Re: Rebooked venues selected for IETF 112, IETF 117, and IETF 120 meetings

Mary B <mary.h.barnes@gmail.com> Wed, 03 June 2020 20:52 UTC

Return-Path: <mary.h.barnes@gmail.com>
X-Original-To: ietf@ietfa.amsl.com
Delivered-To: ietf@ietfa.amsl.com
Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id A60F93A0F93 for <ietf@ietfa.amsl.com>; Wed, 3 Jun 2020 13:52:13 -0700 (PDT)
X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com
X-Spam-Flag: NO
X-Spam-Score: -2.097
X-Spam-Level:
X-Spam-Status: No, score=-2.097 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_AU=-0.1, DKIM_VALID_EF=-0.1, FREEMAIL_FROM=0.001, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, SPF_HELO_NONE=0.001, SPF_PASS=-0.001, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no
Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (2048-bit key) header.d=gmail.com
Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id Vn2IFxbiN6Td for <ietf@ietfa.amsl.com>; Wed, 3 Jun 2020 13:52:11 -0700 (PDT)
Received: from mail-io1-xd2c.google.com (mail-io1-xd2c.google.com [IPv6:2607:f8b0:4864:20::d2c]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher ECDHE-RSA-AES128-GCM-SHA256 (128/128 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id A49613A0F90 for <ietf@ietf.org>; Wed, 3 Jun 2020 13:52:11 -0700 (PDT)
Received: by mail-io1-xd2c.google.com with SMTP id o5so3866274iow.8 for <ietf@ietf.org>; Wed, 03 Jun 2020 13:52:11 -0700 (PDT)
DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20161025; h=mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date:message-id:subject:to :cc; bh=CIStupn0yHHPTBVBUzTlGFJlrz02QWDROTVBLDA9f1Q=; b=cLIinC/BIGPt3YNkgz1m4tVl16IYZaeq1Dq5/InD8N99z7BBQhPbqIY0NxfB+0G6zB nyE8+r+Kbu9SK09312rkxZvTMTTj0axCcz29s+kbLSQhIj/N0n5BrOYyXWyCmTokt3yg WUrNhq8MZaUTAAou7s1io5jfEn1qEpU3Zoda4TNtQ1UQ0oNO+L6tRmR6h94ycqC/irK7 Tvrg6dfPJ9wYxMt/phFWdo70BZk78JRk35oC5uf4BjDQGCTYrDdKh0xNHgl46j9BIucS FkqLLL5aWvdrbmbGtm4mChLJXS5g5/DHKw2XNKVMmzWzdpzqlpws1XyIqmfU5z4iOa2a Vk7w==
X-Google-DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=1e100.net; s=20161025; h=x-gm-message-state:mime-version:references:in-reply-to:from:date :message-id:subject:to:cc; bh=CIStupn0yHHPTBVBUzTlGFJlrz02QWDROTVBLDA9f1Q=; b=WHxJf6qNUKoGh0dIzZhM+3BvnWJsQMaphI2mSegIXAz3YyzcZ7GtACP3tRZpDiMTfa t0fRZ6/+7WNPrr0WdqKhko/BCdXLOinPrp7tTJD7kn2X20bP8gNWEOm2F9iB6bWZwGI3 ieS4XNTeu33oCTxlQJVr593rs9Fq1w6Cb6uDw874t7fcGlI1EI0gvxmRBEO/nZCSDUxW 7rDMOQILchdPiQK/WN/krTf9aVPhyojwnA6IbIpDGurjWvAwBQ4UcKhpCWNMPmUEFYJu KAINVMkb+FT3bvpvgLz+pSjPFy6rERUAuNU/E5O8VT2GCREWeVohAxg7zC5Ip+kaSkwa caDQ==
X-Gm-Message-State: AOAM530ZwYWcIVdf97cJ/1srV4qVaLEw4jRvp0g2hipg7+qsyoDqndAa kcTkv+Go2VniU3lRCiDZj0hMs3ZEpwM3hijVMH4=
X-Google-Smtp-Source: ABdhPJyC9dKRP56h4I56wliW+YzlE+Pb4QL/Mp1joxzifoXvQZ3gCNSoSSsIHwvnogSsmXeqZ4LbXA/8lKAuWdJrd+Q=
X-Received: by 2002:a5e:aa14:: with SMTP id s20mr1457450ioe.58.1591217530863; Wed, 03 Jun 2020 13:52:10 -0700 (PDT)
MIME-Version: 1.0
References: <159113751627.22713.13490423680748088506@ietfa.amsl.com> <CAKr6gn1Mu3xTEAnp0tGLRc=Kw+s0gOao4SbP3Hn5KzEM7w__PQ@mail.gmail.com> <CAL9jLaZod4DxiLqjL1_dfuRLVC1d_Q3Wx=p6J_JJFDD3fJQX=w@mail.gmail.com> <CABmDk8=ASTN6+U1ZmNw8SmWueMcB=TbioEywxZ1_AgaVpSwoOw@mail.gmail.com> <CAL9jLaYi=8hoMccYdtJvQGPqz+Qyf5rpZGNk+2XquM_rqRU_oA@mail.gmail.com>
In-Reply-To: <CAL9jLaYi=8hoMccYdtJvQGPqz+Qyf5rpZGNk+2XquM_rqRU_oA@mail.gmail.com>
From: Mary B <mary.h.barnes@gmail.com>
Date: Wed, 3 Jun 2020 15:51:59 -0500
Message-ID: <CABmDk8=8PUQWn6EtXhsBEQPOLpLAE_oyQWpzkqfAUWTR-n1a_w@mail.gmail.com>
Subject: Re: Rebooked venues selected for IETF 112, IETF 117, and IETF 120 meetings
To: Christopher Morrow <morrowc.lists@gmail.com>
Cc: George Michaelson <ggm@algebras.org>, IETF Discussion Mailing List <ietf@ietf.org>
Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="000000000000b0047605a73433ff"
Archived-At: <https://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/msg/ietf/TONjzB-ogAWzupayeBy1xSF84dI>
X-BeenThere: ietf@ietf.org
X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29
Precedence: list
List-Id: IETF-Discussion <ietf.ietf.org>
List-Unsubscribe: <https://www.ietf.org/mailman/options/ietf>, <mailto:ietf-request@ietf.org?subject=unsubscribe>
List-Archive: <https://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/browse/ietf/>
List-Post: <mailto:ietf@ietf.org>
List-Help: <mailto:ietf-request@ietf.org?subject=help>
List-Subscribe: <https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ietf>, <mailto:ietf-request@ietf.org?subject=subscribe>
X-List-Received-Date: Wed, 03 Jun 2020 20:52:14 -0000

