RE: [NGO] NETCONF Data types
"Natale, Bob" <RNATALE@mitre.org> Sat, 08 December 2007 00:49 UTC
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Subject: RE: [NGO] NETCONF Data types
Date: Fri, 07 Dec 2007 19:49:41 -0500
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From: "Natale, Bob" <RNATALE@mitre.org>
To: David Harrington <ietfdbh@comcast.net>, Sharon Chisholm <schishol@nortel.com>, Andy Bierman <ietf@andybierman.com>
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Hi, I don't mean to "pile on" here...I share Dave's surprise and Andy has already provided a helpful example to illustrate counter vs gauge...and somehow I feel certain that Sharon does know the difference...but I did just want to add that developers *must* understand the distinct semantics of each of those types as a prerequisite for building useful SNMP management applications...and, of course, these semantics must be preserved by non-SNMP management applications that intend to integrate SNMP management data. Cheers, BobN -----Original Message----- From: David Harrington [mailto:ietfdbh@comcast.net] Sent: Wednesday, December 05, 2007 1:57 PM To: 'Sharon Chisholm'; 'Andy Bierman' Cc: ngo@ietf.org Subject: RE: [NGO] NETCONF Data types Hi, > -----Original Message----- > From: Sharon Chisholm [mailto:schishol@nortel.com] > Sent: Wednesday, December 05, 2007 10:31 AM > To: Andy Bierman > Cc: ngo@ietf.org > Subject: RE: [NGO] NETCONF Data types > > Hi > > My logic is that most of the value in types comes from building up > complex types, not by redefining base types. I don't > understand why you > are proposing redefining xs:dateTime to map to what we had in SNMP for > example. I want to make sure we understand the requirements > of the space > we are in now and not just auto-translate data types from > where we were > a few years ago. > > Honestly, I don't know the differences between a counter and > a gauge and > I suspect the a lot of people who read SNMP MIBs who were in the same > boat. In 15 years of advising MIB writers and NMS developers, I have never had anybody complain they didn't understand the difference between a counter and a guage, or thought the distinction was unimportant. I feel sad that you, as a MIB Doctor, do not understand the difference. dbh > > Sharon > > -----Original Message----- > From: Andy Bierman [mailto:ietf@andybierman.com] > Sent: Wednesday, December 05, 2007 1:15 PM > To: Chisholm, Sharon (CAR:ZZ00) > Cc: balazs.lengyel@ericsson.com; ngo@ietf.org > Subject: Re: [NGO] NETCONF Data types > > Sharon Chisholm wrote: > > Hi > > > > But just because they are used in programming, doesn't mean > we need to > > > distinguish them in the XSD. I'm going to check with some > of my apps > > people to see whether they would find this distinction > useful or if a > > single integer which could be as large as 64 bit is fine at > this later > > > point in time. But I was more specifically worried about counter > > versus gauge versus integer versus unsigned integer versus. > > Historically these turned into CLRs. > > > > I totally disagree. > I remember several times, NMS programmers at Cisco asking for int8, > int16, uint8, uint16. It is very useful to have these 'extra' types. > > I also think it has been very useful to distinguish between gauges, > counters, and simple numbers in SMIv2. > If one followed your logic to the end, we would only have 'string', > since that is the only 'real' content in an XML simpleType. > > > > An advantage here if we don't limit the length of our integers, we > > won't need to rewrite our Schema when we need 128bit integers ;-) > > > > > > We can add them later if and when somebody has a compelling use case. > > > Sharon > > > > Andy > > > -----Original Message----- > > From: Balazs Lengyel [mailto:balazs.lengyel@ericsson.com] > > Sent: Wednesday, December 05, 2007 3:32 AM > > To: Chisholm, Sharon (CAR:ZZ00) > > Cc: ngo@ietf.org > > Subject: Re: [NGO] NETCONF Data types > > > > Hello Sharon, > > The uint32, int64 etc. integer types are not a left-overs from SMI. > They > > are the integer types that people normally use in programing. Names > like > > uint16, int32 are better then short or long. They tell you exactly > what > > you deal with. I see this as an improvement over the XSD types. > > Balazs > > > > Sharon Chisholm wrote: > > > >> Hi > >> > >> One of the things that people seemed to agree on early in > the NETCONF > > >> content discussion was that SNMP & SMI defined too many > similar data > >> types and we didn't want to do that in NETCONF. Do people > still agree > > >> that we don't want 30 flavours of integers defined? I > prefer focusing > > >> our efforts on defining higher level data types. > >> > >> Sharon Chisholm > >> Nortel > >> Ottawa, Ontario > >> Canada > >> > >> > >> _______________________________________________ > >> NGO mailing list > >> NGO@ietf.org > >> https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ngo > >> > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > > NGO mailing list > > NGO@ietf.org > > https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ngo > > > > > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > NGO mailing list > NGO@ietf.org > https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ngo > _______________________________________________ NGO mailing list NGO@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ngo _______________________________________________ NGO mailing list NGO@ietf.org https://www1.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ngo
- [NGO] NETCONF Data types Sharon Chisholm
- Re: [NGO] NETCONF Data types Juergen Schoenwaelder
- Re: [NGO] NETCONF Data types Andy Bierman
- RE: [NGO] NETCONF Data types Sharon Chisholm
- Re: [NGO] NETCONF Data types Andy Bierman
- Re: [NGO] NETCONF Data types Juergen Schoenwaelder
- Re: [NGO] NETCONF Data types Martin Bjorklund
- Re: [NGO] NETCONF Data types Balazs Lengyel
- RE: [NGO] NETCONF Data types Sharon Chisholm
- Re: [NGO] NETCONF Data types Andy Bierman
- RE: [NGO] NETCONF Data types Sharon Chisholm
- Re: [NGO] NETCONF Data types Ladislav Lhotka
- Re: [NGO] NETCONF Data types Martin Bjorklund
- Re: [NGO] NETCONF Data types Andy Bierman
- RE: [NGO] NETCONF Data types David Harrington
- Re: [NGO] NETCONF Data types Ladislav Lhotka
- RE: [NGO] NETCONF Data types Mehmet Ersue
- Re: [NGO] NETCONF Data types Juergen Schoenwaelder
- Re: [NGO] NETCONF Data types tom.petch
- Re: [NGO] NETCONF Data types Juergen Schoenwaelder
- Re: [NGO] NETCONF Data types Andy Bierman
- Re: [NGO] NETCONF Data types Andy Bierman
- RE: [NGO] NETCONF Data types Natale, Bob
- RE: [NGO] NETCONF Data types Sharon Chisholm
- Re: [NGO] NETCONF Data types Juergen Schoenwaelder
- RE: [NGO] NETCONF Data types Sharon Chisholm
- RE: [NGO] NETCONF Data types Ladislav Lhotka
- Re: [NGO] NETCONF Data types Juergen Schoenwaelder
- Re: [NGO] NETCONF Data types Phil Shafer
- RE: [NGO] NETCONF Data types Sharon Chisholm
- Re: [NGO] NETCONF Data types Phil Shafer
- RE: [NGO] NETCONF Data types Sharon Chisholm
- Re: [NGO] NETCONF Data types Juergen Schoenwaelder