Re: [Ltru] "X" vs. 'X (macrolanguage)"

["Mark Davis" <[e-mail]>]

I have less of a problem with these, because the parentheticals with
geographical names would probably be fairly clear to most people. And
because the the 639-2 variant is the most common, I think either of the
following would work.
...
Ainu
Ainu (China)
...

or

...
Ainu (Japan)
Ainu (China)
...

Peter, since Ainu is not a macrolanguage, I assume that there is no
relationship between aib and ain; that it is just an accident that they have
the same English name? (Is the same true for the other name collisions where
one of them was in 639-2 and yet they are not under a macrolanguage? Or are
those slips through the cracks?)

BTW, here is a list of all the names that are only distinguished by
parentheticals in http://www.sil.org/iso639-3/iso-639-3_20071018.tab (don't
worry about the UTF-8 munging -- I just forgot to tell Excel that it was
UTF-8). At the end I list the unique parentheticals.

    aib
I L Ainu  Ainu (China) 2  ain
I L Ainu  Ainu (Japan) 2  aja
I L Aja  Aja (Sudan) 2  ajg
I L Aja  Aja (Benin) 2  amm
I L Ama  Ama (Papua New Guinea) 2  nyi
I L Ama  Ama (Sudan) 2  rwm
I L Amba  Amba (Uganda) 2  utp
I L Amba  Amba (Solomon Islands) 2  asa
I L Asu  Asu (Tanzania) 2  aum
I L Asu  Asu (Nigeria) 2  ayq
I L Ayi  Ayi (Papua New Guinea) 2  ayx
I L Ayi  Ayi (China) 2  bau
I L Bada  Bada (Nigeria) 2  bhz
I L Bada  Bada (Indonesia) 2  bdh
I L Baka  Baka (Sudan) 2  bkc
I L Baka  Baka (Cameroon) 2  bcn
I L Bali  Bali (Nigeria) 2  bcp
I L Bali  Bali (Democratic Republic of Congo) 2  bas
I L Basa  Basa (Cameroon) 2  bzw
I L Basa  Basa (Nigeria) 2  btc
I L Bati  Bati (Cameroon) 2  bvt
I L Bati  Bati (Indonesia) 2  bey
I L Beli  Beli (Papua New Guinea) 2  blm
I L Beli  Beli (Sudan) 2  bem
I L Bemba  Bemba (Zambia) 2  bmy
I L Bemba  Bemba (Democratic Republic of Congo) 2  bez
I L Bena  Bena (Tanzania) 2  yun
I L Bena  Bena (Nigeria) 2  btb
I L Beti  Beti (Cameroon) 2  eot
I L Beti  Beti (Côte d'Ivoire) 2  bmn
I E Bina  Bina (Papua New Guinea) 2  byj
I L Bina  Bina (Nigeria) 2  bgl
I L Bo  Bo (Laos) 2  bpw
I L Bo  Bo (Papua New Guinea) 2  bzl
I L Boano  Boano (Sulawesi) 2  bzn
I L Boano  Boano (Maluku) 2  boy
I L Bodo  Bodo (Central African Republic) 2  brx
I L Bodo  Bodo (India) 2  bkp
I L Boko  Boko (Democratic Republic of Congo) 2  bqc
I L Boko  Boko (Benin) 2  bwu
I L Buli  Buli (Ghana) 2  bzq
I L Buli  Buli (Indonesia) 2  bjl
I L Bulu  Bulu (Papua New Guinea) 2  bum
I L Bulu  Bulu (Cameroon) 2  bqw
I L Buru  Buru (Nigeria) 2  mhs
I L Buru  Buru (Indonesia) 2  ddn
I L Dendi  Dendi (Benin) 2  deq
I L Dendi  Dendi (Central African Republic) 2  kbv
I L Dera  Dera (Indonesia) 2  kna
I L Dera  Dera (Nigeria) 2  dha
I L Dhanwar  Dhanwar (India) 2  dhw
I L Dhanwar  Dhanwar (Nepal) 2  dgo
I L Dogri  Dogri (individual language) 2  doi
M L Dogri  Dogri (macrolanguage) 2  env
I L Enwan  Enwan (Edu State) 2  enw
I L Enwan  Enwan (Akwa Ibom State) 2  etn
I L Eton  Eton (Vanuatu) 2  eto
I L Eton  Eton (Cameroon) 2  fak
I L Fang  Fang (Cameroon) 2  fan
I L Fang  Fang (Equatorial Guinea) 2  gba
M L Gbaya  Gbaya (Central African Republic) 2  krs
I L Gbaya  Gbaya (Sudan) 2  gim