On Wed, Jun 3, 2020 at 3:38 PM Christopher Morrow <morrowc.lists@gmail.com>
wrote:

> On Wed, Jun 3, 2020 at 3:24 PM Mary B <mary.h.barnes@gmail.com> wrote:
> >
> > On Wed, Jun 3, 2020 at 1:52 PM Christopher Morrow <
> morrowc.lists@gmail.com> wrote:
> >>
> >> On Tue, Jun 2, 2020 at 8:30 PM George Michaelson <ggm@algebras.org>
> wrote:
> >> >
> >> > My only concern is that the ESTA/CBP barriers to entry for IETF
> >> > participants who have travel issues to the USA remain. We are in
> >> > effect normalising US foreign policy discrimination against IETF
> >> > participation F2F
> >>
> >> It seems that putting a meeting back in the US is really not something
> >> the IETF should do... not until the current problems (virus, <internal
> >> strife>, external restrictions> are fixed... I don't think we(ietf)
> >> should be concerned about the potential loss on the SF site
> >> deposits/etc...
> >
> > [MB] Do you really think you/we can judge what things will be like over
> 3 years from now?
>
> hrm, I read the meetings as the set starting next march... it's really
> 2 yes, not three, right?
> (108 - madrid/cancel, 109 BKK cancel, 110 spring, 111, summer, 112 fall)
>
[MB]  The SF meeting is listed per Jay's schedule as: "IETF 117 will be
held in San Francisco at the Hilton Union Square, 22-28 July 2023"
My math tells me that's 3+ years away.  But, it looks like you're referring
to 111 - that's what confused me.  That's a different question as to
whether we're keeping that one.  I'm guessing that  that decision would be
made closer to that date and I would guess that cancelling or rescheduling
due to the virus would not be nearly as problematic as telling the Hilton
that IETF doesn't like US politics.   And, unless, the Madrid meeting hotel
is moldy, I won't be wearing a mask. [/MB]

