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Re: Opsdir last call review of draft-ietf-quic-manageability-14

"Brian Trammell (IETF)" <ietf@trammell.ch> Wed, 23 March 2022 10:44 UTC

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Subject: Re: Opsdir last call review of draft-ietf-quic-manageability-14
From: "Brian Trammell (IETF)" <ietf@trammell.ch>
In-Reply-To: <6D781BCF-9C70-40AF-AA3F-BED0A1A6CC51@trammell.ch>
Date: Wed, 23 Mar 2022 11:43:59 +0100
Cc: "ops-dir@ietf.org" <ops-dir@ietf.org>, "last-call@ietf.org" <last-call@ietf.org>, "draft-ietf-quic-manageability.all@ietf.org" <draft-ietf-quic-manageability.all@ietf.org>, Mirja Kuehlewind <mirja.kuehlewind@ericsson.com>, "quic@ietf.org" <quic@ietf.org>, Paul Vixie <paul=40redbarn.org@dmarc.ietf.org>
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To: Paul Vixie <paul@redbarn.org>
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For the record, this is now in https://github.com/quicwg/ops-drafts/pull/463

> On 23 Mar 2022, at 11:17, Brian Trammell (IETF) <ietf@trammell.ch> wrote:
> 
> Hi Paul,
> 
> Cutting a bit to try to get this to concrete actions on the document; will follow up on the other points in a subsequent message...
> 
>> On 22 Mar 2022, at 17:25, Paul Vixie <paul@redbarn.org> wrote:
>> <snip>
>> perhaps this wording will be if lesser concern to you:
>> 
>> <<Identification of QUIC traffic by on-path actors such as network operators is not reliable. Therefore a heuristic along the lines of "any unrecognizable UDP traffic could be QUIC" is the least unappealing way for a network operator to characterize their network's UDP traffic in the QUIC era.>>
> 
> I don’t think this fits editorially with the rest of the document. However, I do see your point that “not designed to be distinguishable” is maybe not strong enough. I also note that there’s something hiding in the rest of Section 3.1 that we should maybe make more explicit: “this traffic is definitely QUIC” is probabilistically doable, but there are better heuristics on a per-application basis.
> 
> How about something like:
> 
> <<The QUIC wire image is not specifically designed to be distinguishable from other UDP traffic by a passive observer in the network. While certain QUIC applications may be heuristically identifiable on a per-application basis, there is no general method for distinguishing QUIC traffic from otherwise-unclassifiable UDP traffic on a given link. Any unrecognized UDP traffic may therefore be QUIC traffic.>>
> 
> ?
> 
> Cheers,
> 
> Brian
>

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