Re: [hybi] Framing take IV
Jamie Lokier <jamie@shareable.org> Wed, 04 August 2010 02:15 UTC
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Date: Wed, 04 Aug 2010 03:15:24 +0100
From: Jamie Lokier <jamie@shareable.org>
To: Scott Ferguson <ferg@caucho.com>
Message-ID: <20100804021524.GS27827@shareable.org>
References: <AANLkTinyrDoG5d_Ur6HVRy=SgMPjLzJtpJ++Ye=1DQdj@mail.gmail.com> <Pine.LNX.4.64.1008040050040.5947@ps20323.dreamhostps.com> <28A6543A-5CA6-42B7-8D2E-F5511EE20008@apple.com> <4C58C2F6.8050608@caucho.com> <Pine.LNX.4.64.1008040132190.5947@ps20323.dreamhostps.com> <4C58C4C8.5020900@caucho.com>
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Cc: hybi@ietf.org
Subject: Re: [hybi] Framing take IV
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Scott Ferguson wrote: > Ian Hickson wrote: > >On Tue, 3 Aug 2010, Scott Ferguson wrote: > > > >>>I agree. I can't see any benefit to fragmentation over a variable-size > >>>length field for an initial version without multiplexing. If the > >>>variable-size length field is well-designed, then in the common case > >>>where the message size is small it will only cost one extra branch to > >>>read the length. In the rare case where the message size is large, a > >>>variable-size length is easier to deal with than reassembling > >>>fragments, and easier on the sending side too. > >>> > >>Some of us don't have infinite memory when sending messages. > >> > > > >Why do you need infinite memory? > > > > Because we don't know the length of dynamically produced content until > the dynamic process is complete. That's why HTTP added chunking. I agree (and favour chunking like this), however there is a counterargument (which shouldn't be assumed to have my support): The JS API does not permit incremental delivery of parts of a message as they arrive, so from the JS API perspective, everything is done with whole messages. If you have incrementally delivered large messages, it's possible to write a WebSocket protocol that depends on this (maybe even bidirectionally) and is usable by non-JS clients, yet is impossible to use from JS API browser clients. So if you want to send large messages of unknown size that are sure to be equally accessible to the JS API as other clients, think in terms of "joining messages in an application-visible manner" rather than splitting them. -- Jamie
- Re: [hybi] Framing take IV Scott Ferguson
- Re: [hybi] Framing take IV Ian Hickson
- Re: [hybi] Framing take IV Ian Hickson
- [hybi] Framing take IV Greg Wilkins
- Re: [hybi] Framing take IV Ian Fette (イアンフェッティ)
- Re: [hybi] Framing take IV Greg Wilkins
- Re: [hybi] Framing take IV Thomson, Martin
- Re: [hybi] Framing take IV Greg Wilkins
- Re: [hybi] Framing take IV Maciej Stachowiak
- Re: [hybi] Framing take IV Maciej Stachowiak
- Re: [hybi] Framing take IV Greg Wilkins
- Re: [hybi] Framing take IV Scott Ferguson
- Re: [hybi] Framing take IV Scott Ferguson
- Re: [hybi] Framing take IV Ian Hickson
- Re: [hybi] Framing take IV Ian Fette (イアンフェッティ)
- Re: [hybi] Framing take IV Jamie Lokier
- Re: [hybi] Framing take IV Jamie Lokier
- Re: [hybi] Framing take IV Maciej Stachowiak
- Re: [hybi] Framing take IV Greg Wilkins
- Re: [hybi] Framing take IV Jamie Lokier
- Re: [hybi] Framing take IV Ian Fette (イアンフェッティ)
- Re: [hybi] Framing take IV Greg Wilkins
- Re: [hybi] Framing take IV Greg Wilkins
- Re: [hybi] Framing take IV Jamie Lokier
- Re: [hybi] Framing take IV Maciej Stachowiak
- Re: [hybi] Framing take IV Greg Wilkins
- Re: [hybi] Framing take IV Jamie Lokier
- Re: [hybi] Framing take IV Ian Fette (イアンフェッティ)
- Re: [hybi] Framing take IV Ian Hickson
- Re: [hybi] Framing take IV Ian Fette (イアンフェッティ)
- Re: [hybi] Framing take IV Thomson, Martin
- Re: [hybi] Framing take IV Ian Hickson
- Re: [hybi] Framing take IV Ian Hickson
- Re: [hybi] Framing take IV Ian Fette (イアンフェッティ)
- Re: [hybi] Framing take IV Roberto Peon
- Re: [hybi] Framing take IV Ian Hickson
- Re: [hybi] Framing take IV Thomson, Martin
- Re: [hybi] Framing take IV Greg Wilkins
- Re: [hybi] Framing take IV [why fragment] Greg Wilkins
- Re: [hybi] Framing take IV Scott Ferguson
- Re: [hybi] Framing take IV [why fragment] Patrick McManus
- Re: [hybi] Framing take IV [why fragment] Patrick McManus
- Re: [hybi] Framing take IV Mike Belshe
- Re: [hybi] Framing take IV Douglas Otis
- Re: [hybi] Framing take IV Ian Hickson
- Re: [hybi] Framing take IV [why fragment] Ian Hickson
- Re: [hybi] Framing take IV [why fragment] Patrick McManus
- Re: [hybi] Framing take IV [why fragment] Ian Hickson
- [hybi] Good arguments (was: Framing take IV) S Moonesamy
- Re: [hybi] Framing take IV Jamie Lokier
- Re: [hybi] Framing take IV Jamie Lokier
- Re: [hybi] Framing take IV Jamie Lokier
- Re: [hybi] Framing take IV Greg Wilkins
- Re: [hybi] Framing take IV Greg Wilkins
- Re: [hybi] Framing take IV [why fragment] Scott Ferguson
- Re: [hybi] Framing take IV Greg Wilkins
- Re: [hybi] Framing take IV [why fragment] John Tamplin
- Re: [hybi] Framing take IV [why fragment] Scott Ferguson
- Re: [hybi] Framing take IV [why fragment] Dave Cridland
- Re: [hybi] Framing take IV [why fragment] Scott Ferguson
- Re: [hybi] Framing take IV [why fragment] John Tamplin
- Re: [hybi] Framing take IV [why fragment] Jack Moffitt
- Re: [hybi] Framing take IV [why fragment] Dave Cridland
- Re: [hybi] Framing take IV [why fragment] Dave Cridland
- Re: [hybi] Framing take IV Yves Lafon
- Re: [hybi] Framing take IV [why fragment] Roberto Peon
- Re: [hybi] Framing take IV [why fragment] Dave Cridland
- Re: [hybi] Framing take IV [why fragment] John Tamplin
- Re: [hybi] Framing take IV [why fragment] John Tamplin
- Re: [hybi] Framing take IV [why fragment] Scott Ferguson
- Re: [hybi] Framing take IV [why fragment] Greg Wilkins
- Re: [hybi] Framing take IV [why fragment] Greg Wilkins
- Re: [hybi] Framing take IV Jamie Lokier
- Re: [hybi] Framing take IV Thomson, Martin