Re: [Coin] Fwd: The Future of P4, Revisited
"Bernier, Daniel" <daniel.bernier@bell.ca> Wed, 17 May 2023 01:00 UTC
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From: "Bernier, Daniel" <daniel.bernier@bell.ca>
To: 'Toerless Eckert' <tte@cs.fau.de>, Hesham ElBakoury <helbakoury@gmail.com>
CC: "hemant@mnkcg.com" <hemant@mnkcg.com>, 'Marie-Jose Montpetit' <marie@mjmontpetit.com>, 'coin' <coin@irtf.org>, "coinrg-chairs@ietf.org" <coinrg-chairs@ietf.org>
Thread-Topic: [EXT]Re: [Coin] Fwd: The Future of P4, Revisited
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Date: Wed, 17 May 2023 01:00:18 +0000
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Subject: Re: [Coin] Fwd: The Future of P4, Revisited
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Hi all, Interesting discussion although I think it went WAY overboard __ However, it is achieved and on which ever target it is achieved, what we want is an open and accessible (sometimes through commercial agreement) method to program the a forwarding pipeline and hopefully at some point do more than create, modify or readjust packet operations. Now in my mind there is no best or worse target since all have a role to play and sometimes target decision has nothing to do with its efficiency. Example: Ericsson UPF wants to offload UPF, has no commercially viable ASIC based offering (they partner with Juniper MX) so, obviously they would prefer a DPU approach. But if they could, wouldn't they prefer an ASIC due to $ rationale compared to CPU/DPU (power, cost, etc.) ... think FWA for millions of subscribers. And yes, sometimes ASICs will be better but for OPEX efficiency (software agility, cloud native principles, scarcity of skilled resources, etc.) other vendors will stay towards CPU architectures (look at evolution of OpenBNG efforts). Now, what Tofino achieved is prove to the world that it was possible to create a cost efficient, performant fully programmable (missing the TM component here) silicon with the added benefit of creating a highly creative ecosystem of customers, academics, vendors, etc. Hopefully, people will remember what P4 exposed to the network industry (from IETF draft pseudo-code to HW representation in less than a week). As per targets, all have their strengths and flaws. VPP is a great workhorse and ideal for virtual functions data plane, so if you want to build a terabit virtual router perfect but you need programmability ninjas. As a cloud native or application-oriented data path, I would turn my eyes towards eBPF and even efforts at a P4TC, P4OVS, P4EBPF are diminutive to the reach and flexibility of native eBPF. SAI is completely different to me its benefit is to avoid the dreaded multi-vendor RFC interop dance. I know what behaviors I want out of my multi-terabit ASIC, make sure it is implemented in SAI and then have the vendors conform to it. I could achieve similarly the same result by making my vendors conform to a P4 program, but it won't guarantee an ecosystem of silicon support. And in conclusion, whatever the language, we already know that in a few years some sort of GenAI will be our API to express forwarding intents and will then derive autogenerated code (whatever language) and compile to the proper targets __ PS : in the context of COIN, purpose is to achieve computation in whatever form of processing power is available in the network. If to achieve it I need to deploy DPUs all over the place, ain't that just MEC ? Cheers, Dan B On 2023-05-16, 8:12 PM, "Coin on behalf of 'Toerless Eckert'" <coin-bounces@irtf.org <mailto:coin-bounces@irtf.org> on behalf of tte@cs.fau.de <mailto:tte@cs.fau.de>> wrote: As soon as you see the first published research paper using NPL, pls. let me know ;-) On Tue, May 16, 2023 at 11:11:56AM -0700, Hesham ElBakoury wrote: > I checked with Broadcom and I was told that NPI language is not proprietary > and is open. However, NPL DIY with toolchain is a licensed product. Broadcom > does not have NPL API like P4Runtime API. > > Hesham > > On 5/15/2023 1:19 PM, hemant@mnkcg.com <mailto:hemant@mnkcg.com> wrote: > > > > Broadcom NPL is proprietary, and Broadcom develops customer code in NPL > > for switch. Further Trident/Jericho 2 are 10-12 Tbps asics while Octeon > > 10 is a 1 Tbps asic. My company’s P4 compiler makes Octeon P4 > > programmable. > > > > Hemant > > > > *From:* Hesham ElBakoury <helbakoury@gmail.com <mailto:helbakoury@gmail.com>> > > *Sent:* Monday, May 15, 2023 3:28 PM > > *To:* hemant@mnkcg.com <mailto:hemant@mnkcg.com>; 'Toerless Eckert' <tte@cs.fau.de <mailto:tte@cs.fau.de>>; 'Marie-Jose > > Montpetit' <marie@mjmontpetit.com <mailto:marie@mjmontpetit.com>> > > *Cc:* 'coin' <coin@irtf.org <mailto:coin@irtf.org>>; coinrg-chairs@ietf.org <mailto:coinrg-chairs@ietf.org> > > *Subject:* Re: [Coin] Fwd: The Future of P4, Revisited > > > > How you compare Marvel Octeon 10 with Broadcom Trident and Jericho 2 > > devices which use NPL (https://nplang.org <https://nplang.org>). > > > > Hesham > > > > Toerless, > > > > This is the latest network processor which supports use in a switch or nic. > > > > https://www.marvell.com/content/dam/marvell/en/company/media-kit/octeon-10/marvell-octeon-10-media-deck.pdf <https://www.marvell.com/content/dam/marvell/en/company/media-kit/octeon-10/marvell-octeon-10-media-deck.pdf> > > > > This is your Tofino replacement with hardware available from Marvell and P4 compiler and tools chain available from my company. > > > > Hemant > > > > -----Original Message----- > > > > From: Coin<coin-bounces@irtf.org <mailto:coin-bounces@irtf.org>> <mailto:coin-bounces@irtf.org <mailto:coin-bounces@irtf.org>> On Behalf Of Toerless Eckert > > > > Sent: Monday, May 15, 2023 1:04 PM > > > > To: Marie-Jose Montpetit<marie@mjmontpetit.com <mailto:marie@mjmontpetit.com>> <mailto:marie@mjmontpetit.com <mailto:marie@mjmontpetit.com>> > > > > Cc: coin<coin@irtf.org <mailto:coin@irtf.org>> <mailto:coin@irtf.org <mailto:coin@irtf.org>>;coinrg-chairs@ietf.org <mailto:coinrg-chairs@ietf.org> > > > > Subject: Re: [Coin] Fwd: The Future of P4, Revisited > > > > Thanks, Marie-Jose > > > > IMHO: > > > > - P4 in research short-term: > > > > Researchers can not do real-world relevant PoC with just BMV2, because it has no constraints. > > > > All those papers claiming some problem can be solved with P4 and then just use BMV2 are just > > > > so painful to read/listen-to. We really need a BMV2 with the exact constraints of Tofino, > > > > and given how Intel is deinvesting from Tofino, maybe they would finally be willing to > > > > publish those constraints outside of NDA so this can be implemented into BMV2. > > > > - SmartNICs: > > > > P4 is not the right DSL for SmartNICs even if Intel may say so because they want to > > > > sell SmartNICs and have a brand with P4. SmartNICs are much more flexible, and programming then > > > > in P4 constraints you. If you don't know anything better, try eBPF. That is AFAIK the > > > > most widely adopted DSL today to span general purpose CPU (host/router CPU), and SmartNICs. > > > > SmartNICs are a great target FPE for forwarding plane features you do not need on every hop, > > > > but for example only on few "can be more expensive" hops. WAN interface of site-edge-routers > > > > (Campus, Home, WAN) for example. But do not try to assume they would be used beyond that > > > > (on every hop == especially on higher aggregation speed links!). > > > > - P4/Coin for higher-than-forwarding-plane features: > > > > With Tofino disappearing, i think we should caution researchers to NOT invest cycles trying to > > > > implement solutions on P4 with the explicit purpose of "abusing" Tofino, aka: Program a > > > > non-forwarding-plane problem solution in P4 in the expectation that a fast P4 exeuction > > > > product like Tofino would be a great alternative/competition to other execution platforms > > > > (SmartNIC, CPU,...). We had several of those great ideas presented/shown in Coin, they > > > > where all about higher than forwarding-plane "compute" problems. But very quickly, with > > > > Tofino aging, i am sure CPU or SmartNIC slutions for the same problems can easily be > > > > shown to be more cost-effective. > > > > - Long-term forwarding plane research: > > > > The rejection of the industry (outside Intel) to support P4 for researchers on their router/switch > > > > forwarding planes (for a decade now) should primarily be a trigger for research funding > > > > such as from NSF/EU to better enable long-term forwarding plane research. IMHO there > > > > should simply be a single well funded effort for a Network Programming Element (NPE) equivalent > > > > to RISC-V. Aka: fully open source architecture and instruction set for a research NPE, > > > > competitive to industry products. There are lot of other benefits from such an effort > > > > that could help make that happen. > > > > Cheers > > > > Toerless > > > > On Mon, May 15, 2023 at 03:33:42AM -0700, Marie-Jose Montpetit wrote: > > > > Interesting article for out community. > > > > mjm > > > > Marie-José Montpetit, Ph.D. > > > > marie@mjmontpetit.com <mailto:marie@mjmontpetit.com> > > > > From: Larry Peterson from Systems Approach > > > > <systemsapproach@substack.com <mailto:systemsapproach@substack.com>> <mailto:systemsapproach@substack.com <mailto:systemsapproach@substack.com>> <systemsapproach@substack.com <mailto:systemsapproach@substack.com>> <mailto:systemsapproach@substack.com <mailto:systemsapproach@substack.com>> > > > > Reply: Larry Peterson from Systems Approach > > > > <reply+1zsws7&rqag0&&3ca860fd966ac1a0bf575ed48379b6645b7df5edc0903e4c5 > > > > e79a3a42d6a0a51@mg1.substack.com <mailto:e79a3a42d6a0a51@mg1.substack.com>> > > > > <reply+1zsws7&rqag0&&3ca860fd966ac1a0bf575ed48379b6645b7df5edc0903e4c5 > > > > e79a3a42d6a0a51@mg1.substack.com <mailto:e79a3a42d6a0a51@mg1.substack.com>> > > > > Date: May 15, 2023 at 3:55:52 AM > > > > To:marie@mjmontpetit.com <mailto:marie@mjmontpetit.com> <marie@mjmontpetit.com <mailto:marie@mjmontpetit.com>> > > <mailto:marie@mjmontpetit.com <mailto:marie@mjmontpetit.com>> > > > > <marie@mjmontpetit.com <mailto:marie@mjmontpetit.com>> <mailto:marie@mjmontpetit.com <mailto:marie@mjmontpetit.com>> > > > > Subject: The Future of P4, Revisited > > > > The P4 Workshop was a couple weeks ago, and as General Chair, I went > > > > into it with a fair amount of trepidation. My concern was that Intel’s > > > > announcement earlier this year that they’re cancelling development of > > > > the Tofino 3 switching chip