlXrPrIH2ZrclmJWoCxf1Bpe0ZsdF2izfWr0Izkj2B54j3XFP9mZ7/h7kHurpw+XVyhSyz+8gsUQznvKBAcDed1+iNNVuamVAnMrNP4qFtu21ub+9V8JoSzUS07zTuFsNAF/56zQqZ9h2NWiZn5gcb9mbX697p+26gGOyIa3Z+cZZYNxgVtKPaL1AbhVozJ3
X-Received: by 10.50.66.163 with SMTP id g3mr910174igt.20.1378281885025; Wed, 04 Sep 2013 01:04:45 -0700 (PDT)
MIME-Version: 1.0
Received: by 10.64.76.138 with HTTP; Wed, 4 Sep 2013 01:04:24 -0700 (PDT)
In-Reply-To: <94C682931C08B048B7A8645303FDC9F36EF033638D@PUEXCB1B.nanterre.francetelecom.fr>
References: <20130819135219.8236.40060.idtracker@ietfa.amsl.com> <CAKD1Yr1VpJne1h-Q5xbNMYRhpr_n0Wmn6UqfeG3vEg2MY6ms1g@mail.gmail.com> <94C682931C08B048B7A8645303FDC9F36EF033638D@PUEXCB1B.nanterre.francetelecom.fr>
From: Lorenzo Colitti <lorenzo@google.com>
Date: Wed, 04 Sep 2013 17:04:24 +0900
Message-ID: <CAKD1Yr0pqeO9KdcKFWVqWP_5pmZ6fgQ5h4tQ=vOO57d-dg5+DA@mail.gmail.com>
Subject: Re: [v6ops] Last Call: <draft-ietf-v6ops-mobile-device-profile-04.txt> (Internet Protocol Version 6 (IPv6) Profile for 3GPP Mobile Devices) to Informational RFC
To: "<mohamed.boucadair@orange.com>" <mohamed.boucadair@orange.com>
Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="047d7bdca31c2884d804e58a42d4"
X-Mailman-Approved-At: Wed, 04 Sep 2013 08:25:39 -0700
Cc: "v6ops@ietf.org WG" <v6ops@ietf.org>, IETF Discussion <ietf@ietf.org>
X-BeenThere: ietf@ietf.org
X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.12
Precedence: list
List-Id: IETF-Discussion <ietf.ietf.org>
List-Unsubscribe: <https://www.ietf.org/mailman/options/ietf>, <mailto:ietf-request@ietf.org?subject=unsubscribe>
List-Archive: <http://www.ietf.org/mail-archive/web/ietf>
List-Post: <mailto:ietf@ietf.org>
List-Help: <mailto:ietf-request@ietf.org?subject=help>
List-Subscribe: <https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ietf>, <mailto:ietf-request@ietf.org?subject=subscribe>
X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 04 Sep 2013 08:04:49 -0000

On Wed, Sep 4, 2013 at 3:31 PM, <mohamed.boucadair@orange.com> wrote:

> it is about ** a ** profile for mobile devices.
>
But wait... if it's just *a* profile, then why is the IETF publishing this
particular profile, and not any other profile? Is this an IETF recommended
profile? If, so then the document should state why. If not, then the
document should state that this is just one possible profile, and that the
IETF does not recommend for or against it.

I think the fundamental problem with this document is that it does not
provide solid reasons for why all 34 requirements need to be implemented
(and personally, I think that's because it just can't - there *are* no
solid reasons). The draft seems implies that all these requirements must be
met to deploy IPv6 on mobile devices, but that's not true. A great example
is the statement in the abstract which says that this document "lists the
set of features a 3GPP mobile device is to be compliant with to connect to
an IPv6-only or dual-stack wireless network". This statement is false:
there are tens of millions of mobile devices using IPv6 every day, and none
of them meet more than a minority of the requirements in this document.

I know we've already gone over this in the WG, but since this is IETF last
call, I think the rest of the community should see this discussion so that
we collectively know what the arguments for and against this proposal and
can reach informed consensus.

Oh, and I know it's a bit out of fashion, but: what happened to "running
code"? Are there *any* implementations of all this?