Re: [nfsv4] RFC 7530: Filehandle of opened file after the REMOVE
Marcel Telka <marcel@telka.sk> Tue, 13 December 2016 15:58 UTC
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Date: Tue, 13 Dec 2016 15:58:25 +0000
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From: Marcel Telka <marcel@telka.sk>
To: David Noveck <davenoveck@gmail.com>
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Subject: Re: [nfsv4] RFC 7530: Filehandle of opened file after the REMOVE
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Citát David Noveck <davenoveck@gmail.com>: >> I'm late, I know. > > I guess I can't resist a (barely) relevant movie quote, from *The Big > Short:* > > Dr. Michael Burry: I may have been early, but I'm not wrong. > > Martin Blaine: It's the same thing! > > You're late with this but there would have been no way that you could have > been on time. > If you raised this issue in time for RFC3530, I don't think anyone would > have listened to > you. You could have stuck to your position, made yourself very unpopular > and > prevented NFSv4 from happening. > > RFC3530, RFC7530, RFC 5661 are immutable. The only way they can be changed RFC 3530 is maybe immutable, but also obsoleted, so nobody cares about it much these days. :-) Similarly as nobody cares about RFC 3010 now. > is > via errata, and your judgment, that we made the wrong choice here is not a > good basis > for one. No, I do not suggest that the choice made was wrong. The current wording allows to implement (maybe) simpler NFSv4 servers that do not need to bother with preserving file handles after the REMOVE (if they do not worry about unix). This is good. > > I think this could be addressed in NFSv4 going forward via an extension. Why not to use the note I suggested (properly rephrased, of course) even for RFC 7530 (as errata)? This one: "If the server wants to support the unix semantics (a removed file is accessible until the last close) then the continued access to the file via its file handle until the last CLOSE is essential." It won't change this (or anything else in RFC 7530, AFAIK): o If the file was not opened with OPEN4_SHARE_DENY_WRITE or OPEN4_SHARE_DENY_BOTH, the server SHOULD delete the file's directory entry. However, until the last CLOSE of the file, the server MAY continue to allow access to the file via its filehandle. It will just add a note (or recommendation, suggestion, clarification, whatever) for implementors who want to make sure their NFSv4 servers are properly prepared to support the unix semantics for NFSv4 clients. And, ... what implementors do now with RFC 7530? If they want to support the unix semantics they need to follow the note above albeit it is not written in the RFC. Thanks. -- +-------------------------------------------+ | Marcel Telka e-mail: marcel@telka.sk | | homepage: http://telka.sk/ | | jabber: marcel@jabber.sk | +-------------------------------------------+
- [nfsv4] RFC 7530: Filehandle of opened file after… Marcel Telka
- Re: [nfsv4] RFC 7530: Filehandle of opened file a… David Noveck
- Re: [nfsv4] RFC 7530: Filehandle of opened file a… Marcel Telka
- Re: [nfsv4] RFC 7530: Filehandle of opened file a… David Noveck
- Re: [nfsv4] RFC 7530: Filehandle of opened file a… Marcel Telka
- Re: [nfsv4] RFC 7530: Filehandle of opened file a… David Noveck
- Re: [nfsv4] RFC 7530: Filehandle of opened file a… Marcel Telka
- Re: [nfsv4] RFC 7530: Filehandle of opened file a… Marcel Telka
- Re: [nfsv4] RFC 7530: Filehandle of opened file a… Trond Myklebust
- Re: [nfsv4] RFC 7530: Filehandle of opened file a… Trond Myklebust
- Re: [nfsv4] RFC 7530: Filehandle of opened file a… Marcel Telka
- Re: [nfsv4] RFC 7530: Filehandle of opened file a… David Noveck
- Re: [nfsv4] RFC 7530: Filehandle of opened file a… Marcel Telka
- Re: [nfsv4] RFC 7530: Filehandle of opened file a… Trond Myklebust
- Re: [nfsv4] RFC 7530: Filehandle of opened file a… J. Bruce Fields
- Re: [nfsv4] RFC 7530: Filehandle of opened file a… David Noveck
- Re: [nfsv4] RFC 7530: Filehandle of opened file a… Trond Myklebust
- Re: [nfsv4] RFC 7530: Filehandle of opened file a… Trond Myklebust
- Re: [nfsv4] RFC 7530: Filehandle of opened file a… Benny Halevy
- Re: [nfsv4] RFC 7530: Filehandle of opened file a… Trond Myklebust
- Re: [nfsv4] RFC 7530: Filehandle of opened file a… Bruce James Fields
- Re: [nfsv4] RFC 7530: Filehandle of opened file a… Christoph Hellwig
- Re: [nfsv4] RFC 7530: Filehandle of opened file a… David Noveck
- Re: [nfsv4] RFC 7530: Filehandle of opened file a… David Noveck
- Re: [nfsv4] RFC 7530: Filehandle of opened file a… Christoph Hellwig
- Re: [nfsv4] RFC 7530: Filehandle of opened file a… Tom Talpey
- Re: [nfsv4] RFC 7530: Filehandle of opened file a… Rick Macklem
- Re: [nfsv4] RFC 7530: Filehandle of opened file a… Trond Myklebust
- Re: [nfsv4] RFC 7530: Filehandle of opened file a… David Noveck
- Re: [nfsv4] RFC 7530: Filehandle of opened file a… David Noveck
- Re: [nfsv4] RFC 7530: Filehandle of opened file a… Trond Myklebust
- Re: [nfsv4] RFC 7530: Filehandle of opened file a… David Noveck
- Re: [nfsv4] RFC 7530: Filehandle of opened file a… Trond Myklebust