would have a chilling effect, not only on > > > > the Workshop, but also on the future of P4. That concern has been > > > > voiced in several forums > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Open in app > > > > <https://open.substack.com/pub/systemsapproach/p/the-future-of-p4-one- <https://open.substack.com/pub/systemsapproach/p/the-future-of-p4-one-perspective?utm_source=email&redirect=app-store> <https://open.substack.com/pub/systemsapproach/p/the-future-of-p4-one- <https://open.substack.com/pub/systemsapproach/p/the-future-of-p4-one-perspective?utm_source=email&redirect=app-store>> > > > > perspective?utm_source=email&redirect=app-store> > > <https://open.substack.com/pub/systemsapproach/p/the-future-of-p4-one-perspective?utm_source=email&redirect=app-store> <https://open.substack.com/pub/systemsapproach/p/the-future-of-p4-one-perspective?utm_source=email&redirect=app-store>> > > > > or online > > > > <https://substack.com/redirect/2/eyJlIjoiaHR0cHM6Ly9zeXN0ZW1zYXBwcm9hY <https://substack.com/redirect/2/eyJlIjoiaHR0cHM6Ly9zeXN0ZW1zYXBwcm9hY2guc3Vic3RhY2suY29tL3AvdGhlLWZ1dHVyZS1vZi1wNC1vbmUtcGVyc3BlY3RpdmU_dG9rZW49ZXlKMWMyVnlYMmxrSWpvME5qVTNOakl5TkN3aWNHOXpkRjlwWkNJNk1USXdOakF4TlRreExDSnBZWFFpT2pFMk9EUXhNemN6TkRrc0ltVjRjQ0k2TVRZNE5qY3lPVE0wT1N3aWFYTnpJam9pY0hWaUxUSTRNemswTXlJc0luTjFZaUk2SW5CdmMzUXRjbVZoWTNScGIyNGlmUS50UVhzNmRNSG1GRWdMS0I0dlVHNHVHSlRVU0UwTjdVZEFIMXFzajg2bUNBIiwicCI6MTIwNjAxNTkxLCJzIjoyODM5NDMsImYiOnRydWUsInUiOjQ2NTc2MjI0LCJpYXQiOjE2ODQxMzczNDksImV4cCI6MTY4NjcyOTM0OSwiaXNzIjoicHViLTAiLCJzdWIiOiJsaW5rLXJlZGlyZWN0In0.6L7-AmSfpdLfVXnKIHzqDqYX9u_tCmRVPJC2N9oP8gU?> <https://substack.com/redirect/2/eyJlIjoiaHR0cHM6Ly9zeXN0ZW1zYXBwcm9hY 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<https://substack.com/app-link/post?publication_id=283943&post_id=120601591&utm_source=post-email-title&isFreemail=true&token=eyJ1c2VyX2lkIjo0NjU3NjIyNCwicG9zdF9pZCI6MTIwNjAxNTkxLCJpYXQiOjE2ODQxMzczNDksImV4cCI6MTY4NjcyOTM0OSwiaXNzIjoicHViLTI4Mzk0MyIsInN1YiI6InBvc3QtcmVhY3Rpb24ifQ.tQXs6dMHmFEgLKB4vUG4uGJTUSE0N7UdAH1qsj86mCA> <https://substack.com/app-link/post?publication_id=283943&post_id=120601591&utm_source=post-email-title&isFreemail=true&token=eyJ1c2VyX2lkIjo0NjU3NjIyNCwicG9zdF9pZCI6MTIwNjAxNTkxLCJpYXQiOjE2ODQxMzczNDksImV4cCI6MTY4NjcyOTM0OSwiaXNzIjoicHViLTI4Mzk0MyIsInN1YiI6InBvc3QtcmVhY3Rpb24ifQ.tQXs6dMHmFEgLKB4vUG4uGJTUSE0N7UdAH1qsj86mCA>> > > > > Larry Peterson > > > > <https://substack.com/redirect/ff29b5a3-7ea9-4b83-b888-b0c517b2bedd?j= <https://substack.com/redirect/ff29b5a3-7ea9-4b83-b888-b0c517b2bedd?j=eyJ1IjoicnFhZzAifQ.CwdsLjQyIcRXfYRGUucLsXfrvggM3KKa9Z1jxtXNWH0> <https://substack.com/redirect/ff29b5a3-7ea9-4b83-b888-b0c517b2bedd?j= 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<https://substack.com/app-link/post?publication_id=283943&post_id=120601591&utm_source=substack&utm_medium=email&utm_content=share&action=share&triggerShare=true&isFreemail=true&token=eyJ1c2VyX2lkIjo0NjU3NjIyNCwicG9zdF9pZCI6MTIwNjAxNTkxLCJpYXQiOjE2ODQxMzczNDksImV4cCI6MTY4NjcyOTM0OSwiaXNzIjoicHViLTI4Mzk0MyIsInN1YiI6InBvc3QtcmVhY3Rpb24ifQ.tQXs6dMHmFEgLKB4vUG4uGJTUSE0N7UdAH1qsj86mCA>> > > > > are&triggerShare=true&isFreemail=true&token=eyJ1c2VyX2lkIjo0NjU3NjIyNC<https://substack.com/app-link/post?publication_id=283943&post_id=120601591&utm_source=substack&utm_medium=email&utm_content=share&action=share&triggerShare=true&isFreemail=true&token=eyJ1c2VyX2lkIjo0NjU3NjIyNCwicG9zdF9pZCI6MTIwNjAxNTkxLCJpYXQiOjE2ODQxMzczNDksImV4cCI6MTY4NjcyOTM0OSwiaXNzIjoicHViLTI4Mzk0MyIsInN1YiI6InBvc3QtcmVhY3Rpb24ifQ.tQXs6dMHmFEgLKB4vUG4uGJTUSE0N7UdAH1qsj86mCA> <https://substack.com/app-link/post?publication_id=283943&post_id=120601591&utm_source=substack&utm_medium=email&utm_content=share&action=share&triggerShare=true&isFreemail=true&token=eyJ1c2VyX2lkIjo0NjU3NjIyNCwicG9zdF9pZCI6MTIwNjAxNTkxLCJpYXQiOjE2ODQxMzczNDksImV4cCI6MTY4NjcyOTM0OSwiaXNzIjoicHViLTI4Mzk0MyIsInN1YiI6InBvc3QtcmVhY3Rpb24ifQ.tQXs6dMHmFEgLKB4vUG4uGJTUSE0N7UdAH1qsj86mCA>> > > > > wicG9zdF9pZCI6MTIwNjAxNTkxLCJpYXQiOjE2ODQxMzczNDksImV4cCI6MTY4NjcyOTM0<https://substack.com/app-link/post?publication_id=283943&post_id=120601591&utm_source=substack&utm_medium=email&utm_content=share&action=share&triggerShare=true&isFreemail=true&token=eyJ1c2VyX2lkIjo0NjU3NjIyNCwicG9zdF9pZCI6MTIwNjAxNTkxLCJpYXQiOjE2ODQxMzczNDksImV4cCI6MTY4NjcyOTM0OSwiaXNzIjoicHViLTI4Mzk0MyIsInN1YiI6InBvc3QtcmVhY3Rpb24ifQ.tQXs6dMHmFEgLKB4vUG4uGJTUSE0N7UdAH1qsj86mCA> <https://substack.com/app-link/post?publication_id=283943&post_id=120601591&utm_source=substack&utm_medium=email&utm_content=share&action=share&triggerShare=true&isFreemail=true&token=eyJ1c2VyX2lkIjo0NjU3NjIyNCwicG9zdF9pZCI6MTIwNjAxNTkxLCJpYXQiOjE2ODQxMzczNDksImV4cCI6MTY4NjcyOTM0OSwiaXNzIjoicHViLTI4Mzk0MyIsInN1YiI6InBvc3QtcmVhY3Rpb24ifQ.tQXs6dMHmFEgLKB4vUG4uGJTUSE0N7UdAH1qsj86mCA>> > > > > OSwiaXNzIjoicHViLTI4Mzk0MyIsInN1YiI6InBvc3QtcmVhY3Rpb24ifQ.tQXs6dMHmFE<https://substack.com/app-link/post?publication_id=283943&post_id=120601591&utm_source=substack&utm_medium=email&utm_content=share&action=share&triggerShare=true&isFreemail=true&token=eyJ1c2VyX2lkIjo0NjU3NjIyNCwicG9zdF9pZCI6MTIwNjAxNTkxLCJpYXQiOjE2ODQxMzczNDksImV4cCI6MTY4NjcyOTM0OSwiaXNzIjoicHViLTI4Mzk0MyIsInN1YiI6InBvc3QtcmVhY3Rpb24ifQ.tQXs6dMHmFEgLKB4vUG4uGJTUSE0N7UdAH1qsj86mCA> <https://substack.com/app-link/post?publication_id=283943&post_id=120601591&utm_source=substack&utm_medium=email&utm_content=share&action=share&triggerShare=true&isFreemail=true&token=eyJ1c2VyX2lkIjo0NjU3NjIyNCwicG9zdF9pZCI6MTIwNjAxNTkxLCJpYXQiOjE2ODQxMzczNDksImV4cCI6MTY4NjcyOTM0OSwiaXNzIjoicHViLTI4Mzk0MyIsInN1YiI6InBvc3QtcmVhY3Rpb24ifQ.tQXs6dMHmFEgLKB4vUG4uGJTUSE0N7UdAH1qsj86mCA>> > > > > gLKB4vUG4uGJTUSE0N7UdAH1qsj86mCA> > > <https://substack.com/app-link/post?publication_id=283943&post_id=120601591&utm_source=substack&utm_medium=email&utm_content=share&action=share&triggerShare=true&isFreemail=true&token=eyJ1c2VyX2lkIjo0NjU3NjIyNCwicG9zdF9pZCI6MTIwNjAxNTkxLCJpYXQiOjE2ODQxMzczNDksImV4cCI6MTY4NjcyOTM0OSwiaXNzIjoicHViLTI4Mzk0MyIsInN1YiI6InBvc3QtcmVhY3Rpb24ifQ.tQXs6dMHmFEgLKB4vUG4uGJTUSE0N7UdAH1qsj86mCA> <https://substack.com/app-link/post?publication_id=283943&post_id=120601591&utm_source=substack&utm_medium=email&utm_content=share&action=share&triggerShare=true&isFreemail=true&token=eyJ1c2VyX2lkIjo0NjU3NjIyNCwicG9zdF9pZCI6MTIwNjAxNTkxLCJpYXQiOjE2ODQxMzczNDksImV4cCI6MTY4NjcyOTM0OSwiaXNzIjoicHViLTI4Mzk0MyIsInN1YiI6InBvc3QtcmVhY3Rpb24ifQ.tQXs6dMHmFEgLKB4vUG4uGJTUSE0N7UdAH1qsj86mCA>> > > > > The P4 workshop has now been chaired by both co-founders of Systems > > > > Approach, but this year the P4 landscape has shifted again with > > > > Intel’s announcement that Tofino 3, its flagship P4-powered switching > > > > chip, would not go ahead. There is much more to P4 than Tofino, > > > > however, as we explore in this week’s newsletter. > > > > ------------------------------ > > > > The P4 Workshop > > > > <https://substack.com/redirect/4b87822a-70c6-4ffa-864a-45637b26909c?j= <https://substack.com/redirect/4b87822a-70c6-4ffa-864a-45637b26909c?j=eyJ1IjoicnFhZzAifQ.CwdsLjQyIcRXfYRGUucLsXfrvggM3KKa9Z1jxtXNWH0> <https://substack.com/redirect/4b87822a-70c6-4ffa-864a-45637b26909c?j= <https://substack.com/redirect/4b87822a-70c6-4ffa-864a-45637b26909c?j=eyJ1IjoicnFhZzAifQ.CwdsLjQyIcRXfYRGUucLsXfrvggM3KKa9Z1jxtXNWH0>> > > > > eyJ1IjoicnFhZzAifQ.CwdsLjQyIcRXfYRGUucLsXfrvggM3KKa9Z1jxtXNWH0> > > <https://substack.com/redirect/4b87822a-70c6-4ffa-864a-45637b26909c?j=eyJ1IjoicnFhZzAifQ.CwdsLjQyIcRXfYRGUucLsXfrvggM3KKa9Z1jxtXNWH0> <https://substack.com/redirect/4b87822a-70c6-4ffa-864a-45637b26909c?j=eyJ1IjoicnFhZzAifQ.CwdsLjQyIcRXfYRGUucLsXfrvggM3KKa9Z1jxtXNWH0>> > > > > was a couple weeks ago, and as General Chair, I went into it with a > > > > fair amount of trepidation. My concern was that Intel’s announcement > > > > <https://substack.com/redirect/a0831b60-fff8-4ded-88c7-f3e6ef7e1e54?j= <https://substack.com/redirect/a0831b60-fff8-4ded-88c7-f3e6ef7e1e54?j=eyJ1IjoicnFhZzAifQ.CwdsLjQyIcRXfYRGUucLsXfrvggM3KKa9Z1jxtXNWH0> <https://substack.com/redirect/a0831b60-fff8-4ded-88c7-f3e6ef7e1e54?j= <https://substack.com/redirect/a0831b60-fff8-4ded-88c7-f3e6ef7e1e54?j=eyJ1IjoicnFhZzAifQ.CwdsLjQyIcRXfYRGUucLsXfrvggM3KKa9Z1jxtXNWH0>> > > > > eyJ1IjoicnFhZzAifQ.CwdsLjQyIcRXfYRGUucLsXfrvggM3KKa9Z1jxtXNWH0> > > <https://substack.com/redirect/a0831b60-fff8-4ded-88c7-f3e6ef7e1e54?j=eyJ1IjoicnFhZzAifQ.CwdsLjQyIcRXfYRGUucLsXfrvggM3KKa9Z1jxtXNWH0> <https://substack.com/redirect/a0831b60-fff8-4ded-88c7-f3e6ef7e1e54?j=eyJ1IjoicnFhZzAifQ.CwdsLjQyIcRXfYRGUucLsXfrvggM3KKa9Z1jxtXNWH0>> > > > > earlier this year that they’re cancelling development of the Tofino 3 > > > > switching chip would have a chilling effect, not only on the Workshop, > > > > but also on the future of P4. That concern has been voiced in several > > > > forums, including SIGCOMM’s Slack workspace > > > > <https://substack.com/redirect/300dcab9-6056-4c82-9627-1e08ea449b0e?j= <https://substack.com/redirect/300dcab9-6056-4c82-9627-1e08ea449b0e?j=eyJ1IjoicnFhZzAifQ.CwdsLjQyIcRXfYRGUucLsXfrvggM3KKa9Z1jxtXNWH0> <https://substack.com/redirect/300dcab9-6056-4c82-9627-1e08ea449b0e?j= <https://substack.com/redirect/300dcab9-6056-4c82-9627-1e08ea449b0e?j=eyJ1IjoicnFhZzAifQ.CwdsLjQyIcRXfYRGUucLsXfrvggM3KKa9Z1jxtXNWH0>> > > > > eyJ1IjoicnFhZzAifQ.CwdsLjQyIcRXfYRGUucLsXfrvggM3KKa9Z1jxtXNWH0> > > <https://substack.com/redirect/300dcab9-6056-4c82-9627-1e08ea449b0e?j=eyJ1IjoicnFhZzAifQ.CwdsLjQyIcRXfYRGUucLsXfrvggM3KKa9Z1jxtXNWH0> <https://substack.com/redirect/300dcab9-6056-4c82-9627-1e08ea449b0e?j=eyJ1IjoicnFhZzAifQ.CwdsLjQyIcRXfYRGUucLsXfrvggM3KKa9Z1jxtXNWH0>>, > > > > with members of the P4 Advisory Board > > > > <https://substack.com/redirect/2fcc130d-cf74-4d68-be4e-d531cbb379b4?j= <https://substack.com/redirect/2fcc130d-cf74-4d68-be4e-d531cbb379b4?j=eyJ1IjoicnFhZzAifQ.CwdsLjQyIcRXfYRGUucLsXfrvggM3KKa9Z1jxtXNWH0> <https://substack.com/redirect/2fcc130d-cf74-4d68-be4e-d531cbb379b4?j= <https://substack.com/redirect/2fcc130d-cf74-4d68-be4e-d531cbb379b4?j=eyJ1IjoicnFhZzAifQ.CwdsLjQyIcRXfYRGUucLsXfrvggM3KKa9Z1jxtXNWH0>> > > > > eyJ1IjoicnFhZzAifQ.CwdsLjQyIcRXfYRGUucLsXfrvggM3KKa9Z1jxtXNWH0> > > <https://substack.com/redirect/2fcc130d-cf74-4d68-be4e-d531cbb379b4?j=eyJ1IjoicnFhZzAifQ.CwdsLjQyIcRXfYRGUucLsXfrvggM3KKa9Z1jxtXNWH0> <https://substack.com/redirect/2fcc130d-cf74-4d68-be4e-d531cbb379b4?j=eyJ1IjoicnFhZzAifQ.CwdsLjQyIcRXfYRGUucLsXfrvggM3KKa9Z1jxtXNWH0>> > > > > making reassuring pronouncements in various settings. (See for > > > > example, Nick McKeown’s