Re: Diversity and offensive terminology in RFCs

[Kathleen Moriarty <[e-mail]>]

On Thu, Sep 20, 2018 at 9:26 AM Toerless Eckert <[e-mail]> wrote:

> I also find the stereotyping of names in signalling terminology highly
> offensive and non-inclusive: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alice_and_Bob
>
> Why are only Alice and Bob so chatty to always have the most conversations
> ?
> Won't Carol get depressions from always being a third rail ? Will your kids
> ever get jobs if you name them Craig, Mallory, Eve or Heidi ?  And so on.
> These SIP heads are ruining the life of our kids!
>

And what if your last name were Moriarty?  You'd never have the community
be okay with you as a Security AD? ;-)

I'm fine with Block/permit lists, but don't think there is a racial
connotation to black/white list.  White lists being preferred may be where
the issue arrises I'm guessing.  Switching would be fine with me.

I already say active interception or session hijacking and think that's a
fine replacement for man-in-the-middle.  I didn't see an issue with
man-in-the-middle.

I do recall a recent draft coming through the IESG (within the last year or
so) with monkey-in-the-middle and remember doing some searches on it prior
ro entering comments on the draft.  I think it was commented on by an AD,
but don't remember where that landed.

Best regards,
Kathleen

>
> *sigh*
>
> Keep your virtue signalling out of my language!
>
> --
> Toerless
>
> On Thu, Sep 20, 2018 at 11:25:58AM +0200, Niels ten Oever wrote:
> > Hi all,
> >
> > On the hrpc-list [0] there has been an intense conversation which was
> > spurred by the news that the Python community removed Master/Slave
> > terminology from its programming language [1].
> >
> > In the discussion that followed it was remarked that in RFCs terms like
> > Master/Slave, blacklist/whitelist, man-in-middle, and other terminology
> > that is offensive to some people and groups is quite common.
> >
> > This is not a discussion that can be resolved in hrpc, but rather should
> > be dealt with in the IETF community (because hrpc doesn't make policy
> > for terminology in the IETF), which is why I am posting this here.
> >
> > If people find the discussion worthwhile, we might also be just in time
> > to request a BoF on this topic.
> >
> > Looking forward to discuss.
> >
> > Best,
> >
> > Niels
> >
> >
> > [0] https://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/browse/hrpc/
> > [1]
> >
> https://motherboard.vice.com/en_us/article/8x7akv/masterslave-terminology-was-removed-from-python-programming-language
> >
> >
> > --
> > Niels ten Oever
> > Researcher and PhD Candidate
> > Datactive Research Group
> > University of Amsterdam
> >
> > PGP fingerprint          2458 0B70 5C4A FD8A 9488
> >                    643A 0ED8 3F3A 468A C8B3
>
>

-- 

Best regards,
Kathleen