I L Gimi  Gimi (Eastern Highlands) 2  gip
I L Gimi  Gimi (West New Britain) 2  gqn
I E Guana  Guana (Brazil) 2  gva
I L Guana  Guana (Paraguay) 2  glu
I L Gula  Gula (Chad) 2  kcm
I L Gula  Gula (Central African Republic) 2  isu
I L Isu  Isu (Menchum Division) 2  szv
I L Isu  Isu (Fako Division) 2  anq
I L Jarawa  Jarawa (India) 2  jar
I L Jarawa  Jarawa (Nigeria) 2  jim
I L Jimi  Jimi (Cameroon) 2  jmi
I L Jimi  Jimi (Nigeria) 2  kam
I L Kamba  Kamba (Kenya) 2  xba
I E Kamba  Kamba (Brazil) 2  kcu
I L Kami  Kami (Tanzania) 2  kmi
I L Kami  Kami (Nigeria) 2  kty
I L Kango  Kango (Bas-UÃ(c)lÃ(c) District) 2  kzy
I L Kango  Kango (Tshopo District) 2  kah
I L Kara  Kara (Central African Republic) 4  leu
I L Kara  Kara (Papua New Guinea) 4  reg
I L Kara  Kara (Tanzania) 4  zra
I E Kara  Kara (Korea) 4  kbn
I L Kare  Kare (Central African Republic) 2  kmf
I L Kare  Kare (Papua New Guinea) 2  arr
I L Karo  Karo (Brazil) 2  kxh
I L Karo  Karo (Ethiopia) 2  kcl
I L Kela  Kela (Papua New Guinea) 2  kel
I L Kela  Kela (Democratic Republic of Congo) 2  khy
I L Kele  Kele (Democratic Republic of Congo) 2  sbc
I L Kele  Kele (Papua New Guinea) 2  ktu
I L Kituba  Kituba (Democratic Republic of Congo) 2  mkw
I L Kituba  Kituba (Congo) 2  biw
I L Kol  Kol (Cameroon) 2  kol
I L Kol  Kol (Papua New Guinea) 2  bkm
I L Kom  Kom (Cameroon) 2  kmm
I L Kom  Kom (India) 2  kmw
I L Komo  Komo (Democratic Republic of Congo) 2  xom
I L Komo  Komo (Sudan) 2  knn
I L Konkani  Konkani (individual language) 2  kok
M L Konkani  Konkani (macrolanguage) 2  klk
I L Kono  Kono (Nigeria) 3  kno
I L Kono  Kono (Sierra Leone) 3  knu
I L Kono  Kono (Guinea) 3  kfo
I L Koro  Koro (Côte d'Ivoire) 3  krf
I L Koro  Koro (Vanuatu) 3  kxr
I L Koro  Koro (Papua New Guinea) 3  kfe
I L Kota  Kota (India) 2  koq
I L Kota  Kota (Gabon) 2  kvd
I L Kui  Kui (Indonesia) 2  kxu
I L Kui  Kui (India) 2  bbu
I L Kulung  Kulung (Nigeria) 2  kle
I L Kulung  Kulung (Nepal) 2  lha
I L Laha  Laha (Viet Nam) 2  lhh
I L Laha  Laha (Indonesia) 2  lak
I L Laka  Laka (Nigeria) 2  lap
I L Laka  Laka (Chad) 2  las
I L Lama  Lama (Togo) 2  lay
I L Lama  Lama (Myanmar) 2  laj
I L Lango  Lango (Uganda) 2  lno
I L Lango  Lango (Sudan) 2  lel
I L Lele  Lele (Democratic Republic of Congo) 4  llc
I L Lele  Lele (Guinea) 4  lle
I L Lele  Lele (Papua New Guinea) 4  lln
I L Lele  Lele (Chad) 4  leo
I L Leti  Leti (Cameroon) 2  lti
I L Leti  Leti (Indonesia) 2  loi
I L Loma  Loma (Côte d'Ivoire) 2  lom
I L Loma  Loma (Liberia) 2  mjn
I L Ma  Ma (Papua New Guinea) 2  msj
I L Ma  Ma (Democratic Republic of Congo) 2  mde
I L Maba  Maba (Chad) 2  mqa
I L Maba  Maba (Indonesia) 2  mda
I L Mada  Mada (Nigeria) 2  mxu
I L Mada  Mada (Cameroon) 2  mti
I L Maiwa  Maiwa (Papua New Guinea) 2  wmm
I L Maiwa  Maiwa (Indonesia) 2  mkg
I L Mak  Mak (China) 2  pbl
I L Mak  Mak (Nigeria) 2  ped
I L Mala  Mala (Papua New Guinea) 2  ruy
I L Mala  Mala (Nigeria) 2  mly
I L Malay  Malay (individual language) 2  msa ms M L Malay  Malay
(macrolanguage) 2  mdc
I L Male  Male (Papua New Guinea) 2  mdy
I L Male  Male (Ethiopia) 2  mgs
I L Manda  Manda (Tanzania) 3  mha
I L Manda  Manda (India) 3  zma