post to the P4 Forum > > > > <https://substack.com/redirect/b0f9bc57-686d-4962-8676-c234ebcbd12f?j= <https://substack.com/redirect/b0f9bc57-686d-4962-8676-c234ebcbd12f?j=eyJ1IjoicnFhZzAifQ.CwdsLjQyIcRXfYRGUucLsXfrvggM3KKa9Z1jxtXNWH0> <https://substack.com/redirect/b0f9bc57-686d-4962-8676-c234ebcbd12f?j= <https://substack.com/redirect/b0f9bc57-686d-4962-8676-c234ebcbd12f?j=eyJ1IjoicnFhZzAifQ.CwdsLjQyIcRXfYRGUucLsXfrvggM3KKa9Z1jxtXNWH0>> > > > > eyJ1IjoicnFhZzAifQ.CwdsLjQyIcRXfYRGUucLsXfrvggM3KKa9Z1jxtXNWH0> > > <https://substack.com/redirect/b0f9bc57-686d-4962-8676-c234ebcbd12f?j=eyJ1IjoicnFhZzAifQ.CwdsLjQyIcRXfYRGUucLsXfrvggM3KKa9Z1jxtXNWH0> <https://substack.com/redirect/b0f9bc57-686d-4962-8676-c234ebcbd12f?j=eyJ1IjoicnFhZzAifQ.CwdsLjQyIcRXfYRGUucLsXfrvggM3KKa9Z1jxtXNWH0>>, > > > > and Nick along with Nate Foster and Jennifer Rexford discussing the > > > > future of Network Programmability on The Networking Channel > > > > <https://substack.com/redirect/f2016908-8afb-4538-be3d-5d0e6aab0b3c?j= <https://substack.com/redirect/f2016908-8afb-4538-be3d-5d0e6aab0b3c?j=eyJ1IjoicnFhZzAifQ.CwdsLjQyIcRXfYRGUucLsXfrvggM3KKa9Z1jxtXNWH0> <https://substack.com/redirect/f2016908-8afb-4538-be3d-5d0e6aab0b3c?j= <https://substack.com/redirect/f2016908-8afb-4538-be3d-5d0e6aab0b3c?j=eyJ1IjoicnFhZzAifQ.CwdsLjQyIcRXfYRGUucLsXfrvggM3KKa9Z1jxtXNWH0>> > > > > eyJ1IjoicnFhZzAifQ.CwdsLjQyIcRXfYRGUucLsXfrvggM3KKa9Z1jxtXNWH0> > > <https://substack.com/redirect/f2016908-8afb-4538-be3d-5d0e6aab0b3c?j=eyJ1IjoicnFhZzAifQ.CwdsLjQyIcRXfYRGUucLsXfrvggM3KKa9Z1jxtXNWH0> <https://substack.com/redirect/f2016908-8afb-4538-be3d-5d0e6aab0b3c?j=eyJ1IjoicnFhZzAifQ.CwdsLjQyIcRXfYRGUucLsXfrvggM3KKa9Z1jxtXNWH0>> > > > > ). > > > > I won’t try to give a point-by-point replay of what Nick, Nate, and > > > > Jen and others have been saying, except to observe that at a high > > > > level it can be summarized as follows: > > > > *Programmable Networks >> P4 Language >> Tofino Switching Chip* > > > > They point out, for example, that Tofino is just one of many > > > > interesting backend targets for P4 programs (SmartNICs > > > > <https://substack.com/redirect/f5d04cdb-5915-42ab-9904-a20c38eeab33?j= <https://substack.com/redirect/f5d04cdb-5915-42ab-9904-a20c38eeab33?j=eyJ1IjoicnFhZzAifQ.CwdsLjQyIcRXfYRGUucLsXfrvggM3KKa9Z1jxtXNWH0> <https://substack.com/redirect/f5d04cdb-5915-42ab-9904-a20c38eeab33?j= <https://substack.com/redirect/f5d04cdb-5915-42ab-9904-a20c38eeab33?j=eyJ1IjoicnFhZzAifQ.CwdsLjQyIcRXfYRGUucLsXfrvggM3KKa9Z1jxtXNWH0>> > > > > eyJ1IjoicnFhZzAifQ.CwdsLjQyIcRXfYRGUucLsXfrvggM3KKa9Z1jxtXNWH0> > > <https://substack.com/redirect/f5d04cdb-5915-42ab-9904-a20c38eeab33?j=eyJ1IjoicnFhZzAifQ.CwdsLjQyIcRXfYRGUucLsXfrvggM3KKa9Z1jxtXNWH0> <https://substack.com/redirect/f5d04cdb-5915-42ab-9904-a20c38eeab33?j=eyJ1IjoicnFhZzAifQ.CwdsLjQyIcRXfYRGUucLsXfrvggM3KKa9Z1jxtXNWH0>> > > > > and IPUs > > > > <https://substack.com/redirect/a0ddc803-4ea3-4248-96a1-bdc33f86cd15?j= <https://substack.com/redirect/a0ddc803-4ea3-4248-96a1-bdc33f86cd15?j=eyJ1IjoicnFhZzAifQ.CwdsLjQyIcRXfYRGUucLsXfrvggM3KKa9Z1jxtXNWH0> <https://substack.com/redirect/a0ddc803-4ea3-4248-96a1-bdc33f86cd15?j= <https://substack.com/redirect/a0ddc803-4ea3-4248-96a1-bdc33f86cd15?j=eyJ1IjoicnFhZzAifQ.CwdsLjQyIcRXfYRGUucLsXfrvggM3KKa9Z1jxtXNWH0>> > > > > eyJ1IjoicnFhZzAifQ.CwdsLjQyIcRXfYRGUucLsXfrvggM3KKa9Z1jxtXNWH0> > > <https://substack.com/redirect/a0ddc803-4ea3-4248-96a1-bdc33f86cd15?j=eyJ1IjoicnFhZzAifQ.CwdsLjQyIcRXfYRGUucLsXfrvggM3KKa9Z1jxtXNWH0> <https://substack.com/redirect/a0ddc803-4ea3-4248-96a1-bdc33f86cd15?j=eyJ1IjoicnFhZzAifQ.CwdsLjQyIcRXfYRGUucLsXfrvggM3KKa9Z1jxtXNWH0>> > > > > being the next “big deal”) and P4 is one of many tools being used to > > > > inject functionality into the end-to-end network path (DPDK and eBPF > > > > being two active projects that people are integrating with P4). > > > > Ultimately, the value of programmability comes from having visibility > > > > and control over the network, and there are many complementary approaches to making that happen. > > > > With that background, I do have three takeaways from what turned out > > > > to be an interesting and vibrant two days at the P4 Workshop (despite > > > > my initial concerns). > > > > First, we’re often so focused on P4 as a tool to program the > > > > forwarding pipeline that we forget the other half of its value > > > > proposition: It also provides a way to specify the behavior of a > > > > pipeline (independent of how that pipeline is implemented). We talk > > > > about this idea, and the value of being able to auto-generate the > > > > Control API, in the P4 chapter of our SDN Book > > > > <https://substack.com/redirect/4b87822a-70c6-4ffa-864a-45637b26909c?j=eyJ1IjoicnFhZzAifQ.CwdsLjQyIcRXfYRGUucLsXfrvggM3KKa9Z1jxtXNWH0> <https://substack.com/redirect/4b87822a-70c6-4ffa-864a-45637b26909c?j=eyJ1IjoicnFhZzAifQ.CwdsLjQyIcRXfYRGUucLsXfrvggM3KKa9Z1jxtXNWH0> <https://substack.com/redirect/4b87822a-70c6-4ffa-864a-45637b26909c?j=eyJ1IjoicnFhZzAifQ.CwdsLjQyIcRXfYRGUucLsXfrvggM3KKa9Z1jxtXNWH0> <https://substack.com/redirect/4b87822a-70c6-4ffa-864a-45637b26909c?j=eyJ1IjoicnFhZzAifQ.CwdsLjQyIcRXfYRGUucLsXfrvggM3KKa9Z1jxtXNWH0>>. > > > > Rob Sherwood made a similar argument > > > > <https://substack.com/redirect/2442a19b-b82c-410c-8692-f50b89733875?j= <https://substack.com/redirect/2442a19b-b82c-410c-8692-f50b89733875?j=eyJ1IjoicnFhZzAifQ.CwdsLjQyIcRXfYRGUucLsXfrvggM3KKa9Z1jxtXNWH0> <https://substack.com/redirect/2442a19b-b82c-410c-8692-f50b89733875?j= <https://substack.com/redirect/2442a19b-b82c-410c-8692-f50b89733875?j=eyJ1IjoicnFhZzAifQ.CwdsLjQyIcRXfYRGUucLsXfrvggM3KKa9Z1jxtXNWH0>> > > > > eyJ1IjoicnFhZzAifQ.CwdsLjQyIcRXfYRGUucLsXfrvggM3KKa9Z1jxtXNWH0> > > <https://substack.com/redirect/2442a19b-b82c-410c-8692-f50b89733875?j=eyJ1IjoicnFhZzAifQ.CwdsLjQyIcRXfYRGUucLsXfrvggM3KKa9Z1jxtXNWH0> <https://substack.com/redirect/2442a19b-b82c-410c-8692-f50b89733875?j=eyJ1IjoicnFhZzAifQ.CwdsLjQyIcRXfYRGUucLsXfrvggM3KKa9Z1jxtXNWH0>> > > > > at the P4 Workshop. It is now becoming a reality as companies like > > > > Google are starting to use such behavioral definitions as a Hardware > > > > Abstraction Layer (see Parveen Patel’s Keynote > > > > <https://substack.com/redirect/e656a164-3fef-497b-9628-ffeb700108af?j= <https://substack.com/redirect/e656a164-3fef-497b-9628-ffeb700108af?j=eyJ1IjoicnFhZzAifQ.CwdsLjQyIcRXfYRGUucLsXfrvggM3KKa9Z1jxtXNWH0> <https://substack.com/redirect/e656a164-3fef-497b-9628-ffeb700108af?j= <https://substack.com/redirect/e656a164-3fef-497b-9628-ffeb700108af?j=eyJ1IjoicnFhZzAifQ.CwdsLjQyIcRXfYRGUucLsXfrvggM3KKa9Z1jxtXNWH0>> > > > > eyJ1IjoicnFhZzAifQ.CwdsLjQyIcRXfYRGUucLsXfrvggM3KKa9Z1jxtXNWH0> > > <https://substack.com/redirect/e656a164-3fef-497b-9628-ffeb700108af?j=eyJ1IjoicnFhZzAifQ.CwdsLjQyIcRXfYRGUucLsXfrvggM3KKa9Z1jxtXNWH0> <https://substack.com/redirect/e656a164-3fef-497b-9628-ffeb700108af?j=eyJ1IjoicnFhZzAifQ.CwdsLjQyIcRXfYRGUucLsXfrvggM3KKa9Z1jxtXNWH0>> > > > > at the Workshop). This makes me hopeful that we are rapidly > > > > approaching the day when a P4 program (plus the generated P4RT > > > > interface) will become the standard way network providers specify > > > > their requirements to network vendors, and proposed new features > > > > (whether proprietary or standard) will be specified by a P4 program > > > > (potentially augmenting the intuition and design rationale presented in an RFC). > > > > *As an aside, I couldn’t help but notice the similarities between the > > > > architecture Parveen described and the way P4 has been used to program > > > > the forwarding plane of the 5G Mobile Core > > > > <https://substack.com/redirect/64e4cac9-e6fd-4652-8e36-09f50ff1305c?j=eyJ1IjoicnFhZzAifQ.CwdsLjQyIcRXfYRGUucLsXfrvggM3KKa9Z1jxtXNWH0> <https://substack.com/redirect/64e4cac9-e6fd-4652-8e36-09f50ff1305c?j=eyJ1IjoicnFhZzAifQ.CwdsLjQyIcRXfYRGUucLsXfrvggM3KKa9Z1jxtXNWH0> <https://substack.com/redirect/64e4cac9-e6fd-4652-8e36-09f50ff1305c?j=eyJ1IjoicnFhZzAifQ.CwdsLjQyIcRXfYRGUucLsXfrvggM3KKa9Z1jxtXNWH0> <https://substack.com/redirect/64e4cac9-e6fd-4652-8e36-09f50ff1305c?j=eyJ1IjoicnFhZzAifQ.CwdsLjQyIcRXfYRGUucLsXfrvggM3KKa9Z1jxtXNWH0>>. > > > > Both include a P4-based “abstract forwarding model” that’s independent > > > > of the underlying implementation details*. > > > > Second, it is common to divide forwarding pipelines into “programmable” > > > > versus “fixed function”, but this glosses over what might be the more > > > > important distinction: whether the pipeline is *open* or *closed*. > > > > Even “fixed function” pipelines are increasingly flexible–it’s just a > > > > question of how restrictive the vendor is in who they allow to make > > > > changes. This restriction may have the biggest impact on researchers > > > > who want to experiment with a new feature (especially ones that do not > > > > yet have a proven market), but maybe less so in the commercial world > > > > where incentives to make changes are (arguably) well-defined. Using P4 > > > > as the “spec language” (as I just outlined) has the potential to > > > > accelerate the process on the commercial side. On the research side, > > > > there is a strong argument in favor of using Tofino 2 to demonstrate > > > > the feasibility and value of new ideas (12.8 Tb/s still makes for a > > > > credible Proof-of-Concept), and repeating the refrain yet again, > > > > P4-as-spec makes for a compelling tech transfer story. If that were to > > > > happen, it would be interesting to see how vendors and chip designers > > > > adapt to reduce their spec-to-hardware implementation overhead. I > > > > would argue that programmable forwarding planes have a time-to-market advantage even for closed solutions. > > > > Third, our focus on quantifiable metrics makes it easy to forget about > > > > the less quantifiable aspects of programmability. At its core, P4 is a > > > > programming language that does a good job of abstracting the essence > > > > of a packet forwarding pipeline. It is enormously impressive that a P4 > > > > program can be compiled onto a PISA-based > > > > <https://substack.com/redirect/01cfb256-04e7-49f8-9600-55e1471955b8?j= <https://substack.com/redirect/01cfb256-04e7-49f8-9600-55e1471955b8?j=eyJ1IjoicnFhZzAifQ.CwdsLjQyIcRXfYRGUucLsXfrvggM3KKa9Z1jxtXNWH0> <https://substack.com/redirect/01cfb256-04e7-49f8-9600-55e1471955b8?j= <https://substack.com/redirect/01cfb256-04e7-49f8-9600-55e1471955b8?j=eyJ1IjoicnFhZzAifQ.CwdsLjQyIcRXfYRGUucLsXfrvggM3KKa9Z1jxtXNWH0>> > > > > eyJ1IjoicnFhZzAifQ.CwdsLjQyIcRXfYRGUucLsXfrvggM3KKa9Z1jxtXNWH0> > > <https://substack.com/redirect/01cfb256-04e7-49f8-9600-55e1471955b8?j=eyJ1IjoicnFhZzAifQ.CwdsLjQyIcRXfYRGUucLsXfrvggM3KKa9Z1jxtXNWH0> <https://substack.com/redirect/01cfb256-04e7-49f8-9600-55e1471955b8?j=eyJ1IjoicnFhZzAifQ.CwdsLjQyIcRXfYRGUucLsXfrvggM3KKa9Z1jxtXNWH0>> > > > > switching