Re: hampering progress

[Brian E Carpenter <[e-mail]>]

On 22-Apr-21 06:35, Michael Thomas wrote:
> 
> On 4/21/21 10:56 AM, Keith Moore wrote:
> 
>> Bottom line: Anyone who wants to promote an idea within IETF has to 
>> find some way of building consensus around that idea.   And any time 
>> there's inertia opposing that idea, building that consensus isn't 
>> likely to be easy, even if it's a very good idea.    It's still the 
>> job of the proponents of that idea to try to build consensus; nobody 
>> else is going to do it for them.
> 
> How can you "build consensus" when you aren't allowed to even talk about 
> it? I don't go to meetings. I don't want to go to meetings. Does that 
> mean I am excluded from "building consensus"? 

No, but (coupled with the move to on-line meetings with all their
sociological disadvantages) it really makes it much, much harder.

> Are there other ways to 
> "build consensus" that I'm not aware of? I'm not even trying to "build 
> consensus", per se. I'm just trying to get people to consider whether an 
> alternative might be better and if not, why not.

Traditionally this list right here is where you would do that. Or if you
scope it as a Transport Area problem, [e-mail] ("A mailing list
for discussions on topics pertinent to the IETF Transport and Services
Area (TSV)").

> Does that "hamper progress"? Especially after about a half dozen 
> messages and less than 24 hours?

As I said, it seemed a bit abrupt but it is within a WG Chair's remit.
> But this list doesn't seem to be the answer because it's mostly about 
> ietf process and the right technical people are definitionally going to 
> be hit and miss.

That is indeed this list's current problem; hence, tsv-area might be
a better bet.

Regards
   Brian