I L Manda  Manda (Australia) 3  chm
M L Mari  Mari (Russia) 3  hob
I L Mari  Mari (Madang Province) 3  mbx
I L Mari  Mari (East Sepik Province) 3  mds
I L Maria  Maria (Papua New Guinea) 2  mrr
I L Maria  Maria (India) 2  mve
I L Marwari  Marwari (Pakistan) 2  rwr
I L Marwari  Marwari (India) 2  jms
I L Mashi  Mashi (Nigeria) 2  mho
I L Mashi  Mashi (Zambia) 2  mcw
I L Mawa  Mawa (Chad) 2  wma
I E Mawa  Mawa (Nigeria) 2  mpk
I L Mbara  Mbara (Chad) 2  mvl
I E Mbara  Mbara (Australia) 2  mbo
I L Mbo  Mbo (Cameroon) 2  zmw
I L Mbo  Mbo (Democratic Republic of Congo) 2  men
I L Mende  Mende (Sierra Leone) 2  sim
I L Mende  Mende (Papua New Guinea) 2  hna
I L Mina  Mina (Cameroon) 2  myi
I L Mina  Mina (India) 2  mow
I L Moi  Moi (Congo) 2  mxn
I L Moi  Moi (Indonesia) 2  mnh
I L Mono  Mono (Democratic Republic of Congo) 4  mnr
I L Mono  Mono (USA) 4  mru
I L Mono  Mono (Cameroon) 4  mte
I L Mono  Mono (Solomon Islands) 4  mhz
I L Mor  Mor (Mor Islands) 2  moq
I L Mor  Mor (Bomberai Peninsula) 2  mjh
I L Mwera  Mwera (Nyasa) 2  mwe
I L Mwera  Mwera (Chimwera) 2  naq
I L Nama  Nama (Namibia) 2  nmx
I L Nama  Nama (Papua New Guinea) 2  ngd
I L Ngando  Ngando (Central African Republic) 2  nxd
I L Ngando  Ngando (Democratic Republic of Congo) 2  ngc
I L Ngombe  Ngombe (Democratic Republic of Congo) 2  nmj
I L Ngombe  Ngombe (Central African Republic) 2  nnv
I E Nugunu  Nugunu (Australia) 2  yas
I L Nugunu  Nugunu (Cameroon) 2  nun
I L Nung  Nung (Myanmar) 2  nut
I L Nung  Nung (Viet Nam) 2  oke
I L Okpe  Okpe (Southwestern Edo) 2  okx
I L Okpe  Okpe (Northwestern Edo) 2  pnq
I L Pana  Pana (Burkina Faso) 2  pnz
I L Pana  Pana (Central African Republic) 2  ria
I L Riang  Riang (India) 2  ril
I L Riang  Riang (Myanmar) 2  sng
I L Sanga  Sanga (Democratic Republic of Congo) 2  xsn
I L Sanga  Sanga (Nigeria) 2  sbp
I L Sangu  Sangu (Tanzania) 2  snq
I L Sangu  Sangu (Gabon) 2  ske
I L Seke  Seke (Vanuatu) 2  skj
I L Seke  Seke (Nepal) 2  spb
I L Sepa  Sepa (Indonesia) 2  spe
I L Sepa  Sepa (Papua New Guinea) 2  soc
I L So  So (Democratic Republic of Congo) 2  sox
I L So  So (Cameroon) 2  swa sw M L Swahili  Swahili (macrolanguage) 2  swh
I L Swahili  Swahili (individual language) 2  ten
I E Tama  Tama (Colombia) 2  tma
I L Tama  Tama (Chad) 2  tcl
I L Taman  Taman (Myanmar) 2  tmn
I L Taman  Taman (Indonesia) 2  tbt
I L Tembo  Tembo (Kitembo) 2  tmv
I L Tembo  Tembo (Motembo) 2  tew
I L Tewa  Tewa (USA) 2  twe
I L Tewa  Tewa (Indonesia) 2  tnz
I L Tonga  Tonga (Thailand) 4  tog
I L Tonga  Tonga (Nyasa) 4  toi
I L Tonga  Tonga (Zambia) 4  ton to I L Tonga  Tonga (Tonga Islands) 4  don
I L Toura  Toura (Papua New Guinea) 2  neb
I L Toura  Toura (Côte d'Ivoire) 2  uro
I L Ura  Ura (Papua New Guinea) 2  uur
I L Ura  Ura (Vanuatu) 2  wll
I L Wali  Wali (Sudan) 2  wlx
I L Wali  Wali (Ghana) 2  war
I L Waray  Waray (Philippines) 2  wrz
I L Waray  Waray (Australia) 2  wmo
I L Wom  Wom (Papua New Guinea) 2  wom
I L Wom  Wom (Nigeria) 2  axk
I L Yaka  Yaka (Central African Republic) 3  iyx
I L Yaka  Yaka (Congo) 3  yaf
I L Yaka  Yaka (Democratic Republic of Congo) 3  yuw
I L Yau  Yau (Morobe Province) 2  yyu
I L Yau  Yau (Sandaun Province) 2