chip that has the same performance, die area, cost, and > > > > power consumption of a fixed-function ASIC (and that equivalency was > > > > probably necessary for P4 to be taken seriously), but hitting that > > > > quantifiable mark is not sufficient. Well-designed languages are > > > > software tools that bring clarity to the intellectual challenge of > > > > programming. For me, the biggest “aha” moment of the Workshop was when > > > > Chris Sommers (long-time P4 contributor and new co-Chair of the API > > > > Working Group) started rattling off all the functions he’d been > > > > involved in writing in P4, and remarking on how natural P4 makes that > > > > process. There is certainly room to add new language features as P4 > > > > expands its domain to include SmartNICs and IPUs—as Chris and the > > > > other WG chairs are now pursuing—but having an existing target to evolve is a great position to be in. > > > > One common thread that weaves its way through these three takeaways is > > > > that Intel’s cancellation of the Tofino 3 chip is a potentially > > > > helpful forcing > > > > function: The P4 community has to demonstrate the value of the > > > > language without being buttressed by ever-improving performance > > > > numbers that have more to do with 7nm semiconductor technology than > > > > anything networking people have done. I saw a lot of evidence that > > > > exactly that is happening at last month’s workshop. The march to > > > > programmable networks is inevitable (in my view), and I’m still > > > > optimistic about the role P4 will play a central role. > > > > Systems Approach is reader-supported and we are committed to keeping > > > > our books and articles open to all. To receive new posts and support > > > > our work, consider becoming a free or paid subscriber. > > > > Upgrade to paid > > > > <https://substack.com/redirect/2/eyJlIjoiaHR0cHM6Ly9zeXN0ZW1zYXBwcm9hY <https://substack.com/redirect/2/eyJlIjoiaHR0cHM6Ly9zeXN0ZW1zYXBwcm9hY2guc3Vic3RhY2suY29tL3N1YnNjcmliZT90b2tlbj1leUoxYzJWeVgybGtJam8wTmpVM05qSXlOQ3dpYVdGMElqb3hOamcwTVRNM016UTVMQ0psZUhBaU9qRTJPRFkzTWprek5Ea3NJbWx6Y3lJNkluQjFZaTB5T0RNNU5ETWlMQ0p6ZFdJaU9pSmphR1ZqYTI5MWRDSjkuLW5LYUMtRE1weEw3Smp0bHh4U1I0aEFFLXQ2QWltZ0lENFlFRC1BbWJicyZ1dG1fc291cmNlPXBvc3QiLCJwIjoxMjA2MDE1OTEsInMiOjI4Mzk0MywiZiI6dHJ1ZSwidSI6NDY1NzYyMjQsImlhdCI6MTY4NDEzNzM0OSwiZXhwIjoxNjg2NzI5MzQ5LCJpc3MiOiJwdWItMCIsInN1YiI6ImxpbmstcmVkaXJlY3QifQ.lWjTeCLgxCt9OYaegbWWppVXvEzTeJBQs6psa45Oowg?&utm_medium=email&utm_source=subscribe-widget-preamble&utm_content=120601591> <https://substack.com/redirect/2/eyJlIjoiaHR0cHM6Ly9zeXN0ZW1zYXBwcm9hY 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<https://substack.com/redirect/2/eyJlIjoiaHR0cHM6Ly9zeXN0ZW1zYXBwcm9hY2guc3Vic3RhY2suY29tL3N1YnNjcmliZT90b2tlbj1leUoxYzJWeVgybGtJam8wTmpVM05qSXlOQ3dpYVdGMElqb3hOamcwTVRNM016UTVMQ0psZUhBaU9qRTJPRFkzTWprek5Ea3NJbWx6Y3lJNkluQjFZaTB5T0RNNU5ETWlMQ0p6ZFdJaU9pSmphR1ZqYTI5MWRDSjkuLW5LYUMtRE1weEw3Smp0bHh4U1I0aEFFLXQ2QWltZ0lENFlFRC1BbWJicyZ1dG1fc291cmNlPXBvc3QiLCJwIjoxMjA2MDE1OTEsInMiOjI4Mzk0MywiZiI6dHJ1ZSwidSI6NDY1NzYyMjQsImlhdCI6MTY4NDEzNzM0OSwiZXhwIjoxNjg2NzI5MzQ5LCJpc3MiOiJwdWItMCIsInN1YiI6ImxpbmstcmVkaXJlY3QifQ.lWjTeCLgxCt9OYaegbWWppVXvEzTeJBQs6psa45Oowg?&utm_medium=email&utm_source=subscribe-widget-preamble&utm_content=120601591> <https://substack.com/redirect/2/eyJlIjoiaHR0cHM6Ly9zeXN0ZW1zYXBwcm9hY2guc3Vic3RhY2suY29tL3N1YnNjcmliZT90b2tlbj1leUoxYzJWeVgybGtJam8wTmpVM05qSXlOQ3dpYVdGMElqb3hOamcwTVRNM016UTVMQ0psZUhBaU9qRTJPRFkzTWprek5Ea3NJbWx6Y3lJNkluQjFZaTB5T0RNNU5ETWlMQ0p6ZFdJaU9pSmphR1ZqYTI5MWRDSjkuLW5LYUMtRE1weEw3Smp0bHh4U1I0aEFFLXQ2QWltZ0lENFlFRC1BbWJicyZ1dG1fc291cmNlPXBvc3QiLCJwIjoxMjA2MDE1OTEsInMiOjI4Mzk0MywiZiI6dHJ1ZSwidSI6NDY1NzYyMjQsImlhdCI6MTY4NDEzNzM0OSwiZXhwIjoxNjg2NzI5MzQ5LCJpc3MiOiJwdWItMCIsInN1YiI6ImxpbmstcmVkaXJlY3QifQ.lWjTeCLgxCt9OYaegbWWppVXvEzTeJBQs6psa45Oowg?&utm_medium=email&utm_source=subscribe-widget-preamble&utm_content=120601591>> > > > > ------------------------------ > > > > We continue to run into people who want to translate our books into > > > > other languages, and if you are one of them, you should definitely > > > > reach out to us. The latest entrant is a Portuguese translation > > > > <https://substack.com/redirect/e0ad5652-867f-4d2c-8cd6-3fc8b0f8eda0?j= <https://substack.com/redirect/e0ad5652-867f-4d2c-8cd6-3fc8b0f8eda0?j=eyJ1IjoicnFhZzAifQ.CwdsLjQyIcRXfYRGUucLsXfrvggM3KKa9Z1jxtXNWH0> <https://substack.com/redirect/e0ad5652-867f-4d2c-8cd6-3fc8b0f8eda0?j= <https://substack.com/redirect/e0ad5652-867f-4d2c-8cd6-3fc8b0f8eda0?j=eyJ1IjoicnFhZzAifQ.CwdsLjQyIcRXfYRGUucLsXfrvggM3KKa9Z1jxtXNWH0>> > > > > eyJ1IjoicnFhZzAifQ.CwdsLjQyIcRXfYRGUucLsXfrvggM3KKa9Z1jxtXNWH0> > > <https://substack.com/redirect/e0ad5652-867f-4d2c-8cd6-3fc8b0f8eda0?j=eyJ1IjoicnFhZzAifQ.CwdsLjQyIcRXfYRGUucLsXfrvggM3KKa9Z1jxtXNWH0> <https://substack.com/redirect/e0ad5652-867f-4d2c-8cd6-3fc8b0f8eda0?j=eyJ1IjoicnFhZzAifQ.CwdsLjQyIcRXfYRGUucLsXfrvggM3KKa9Z1jxtXNWH0>> > > > > of