I suppose 112 - madrid could likely turn out 'ok', I imagine we'll
> still be with the face coverings/etc.
> 117 is far enough out that we'll probably not care about that as a
> thing or not ... :)
> 120 the same.
>
> Will 117 be far enough out to fix up the internal politics problems in the
> US?
>
> >  What specifically does the virus have to do with whether or not we have
> a meeting in the
> > US in 3 years?    There's nothing to say that other countries won't have
> other restrictions of
> > various sorts in 3 years time.  Personally, I think these changes are
> just perfect.   If the
> > meeting was moved to 2021, then maybe the concerns are valid, but not
> 2023.  [/MB]
>
> sure, ish... leaving aside the virus problems.. having a meeting in
> the US without change to policies seems bad.
>
> >>
> >> >
> >> > I think you made an entirely rational decision financially, but I
> >> > think the underlying reasons we wound up going to Canada by preference
> >> > remain.
> >> >
> >> > -george
> >> >
> >> > On Wed, Jun 3, 2020 at 8:38 AM IETF Executive Director
> >> > <exec-director@ietf.org> wrote:
> >> > >
> >> > > The IETF Administration LLC is pleased to announce that:
> >> > >
> >> > > * IETF 112 will be held in Madrid at the Melia Castilla Hotel and
> Convention Center, 6-12 November 2021.  This was the venue originally
> booked for IETF 108, which was moved online because of the global pandemic
> [1].  We have chosen to rebook this venue to support the 20 years of
> significant community effort to bring an IETF meeting to Spain.
> >> > >
> >> > > * IETF 117 will be held in San Francisco at the Hilton Union
> Square, 22-28 July 2023.  This was the venue originally booked for IETF
> 102, which was moved because of concerns about US travel restrictions [2].
> We have rebooked this venue as it was either that or pay a significant
> cancellation fee..
> >> > >
> >> > > * IETF 120 will be held in Vancouver at the Hyatt Regency
> Vancouver, 20-26 July 2024.  This was the venue originally booked for IETF
> 107, which was moved online because of the global pandemic [3].  We have
> chosen to rebook this venue to preserve the effort already put into
> contracting and preparing for this venue.
> >> > >
> >> > > In general, as the process of selecting a venue is expensive and
> time consuming, rebooking previously cancelled venues ensure that those
> costs are not written off and additional costs are not incurred in
> selecting new venues.
> >> > >
> >> > > Please feel free to contact me directly if you have any comments or
> questions.
> >> > >
> >> > > [1]
> https://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/msg/ietf-announce/kzC7M48oKrAwdh9uyOvseeKFW3A/
> >> > > [2]  https://iaoc.ietf.org/documents/IETF102Changeofvenuedates.pdf
> >> > > [3]
> https://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/msg/ietf-announce/XenAlx4Nw6Jmg69QpXRUOwbzsXY/
> >> > >
> >> > > --
> >> > > Jay Daley
> >> > > IETF Executive Director
> >> > > exec-director@ietf.org
> >> > >
> >> > > _______________________________________________
> >> > > IETF-Announce mailing list
> >> > > IETF-Announce@ietf.org
> >> > > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ietf-announce
> >> >
> >>
>