Re: [Ecrit] Expert Reviewer's response to request to register 'country-specific' in 'sos' Subservice Registry in the Service URN Labels group

Randall Gellens <rg+ietf@randy.pensive.org> Wed, 16 November 2016 23:41 UTC

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Date: Wed, 16 Nov 2016 15:41:12 -0800
To: Brian Rosen <br@salsgiver.com>, Ivo Sedlacek <ivo.sedlacek@ericsson.com>
From: Randall Gellens <rg+ietf@randy.pensive.org>
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Subject: Re: [Ecrit] Expert Reviewer's response to request to register 'country-specific' in 'sos' Subservice Registry in the Service URN Labels group
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At 10:43 AM +0900 11/16/16, Brian Rosen wrote:

>  Ivo, I apologize for not making sure this 
> request was not ultimately concluded 
> satisfactorily.
>
>  I would like to ask the work group for advice 
> for police, and I will do the work to make 
> registrations simple.
>
>  We can use the "a" levels, or we can create a 
> sub registry for .police.  Either requires a 
> standards track document to create a sub 
> registry.  Alternatively, we could just allow a 
> period in a name and register 
> "police.municipal" or "police.a2" as top level 
> registrations in a registration.

Since a period is used now to delineate child 
services, I don't think we can use a period in a 
label for the pseudo sub-service.  Creating a new 
subregistry seems cleaner, and better fits with 
the intent.  That way, if a URN requests 
"sos.police.municipal" (or "sos.police.FBI" or 
"sos.police.DEA") in a region that doesn't have 
that specific subservice, the call can be treated 
as "sos.police" or just "sos".

>  Let's first decide which way: .police.a2 or .police.municipal
>
>  The  former is more regular and handles 
> political subdivision easily.  However, there 
> are police forces which don't fit this pattern. 
>  US has "Federal Marshals" and "FBI" and 
> "Secret Service" although some of them don't 
> have emergency numbers.
>
>  My suggestion is to create the sub registry for 
> police, have the "a" levels as initial values, 
> and allow additional values to be added with 
> expert review.

Since you've identified cases that don't fit well 
into the "a" levels, as long as we don't expect a 
large number of such police subservices to be 
registered, I'd suggest using the descriptive 
names instead.  (E.g., "police.municipal", 
"police.tourist", maybe "police.FBI" or 
"police.DEA".