Here are the unique parentheticals:

 (Akwa Ibom State)  (Australia)  (Bas-UÃ(c)lÃ(c) District)  (Benin)  (Bomberai
Peninsula)  (Brazil)  (Burkina Faso)  (Côte d'Ivoire)  (Cameroon)  (Central
African Republic)  (Chad)  (Chimwera)  (China)  (Colombia)  (Congo)
(Democratic
Republic of Congo)  (East Sepik Province)  (Eastern Highlands)  (Edu
State)  (Equatorial
Guinea)  (Ethiopia)  (Fako Division)  (Gabon)  (Ghana)  (Guinea)
(India)  (individual
language)  (Indonesia)  (Japan)  (Kenya)  (Kitembo)  (Korea)  (Laos)
(Liberia)  (macrolanguage)  (Madang Province)  (Maluku)  (Menchum
Division)  (Mor
Islands)  (Morobe Province)  (Motembo)  (Myanmar)  (Namibia)  (Nepal)
(Nigeria)  (Northwestern Edo)  (Nyasa)  (Pakistan)  (Papua New Guinea)
(Paraguay)  (Philippines)  (Russia)  (Sandaun Province)  (Sierra
Leone)  (Solomon
Islands)  (Southwestern Edo)  (Sudan)  (Sulawesi)  (Tanzania)  (Thailand)
(Togo)  (Tonga Islands)  (Tshopo District)  (Uganda)  (USA)  (Vanuatu)  (Viet
Nam)  (West New Britain)  (Zambia)
I don't see much of a problem with any of them except for the
(macro/individual language) ones.

Mark

On Dec 8, 2007 10:39 AM, Doug Ewell <[e-mail]> wrote:

> Incidentally, this same question applies to cases like the following:
>
> Type: language
> Subtag: ain
> Description: Ainu (Japan)
> Description: Ainu
> Added: 2005-10-16
>
> where:
>
> "Ainu" is the name used in ISO 639-2
>
> "Ainu (Japan)" is the name used in ISO 639-3, because there is also an
> "Ainu (China)" that wasn't coded in 639-2
>
> Does it make sense to include both descriptions?  Doing so might confuse
> people looking for the Chinese Ainu, who find "Ainu = ain" (in a user
> interface, not looking directly at the LSR) and don't realize there is
> also a Japanese Ainu and they've hit it by mistake.  Excluding "Ainu
> (Japan)" would guarantee that this would happen.  But excluding plain
> "Ainu" would once again be unacceptable to people who want all ISO 639-1
> and -2 names (except inversions, now) retained in the LSR.  Which is the
> least problematic course of action?
>
> --
> Doug Ewell  *  Fullerton, California, USA  *  RFC 4645  *  UTN #14
> http://home.roadrunner.com/~dewell <http://home.roadrunner.com/%7Edewell>
> http://www1.ietf.org/html.charters/ltru-charter.html
> http://www.alvestrand.no/mailman/listinfo/ietf-languages  ˆ
>
>
>
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>



-- 
Mark

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