Re: @EXT: RE: United Nations report on Internet standards

Keith Moore <moore@network-heretics.com> Fri, 03 April 2020 01:13 UTC

Return-Path: <moore@network-heretics.com>
X-Original-To: ietf@ietfa.amsl.com
Delivered-To: ietf@ietfa.amsl.com
Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id D2F933A0ADF for <ietf@ietfa.amsl.com>; Thu, 2 Apr 2020 18:13:44 -0700 (PDT)
X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com
X-Spam-Flag: NO
X-Spam-Score: -1.895
X-Spam-Level:
X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.895 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[BAYES_00=-1.9, DKIM_SIGNED=0.1, DKIM_VALID=-0.1, HTML_MESSAGE=0.001, RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_H3=0.001, RCVD_IN_MSPIKE_WL=0.001, SPF_NONE=0.001, URIBL_BLOCKED=0.001] autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no
Authentication-Results: ietfa.amsl.com (amavisd-new); dkim=pass (2048-bit key) header.d=messagingengine.com
Received: from mail.ietf.org ([4.31.198.44]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id M21pEKT0eqdR for <ietf@ietfa.amsl.com>; Thu, 2 Apr 2020 18:13:43 -0700 (PDT)
Received: from out4-smtp.messagingengine.com (out4-smtp.messagingengine.com [66.111.4.28]) (using TLSv1.2 with cipher AECDH-AES256-SHA (256/256 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 967DC3A093C for <ietf@ietf.org>; Thu, 2 Apr 2020 18:13:43 -0700 (PDT)
Received: from compute4.internal (compute4.nyi.internal [10.202.2.44]) by mailout.nyi.internal (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6ECF35C031F; Thu, 2 Apr 2020 21:13:42 -0400 (EDT)
Received: from mailfrontend2 ([10.202.2.163]) by compute4.internal (MEProxy); Thu, 02 Apr 2020 21:13:42 -0400
DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d= messagingengine.com; h=content-type:date:from:in-reply-to :message-id:mime-version:references:subject:to:x-me-proxy :x-me-proxy:x-me-sender:x-me-sender:x-sasl-enc; s=fm2; bh=p+9sKO okieW7ahs22ceD4CvhYIaMWkDBWqdwkRuEMJc=; b=sZR3AuoHKUp/jDSgkL3gel nW+kswYnjN/Q5wbziNfd1GVvho/lme3APzv1GughFaxHZdlLxceJcvJSlMPSVj1t zokCvxE4dOogeIdw6F0OBvMcGgt8LFJJG1MoM+HSjbF1R/fysIlqYwOUVUBGJ1Yy Hj5+B5URpLKTZ6tBVBuz0+2z/QAgS1JI0YGWUszRDiHyhiCR1ygmpJzv6wosAa9C 6G12CBSkB7f2PL35aXmOMNIRMwfROhWxqwbGqGNCTR6XW1FzGG65eZ1iiP/Gfz/y AScY2e7eMHXI9ko2UgITOgXKUqn6psCw6nxzfi0Hj4yjOhZZBCR5RRa1jWbw8L+g ==
X-ME-Sender: <xms:xY2GXkG7YQQSAgQgCTy7Kt2FB5krtjAbeJ-s2Ofpxw6B6khzNmLwmQ>
X-ME-Proxy-Cause: gggruggvucftvghtrhhoucdtuddrgeduhedrtdehgdegvdcutefuodetggdotefrodftvf curfhrohhfihhlvgemucfhrghsthforghilhdpqfgfvfdpuffrtefokffrpgfnqfghnecu uegrihhlohhuthemuceftddtnecunecujfgurhepuffvfhfhkffffgggjggtsegrtderre dtfeejnecuhfhrohhmpefmvghithhhucfoohhorhgvuceomhhoohhrvgesnhgvthifohhr khdqhhgvrhgvthhitghsrdgtohhmqeenucfkphepuddtkedrvddvuddrudektddrudehne cuvehluhhsthgvrhfuihiivgeptdenucfrrghrrghmpehmrghilhhfrhhomhepmhhoohhr vgesnhgvthifohhrkhdqhhgvrhgvthhitghsrdgtohhm
X-ME-Proxy: <xmx:xY2GXnYrr0JDtB1aI_Iy6wQd9AGehD6Ma7DqUvzFXj8GnK1wEX4v6Q> <xmx:xY2GXjHREzjB-PtkkjjpRO0489DuXLfhf1PsxbeRoM0VrqpwZR_UFg> <xmx:xY2GXt36e38l48iGqgzhDYpN9iUUGqDriptzMJBQB-qqMlHsn2m3Yw> <xmx:xo2GXhfzlt_o5ot5AOQk8nZgDFUbmPcD5NeJrepMQ7H7PVcl4xZM-Q>
Received: from [192.168.1.97] (108-221-180-15.lightspeed.knvltn.sbcglobal.net [108.221.180.15]) by mail.messagingengine.com (Postfix) with ESMTPA id ACCAC306CEB9; Thu, 2 Apr 2020 21:13:41 -0400 (EDT)
Subject: Re: @EXT: RE: United Nations report on Internet standards
To: ietf@ietf.org
References: <68ab4f9e057d49b0972f97a907f45ced@elvas.europol.eu.int> <4668b6f7-cf7e-b577-3ece-30d1bdf3a4bc@network-heretics.com> <713270061.4157.1585575906743@appsuite-dev-gw1.open-xchange.com> <17D85408-6815-4E22-ABAF-6037DBF2FB6D@gmail.com> <02194c15-ce18-477b-a492-6e3406c305a0@dogfood.fastmail.com>
From: Keith Moore <moore@network-heretics.com>
Message-ID: <671547ed-78c4-bb0b-3697-7641ebb72edc@network-heretics.com>
Date: Thu, 02 Apr 2020 21:13:40 -0400
User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; Linux x86_64; rv:60.0) Gecko/20100101 Thunderbird/60.9.0
MIME-Version: 1.0
In-Reply-To: <02194c15-ce18-477b-a492-6e3406c305a0@dogfood.fastmail.com>
Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="------------67D3988D5E3DC3543375D78E"
Content-Language: en-US
Archived-At: <https://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/msg/ietf/aePdrfELeScJ2jaK6rbqWDVcj_I>
X-BeenThere: ietf@ietf.org
X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.29
Precedence: list
List-Id: IETF-Discussion <ietf.ietf.org>
List-Unsubscribe: <https://www.ietf.org/mailman/options/ietf>, <mailto:ietf-request@ietf.org?subject=unsubscribe>
List-Archive: <https://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/browse/ietf/>
List-Post: <mailto:ietf@ietf.org>
List-Help: <mailto:ietf-request@ietf.org?subject=help>
List-Subscribe: <https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ietf>, <mailto:ietf-request@ietf.org?subject=subscribe>
X-List-Received-Date: Fri, 03 Apr 2020 01:13:45 -0000

On 4/2/20 8:19 PM, Bron Gondwana wrote:

> For sure that in the antispam world, the ability to see patterns 
> across a large set of messages is invaluable for classifying messages, 
> and looking at each message right at the endpoints in isolation is 
> much less effective.

Well, sure, but that's not a justification for email to be transmitted 
in cleartext.

(As Adm. Grace Hopper used to say, 'The worst reason to do anything is 
"we've always done it that way."')

Keith