Re: [v6ops] Revised Internet Drafts for allocation of IPv6 space for LISP EIDs

Brian E Carpenter <brian.e.carpenter@gmail.com> Thu, 24 October 2013 02:55 UTC

Return-Path: <brian.e.carpenter@gmail.com>
X-Original-To: v6ops@ietfa.amsl.com
Delivered-To: v6ops@ietfa.amsl.com
Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 2405E11E81A2 for <v6ops@ietfa.amsl.com>; Wed, 23 Oct 2013 19:55:13 -0700 (PDT)
X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com
X-Spam-Flag: NO
X-Spam-Score: -102.237
X-Spam-Level:
X-Spam-Status: No, score=-102.237 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=-0.238, BAYES_00=-2.599, J_CHICKENPOX_13=0.6, USER_IN_WHITELIST=-100]
Received: from mail.ietf.org ([12.22.58.30]) by localhost (ietfa.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id incsQ2jcYf+1 for <v6ops@ietfa.amsl.com>; Wed, 23 Oct 2013 19:55:12 -0700 (PDT)
Received: from mail-pa0-x22d.google.com (mail-pa0-x22d.google.com [IPv6:2607:f8b0:400e:c03::22d]) by ietfa.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id A5A5A11E80E2 for <v6ops@ietf.org>; Wed, 23 Oct 2013 19:55:12 -0700 (PDT)
Received: by mail-pa0-f45.google.com with SMTP id kp14so1523349pab.4 for <v6ops@ietf.org>; Wed, 23 Oct 2013 19:55:12 -0700 (PDT)
DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=gmail.com; s=20120113; h=message-id:date:from:organization:user-agent:mime-version:to:cc :subject:references:in-reply-to:content-type :content-transfer-encoding; bh=DmZrFdTtObMfvrVcbssUbv9LITMMFw9q5ITqR2YH3aI=; b=TJ4qQQkRcMOFkasqUpFQHL6mftpa1LpfPa2N6RhyHtb/2d/T9AqtcibhfwB3XrJf02 zyyGFIBO9THpPn07svb5QYaO5pY+dkZNrHFJjJkWCjmAQcI1lDIIZs6/eOYC/qwfq7b2 yzLsPEFY87HabE99AhFDZQQ9glTabv8KMNXSmHwMePKb7wkmjSpFzx+z2ogtZRvtsIUW 9QvGeAoJegLzx34myL4ZwTQDfUVCbXJQUkn3W2cGxcvTLZdvqw0xoeCQHM9/Pce8Zenv WMw5Pr0NbvadFrpKR2gFKVAGmIiVHZOc9eDJoXtmjOJoTJGDo+DkxTJkf68zUU6enBZ+ X6SQ==
X-Received: by 10.66.66.11 with SMTP id b11mr948401pat.154.1382583312378; Wed, 23 Oct 2013 19:55:12 -0700 (PDT)
Received: from [192.168.178.20] (186.201.69.111.dynamic.snap.net.nz. [111.69.201.186]) by mx.google.com with ESMTPSA id lm2sm1341624pab.2.2013.10.23.19.55.09 for <multiple recipients> (version=TLSv1 cipher=ECDHE-RSA-RC4-SHA bits=128/128); Wed, 23 Oct 2013 19:55:11 -0700 (PDT)
Message-ID: <52688C15.2010601@gmail.com>
Date: Thu, 24 Oct 2013 15:55:17 +1300
From: Brian E Carpenter <brian.e.carpenter@gmail.com>
Organization: University of Auckland
User-Agent: Thunderbird 2.0.0.6 (Windows/20070728)
MIME-Version: 1.0
To: "cb.list6" <cb.list6@gmail.com>
References: <28CFF7E5-E98E-4D97-B7F4-3A18C255253C@gigix.net> <D62C71FC-306F-4F91-97E2-84D6F64A58A3@istaff.org> <5267E96B.1000802@innovationslab.net> <20131023152549.GN50205@Space.Net> <5267EB60.7080105@innovationslab.net> <CAKD1Yr1SpS0e3qDkZyRsiSB-a_oXCi7nWKe2szxW34mJfhJnxw@mail.gmail.com> <5267ED12.4090602@innovationslab.net> <5268232A.2000805@gmail.com> <CAD6AjGRRFCeT3R=Vp+Y_zhfTcXMRivuKHYDFy3iQkfFmP85dxw@mail.gmail.com>
In-Reply-To: <CAD6AjGRRFCeT3R=Vp+Y_zhfTcXMRivuKHYDFy3iQkfFmP85dxw@mail.gmail.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
Cc: "v6ops@ietf.org WG" <v6ops@ietf.org>
Subject: Re: [v6ops] Revised Internet Drafts for allocation of IPv6 space for LISP EIDs
X-BeenThere: v6ops@ietf.org
X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.12
Precedence: list
List-Id: v6ops discussion list <v6ops.ietf.org>
List-Unsubscribe: <https://www.ietf.org/mailman/options/v6ops>, <mailto:v6ops-request@ietf.org?subject=unsubscribe>
List-Archive: <http://www.ietf.org/mail-archive/web/v6ops>
List-Post: <mailto:v6ops@ietf.org>
List-Help: <mailto:v6ops-request@ietf.org?subject=help>
List-Subscribe: <https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/v6ops>, <mailto:v6ops-request@ietf.org?subject=subscribe>
X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 24 Oct 2013 02:55:13 -0000

On 24/10/2013 09:00, cb.list6 wrote:
> On Wed, Oct 23, 2013 at 12:27 PM, Brian E Carpenter
> <brian.e.carpenter@gmail.com> wrote:
>> On 24/10/2013 04:36, Brian Haberman wrote:
>>> Hi Lorenzo,
>>>
>>> On 10/23/13 11:31 AM, Lorenzo Colitti wrote:
>>>> On Thu, Oct 24, 2013 at 12:29 AM, Brian Haberman
>>>> <brian@innovationslab.net>wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> "In order to provide connectivity between the Legacy Internet and LISP
>>>>> sites, PITRs announcing large aggregates (ideally one single large
>>>>> aggregate) of the IPv6 EID Block could be deployed."
>>>>>
>>>> That sounds very much like a 6to4 relay router, which experience has shown
>>>> was an unworkable deployment model. Why is this different?
>>>>
>>> It's not different.  But, that is the tact the LISP WG is trying to
>>> take.  Keep in mind that the referenced draft went through IETF Last
>>> Call and was subsequently sent back to the WG due to the concerns raised
>>> about routing and potentially creating a parallel address registry
>>> outside of the RIRs.
>> I think there is one difference from the 6to4 case - well, two actually.
>>
>> 1. A lot of operators learnt the hard way that failing to coordinate
>> 6to4 prefix routing between operators caused very substantial problems.
>> (And, btw, the 6to4 RFC said that such coordination was needed.)
>>
>> 2. LISP has grown out of the routing community, so the need for
>> operational coordination is presumably understood in that community.
>>
> 
> Maybe i am wrong, but i have an idea where LISP has grown out of, and
> it is not the networks operators that would have to coordinate this to
> work.

Agreed, routing community != network operators

I phrased it quite carefully.

   Brian

> 
> CB
> 
>> Nevertheless, the risk of a failure of coordination seems high.
>> But then, it seemed high for BGP4 itself in 1994.
>>
>>    Brian
>> _______________________________________________
>> v6ops mailing list
>> v6ops@ietf.org
>> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/v6ops
>