>  I am not aware of similar issues with fire or 
> emergency medical.  There are many countries 
> which have multiple medical services but AFAIK 
> only one emergency number that is used for 
> emergency medical.  If there are some isolated 
> instances, I'd allow a random sub service 
> (urn:service:sos.medical.mountain) registration.
>
>  I do think that if we don't allow 
> "country-specific" then we are obligated to 
> make handling these kinds of requests 
> straightforward.
>
>  Brian
>
>
>>  On Nov 16, 2016, at 10:17 AM, Ivo Sedlacek 
>> <<mailto:ivo.sedlacek@ericsson.com>ivo.sedlacek@ericsson.com> 
>> wrote:
>>
>>  Hello,
>>
>>   > Since the management policy of the 
>> emergency service is "expert review", the 
>> barrier to adding new, possibly experimental 
>> services is low,
>>   > and the consequences of having services 
>> that are not eventually deployed persisting in 
>> the registry is minimal.
>>
>>  I tried to register emergency URNs
>>  - for emergency service of municipal police; and
>>  - for emergency service of national police
>>  (both of which are used in Czech republic) 
>> with IANA 
>> in <https://www.ietf.org/mail-archive/web/ecrit/current/msg08419.html>https://www.ietf.org/mail-archive/web/ecrit/current/msg08419.html
>>
>>  The registration was rejected ....
>>
>>  So, I disagree that barrieer is low.
>>
>>  Kind regards
>>
>>  Ivo Sedlacek
>>
>>  From: Ecrit 
>> [<mailto:ecrit-bounces@ietf.org>mailto:ecrit-bounces@ietf.org] On 
>> Behalf 
>> Of <mailto:R.Jesske@telekom.de>R.Jesske@telekom.de
>>  Sent: Tuesday, November 15, 2016 5:08 PM
>> 
>> To: <mailto:br@salsgiver.com>br@salsgiver.com; <mailto:iana@iana.org>iana@iana.org
>>  Cc: <mailto:ecrit@ietf.org>ecrit@ietf.org
>>  Subject: Re: [Ecrit] Expert Reviewer's 
>> response to request to register 
>> 'country-specific' in 'sos' Subservice 
>> Registry in the Service URN Labels group
>>
>>  Hi Brian,
>>  the aimed registration is for 3GPP networks 
>> only and not to be intended to be used 
>> everywhere.
>>
>>  So from my understanding there are a many of 
>> existing specific emergency services out in 
>> the world which need the equivalent within the 
>> 3GPP IMS world.
>>
>>  An example is Poland:
>>  Please 
>> see <http://uke.gov.pl/tablice-numerow-kierowania-alarmowego-nka-9410>http://uke.gov.pl/tablice-numerow-kierowania-alarmowego-nka-9410 which 
>> lists the number 986 for "stra› miejska" (= 
>> municipal police) and the number 997 for 
>> Policja (= police) as "numery alarmowe" (= 
>> emergency numbers).
>>  Which cannot use the normal sos urn.
>>
>>  3GPP had the requirement to specify this for 
>> the 3GPP IMS world. And the easiest way was to 
>> have such an mechanism.
>>  Since this is only used for the 3GPP IMS 
>> world, 3GPP would like to have a mechanism to 
>> allow these  specific suptypes.
>>
>>  So what could be done to get such an solution where IETF can agree upon?
>>
>>  Best Regards
>>
>>  Roland
>>
>>  Von: Ecrit 
>> [<mailto:ecrit-bounces@ietf.org>mailto:ecrit-bounces@ietf.org] Im 
>> Auftrag von Brian Rosen
>>  Gesendet: Donnerstag, 10. November 2016 15:54
>>  An: <mailto:iana@iana.org>iana@iana.org
>>  Cc: ECRIT
>>  Betreff: [Ecrit] Expert Reviewer's response to 
>> request to register 'country-specific' in 
>> 'sos' Subservice Registry in the Service URN 
>> Labels group
>>
>>  I am the expert reviewer designated by the 
>> ecrit working group for this request.
>>
>>  I believe this request is not consistent with 
>> the words and the intent of the registry. 
>>  "country-specific' is not an emergency 
>> service.  Since the management policy of the 
>> emergency service is "expert review", the 
>> barrier to adding new, possibly experimental 
>> services is low, and the consequences of 
>> having services that are not eventually 
>> deployed persisting in the registry is 
>> minimal.  The URN was not intended to have a 
>> generic X- service or equivalent, which is 
>> what this registration attempts to do.  New 
>> services, even experimental services, should 
>> register the service with IANA following the 
>> normal procedure.
>>
>>  Therefore, I recommend that we deny this 
>> request and suggest that the specific services 
>> be registered with IANA as they are deployed. 
>>  This decision has been reviewed with the 
>> ecrit working group.
>>
>>  Brian
>>
>>
>>  On Nov 3, 2016, at 3:59 PM, Az Mankin 
>> <<mailto:azmankin@gmail.com>azmankin@gmail.com> 
>> wrote:
>>
>>
>>  ECRIT Working Group,
>>
>>  We need a volunteer for the following IANA 
>> Expert Review request that Amanda Baber of 
>> IANA just sent to Roger and me.  It needs to 
>> be written and sent to the mailing list, per 
>> the IESG's appointment of the WG as the Expert 
>> Reviewer 
>> (<http://www.iana.org/assignments/urn-serviceid-labels/urn-serviceid-labels.xhtml>http://www.iana.org/assignments/urn-serviceid-labels/urn-serviceid-labels.xhtml). 
>> Amanda's message is under the line. Who'd like 
>> to step up for this?
>>
>>  Thanks!  from your Chairs
>>  ----------------
>>
>>
>>
>>  The IANA Services Operator has received a 
>> request for registration in the 'sos' 
>> Sub-Services registry in the Service URN 
>> Labels group. This request comes from Frederic 
>> Firmin of ETSI.
>>
>>  According to RFC 7163, registration in 'sos' 
>> Sub-Services requires expert review as 
>> designated by the ECRIT working group or its 
>> successor (or, in their absence, the IESG). 
>> Can you send this request for review?
>>
>>  The IESG has asked that expert reviews be 
>> completed within two weeks, if possible.
>>
>>  See below.
>>
>>  thanks,
>>
>>  Amanda Baber
>>  Lead IANA Services Specialist
>>  PTI
>>
>>  ===
>>
>>  Contact Name:
>>  Frederic Firmin
>>
>>  Contact Email:
>>  <mailto:frederic.firmin@etsi.org>frederic.firmin@etsi.org
>>
>>  Type of Assignment:
>>  sub-service URN
>>
>>  Registry:
>>  Service URN Labels registry with the "sos" URN Service Labels subregistry.
>>
>>  Description:
>>  This sub-service type is used before an 
>> appropriate sub-service type is registered 
>> with IANA for a specific emergency service. 
>> This sub-service type is not used where an 
>> appropriate sub-service type has been 
>> registered with IANA for the specific 
>> emergency service.
>>  The next level of sub-services indicates the 
>> country where the specific emergency service 
>> is used. Subtypes below this are defined by 
>> national regulation of that country and are 
>> not registered with IANA.
>>
>>
>>  Additional Info:
>>  The following service URN is proposed to be registered:
>>  urn:service:sos.country-specific
>>
>>  reference: 24.229 12.14.0 available 
>> at <http://www.3gpp.org/ftp/Specs/archive/24_series/24.229/24229-ce0.zip>http://www.3gpp.org/ftp/Specs/archive/24_series/24.229/24229-ce0.zip (cf 
>> subclause 7.11.1)
>>
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>> 
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>>
>
>
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-- 
Randall Gellens
Opinions are personal;    facts are suspect;    I speak for myself only
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Very funny, Scotty.  Now beam down my clothes.