Re: [89attendees] unlawful in Britain to carry pocketknives thatlock

----- Original Message -----
From: "DRAGE, Keith (Keith)" <keith.drage@alcatel-lucent.com>
To: "Christer Holmberg" <christer.holmberg@ericsson.com>; "t.p."
<daedulus@btconnect.com>; "Murphy, Sandra" <Sandra.Murphy@parsons.com>;
<89attendees@ietf.org>
Sent: Sunday, March 09, 2014 1:52 AM

It is surely reasonable to be expected to know something of the law of
the countries you are visiting. There is no need for the IETF to have to
warn of this. Most governments have web pages that give a simple summary
of the law and this is hardly hidden (as already identified):

https://www.gov.uk/find-out-if-i-can-buy-or-carry-a-knife

<tp>

I read a novel set in America that made no sense, until I learnt that
the age of consent in the state where the novel was set was twenty one.
Weird; well, no, my ignorance, like the age of consent being 13 in parts
of Europe. It reminds me of my ignorance and I see the UK law on knives
as odd and, as I said before, reflecting recent case history.  If you
know
to look for it, yes you will find it but, from most countries, a visitor
may be surprised.  Alcohol consumption in public is another one.
Getting
liquids (which may gels or pastes and in no sense liquid) past airport
security is another.  When I go as a tourist, yes I will study a guide
book beforehand, on business,
somehow I think I should know - but I don't.

Memo to self - always buy and read  a 'Rough Guide' beforehand.

Tom Petch

In general in England and Wales it is illegal to carry anything in
public that can be regarded as an offensive weapon. It is not reasonable
to carry any weapon for "protection". And if you need to carry tools for
your trade that might be construed as a offensive weapon, you are best
to lock them away out of sight.

However I doubt whether your colleague will suffer the full weight of
the law of a 4 year prison sentence and a £5000 fine. I suspect in this
case he will hear no more about it.

Maybe this is why our rate for unlawful killing 1.0 per 100 000 rather
than 4.7 per 100 000, and still too high.

Regards

Keith

> -----Original Message-----
> From: 89attendees [mailto:89attendees-bounces@ietf.org] On
> Behalf Of Christer Holmberg
> Sent: 08 March 2014 14:10
> To: t.p.; Murphy, Sandra; 89attendees@ietf.org
> Subject: Re: [89attendees] unlawful in Britain to carry
> pocketknives that lock
>
> Hi,
>
> >> The security check at the London Eye discovered that one of the
> >> members of our group carried a pocketknife.  The
> pocketknife was the
> >> safety type, where the blade locks to prevent self-injury.
> >>
> >> Turns out that locking blade pocketknives are illegal in Britain.
> >> The knife was confiscated and a form had to be filled out
> with name,
> >> address, age and place of birth (one presumes to identify
> a passport number).  The form will be turned over to the police.
> >>
> >> Did this info get mentioned on the attendee list?  I do not recall
> >> seeing it, but I might not have paid attention.  And I'm
> apologize if
> >> this is common knowledge that no one would have thought
> worth mentioning.
> >
> > Yes, it is so common knowledge in England that I would
> never have thought to mention it (although > would in future,
> now you point it out).
> > Thinking about it, guns are mercifully rare in this
> country, compared
> > to what I understand the situation is in America, so the
> young on the
> > rampage go shanked or bladed; most of the more notorious
> street crime
> > is committed with a blade, not a gun, and I think that the
> evolution of the law over the past decade or so reflects that.
> >
> > Drugs are another area where the law of England might catch
> visitors out but I would expect that to > be more self-evident.
>
> I don't think anyone should have a responsibility to inform
> people of these kind of things, unless someone asks.
>
> If someone travels to an IETF meeting in a foreign country,
> it is his/her responsibility to figure out about the local
> laws - at least if he/she is planning to wear knives, use
> drugs, and/or perform any other activity that has nothing to
> do with the IETF meeting.
>
> Otherwise, one may get a learn-it-the-hard-way reminder that
> things aren't always the same as home :)
>
> Regards,
>
> Christer
>
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