our Private 5G book by Edmar Candeia Gurjão. You can find other > > > > translations of our books here > > > > <https://substack.com/redirect/0d0dad50-a3db-42e9-9ad6-95318436a540?j=eyJ1IjoicnFhZzAifQ.CwdsLjQyIcRXfYRGUucLsXfrvggM3KKa9Z1jxtXNWH0> <https://substack.com/redirect/0d0dad50-a3db-42e9-9ad6-95318436a540?j=eyJ1IjoicnFhZzAifQ.CwdsLjQyIcRXfYRGUucLsXfrvggM3KKa9Z1jxtXNWH0> <https://substack.com/redirect/0d0dad50-a3db-42e9-9ad6-95318436a540?j=eyJ1IjoicnFhZzAifQ.CwdsLjQyIcRXfYRGUucLsXfrvggM3KKa9Z1jxtXNWH0> <https://substack.com/redirect/0d0dad50-a3db-42e9-9ad6-95318436a540?j=eyJ1IjoicnFhZzAifQ.CwdsLjQyIcRXfYRGUucLsXfrvggM3KKa9Z1jxtXNWH0>>. > > > > You can follow us on Mastodon > > > > <https://substack.com/redirect/3e6fc5cc-6a89-4a15-97bf-231cf12de9ec?j=eyJ1IjoicnFhZzAifQ.CwdsLjQyIcRXfYRGUucLsXfrvggM3KKa9Z1jxtXNWH0> <https://substack.com/redirect/3e6fc5cc-6a89-4a15-97bf-231cf12de9ec?j=eyJ1IjoicnFhZzAifQ.CwdsLjQyIcRXfYRGUucLsXfrvggM3KKa9Z1jxtXNWH0> <https://substack.com/redirect/3e6fc5cc-6a89-4a15-97bf-231cf12de9ec?j=eyJ1IjoicnFhZzAifQ.CwdsLjQyIcRXfYRGUucLsXfrvggM3KKa9Z1jxtXNWH0> <https://substack.com/redirect/3e6fc5cc-6a89-4a15-97bf-231cf12de9ec?j=eyJ1IjoicnFhZzAifQ.CwdsLjQyIcRXfYRGUucLsXfrvggM3KKa9Z1jxtXNWH0>>. > > > > You're currently a free subscriber to Systems Approach > > > > <https://substack.com/redirect/3d94c242-4758-4bf3-9e1d-62b5ce3f23ab?j=eyJ1IjoicnFhZzAifQ.CwdsLjQyIcRXfYRGUucLsXfrvggM3KKa9Z1jxtXNWH0> <https://substack.com/redirect/3d94c242-4758-4bf3-9e1d-62b5ce3f23ab?j=eyJ1IjoicnFhZzAifQ.CwdsLjQyIcRXfYRGUucLsXfrvggM3KKa9Z1jxtXNWH0> <https://substack.com/redirect/3d94c242-4758-4bf3-9e1d-62b5ce3f23ab?j=eyJ1IjoicnFhZzAifQ.CwdsLjQyIcRXfYRGUucLsXfrvggM3KKa9Z1jxtXNWH0> <https://substack.com/redirect/3d94c242-4758-4bf3-9e1d-62b5ce3f23ab?j=eyJ1IjoicnFhZzAifQ.CwdsLjQyIcRXfYRGUucLsXfrvggM3KKa9Z1jxtXNWH0>>. > > > > For the full experience, upgrade your subscription. > > > > <https://substack.com/redirect/2/eyJlIjoiaHR0cHM6Ly9zeXN0ZW1zYXBwcm9hY <https://substack.com/redirect/2/eyJlIjoiaHR0cHM6Ly9zeXN0ZW1zYXBwcm9hY2guc3Vic3RhY2suY29tL3N1YnNjcmliZT90b2tlbj1leUoxYzJWeVgybGtJam8wTmpVM05qSXlOQ3dpYVdGMElqb3hOamcwTVRNM016UTVMQ0psZUhBaU9qRTJPRFkzTWprek5Ea3NJbWx6Y3lJNkluQjFZaTB5T0RNNU5ETWlMQ0p6ZFdJaU9pSmphR1ZqYTI5MWRDSjkuLW5LYUMtRE1weEw3Smp0bHh4U1I0aEFFLXQ2QWltZ0lENFlFRC1BbWJicyZ1dG1fc291cmNlPXBvc3QiLCJwIjoxMjA2MDE1OTEsInMiOjI4Mzk0MywiZiI6dHJ1ZSwidSI6NDY1NzYyMjQsImlhdCI6MTY4NDEzNzM0OSwiZXhwIjoxNjg2NzI5MzQ5LCJpc3MiOiJwdWItMCIsInN1YiI6ImxpbmstcmVkaXJlY3QifQ.lWjTeCLgxCt9OYaegbWWppVXvEzTeJBQs6psa45Oowg?&utm_source=substack&utm_medium=email&utm_content=postcta> <https://substack.com/redirect/2/eyJlIjoiaHR0cHM6Ly9zeXN0ZW1zYXBwcm9hY <https://substack.com/redirect/2/eyJlIjoiaHR0cHM6Ly9zeXN0ZW1zYXBwcm9hY2guc3Vic3RhY2suY29tL3N1YnNjcmliZT90b2tlbj1leUoxYzJWeVgybGtJam8wTmpVM05qSXlOQ3dpYVdGMElqb3hOamcwTVRNM016UTVMQ0psZUhBaU9qRTJPRFkzTWprek5Ea3NJbWx6Y3lJNkluQjFZaTB5T0RNNU5ETWlMQ0p6ZFdJaU9pSmphR1ZqYTI5MWRDSjkuLW5LYUMtRE1weEw3Smp0bHh4U1I0aEFFLXQ2QWltZ0lENFlFRC1BbWJicyZ1dG1fc291cmNlPXBvc3QiLCJwIjoxMjA2MDE1OTEsInMiOjI4Mzk0MywiZiI6dHJ1ZSwidSI6NDY1NzYyMjQsImlhdCI6MTY4NDEzNzM0OSwiZXhwIjoxNjg2NzI5MzQ5LCJpc3MiOiJwdWItMCIsInN1YiI6ImxpbmstcmVkaXJlY3QifQ.lWjTeCLgxCt9OYaegbWWppVXvEzTeJBQs6psa45Oowg?&utm_source=substack&utm_medium=email&utm_content=postcta>> > > > > 2guc3Vic3RhY2suY29tL3N1YnNjcmliZT90b2tlbj1leUoxYzJWeVgybGtJam8wTmpVM05<https://substack.com/redirect/2/eyJlIjoiaHR0cHM6Ly9zeXN0ZW1zYXBwcm9hY2guc3Vic3RhY2suY29tL3N1YnNjcmliZT90b2tlbj1leUoxYzJWeVgybGtJam8wTmpVM05qSXlOQ3dpYVdGMElqb3hOamcwTVRNM016UTVMQ0psZUhBaU9qRTJPRFkzTWprek5Ea3NJbWx6Y3lJNkluQjFZaTB5T0RNNU5ETWlMQ0p6ZFdJaU9pSmphR1ZqYTI5MWRDSjkuLW5LYUMtRE1weEw3Smp0bHh4U1I0aEFFLXQ2QWltZ0lENFlFRC1BbWJicyZ1dG1fc291cmNlPXBvc3QiLCJwIjoxMjA2MDE1OTEsInMiOjI4Mzk0MywiZiI6dHJ1ZSwidSI6NDY1NzYyMjQsImlhdCI6MTY4NDEzNzM0OSwiZXhwIjoxNjg2NzI5MzQ5LCJpc3MiOiJwdWItMCIsInN1YiI6ImxpbmstcmVkaXJlY3QifQ.lWjTeCLgxCt9OYaegbWWppVXvEzTeJBQs6psa45Oowg?&utm_source=substack&utm_medium=email&utm_content=postcta> 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Wx6Y3lJNkluQjFZaTB5T0RNNU5ETWlMQ0p6ZFdJaU9pSmphR1ZqYTI5MWRDSjkuLW5LYUM<https://substack.com/redirect/2/eyJlIjoiaHR0cHM6Ly9zeXN0ZW1zYXBwcm9hY2guc3Vic3RhY2suY29tL3N1YnNjcmliZT90b2tlbj1leUoxYzJWeVgybGtJam8wTmpVM05qSXlOQ3dpYVdGMElqb3hOamcwTVRNM016UTVMQ0psZUhBaU9qRTJPRFkzTWprek5Ea3NJbWx6Y3lJNkluQjFZaTB5T0RNNU5ETWlMQ0p6ZFdJaU9pSmphR1ZqYTI5MWRDSjkuLW5LYUMtRE1weEw3Smp0bHh4U1I0aEFFLXQ2QWltZ0lENFlFRC1BbWJicyZ1dG1fc291cmNlPXBvc3QiLCJwIjoxMjA2MDE1OTEsInMiOjI4Mzk0MywiZiI6dHJ1ZSwidSI6NDY1NzYyMjQsImlhdCI6MTY4NDEzNzM0OSwiZXhwIjoxNjg2NzI5MzQ5LCJpc3MiOiJwdWItMCIsInN1YiI6ImxpbmstcmVkaXJlY3QifQ.lWjTeCLgxCt9OYaegbWWppVXvEzTeJBQs6psa45Oowg?&utm_source=substack&utm_medium=email&utm_content=postcta> <https://substack.com/redirect/2/eyJlIjoiaHR0cHM6Ly9zeXN0ZW1zYXBwcm9hY2guc3Vic3RhY2suY29tL3N1YnNjcmliZT90b2tlbj1leUoxYzJWeVgybGtJam8wTmpVM05qSXlOQ3dpYVdGMElqb3hOamcwTVRNM016UTVMQ0psZUhBaU9qRTJPRFkzTWprek5Ea3NJbWx6Y3lJNkluQjFZaTB5T0RNNU5ETWlMQ0p6ZFdJaU9pSmphR1ZqYTI5MWRDSjkuLW5LYUMtRE1weEw3Smp0bHh4U1I0aEFFLXQ2QWltZ0lENFlFRC1BbWJicyZ1dG1fc291cmNlPXBvc3QiLCJwIjoxMjA2MDE1OTEsInMiOjI4Mzk0MywiZiI6dHJ1ZSwidSI6NDY1NzYyMjQsImlhdCI6MTY4NDEzNzM0OSwiZXhwIjoxNjg2NzI5MzQ5LCJpc3MiOiJwdWItMCIsInN1YiI6ImxpbmstcmVkaXJlY3QifQ.lWjTeCLgxCt9OYaegbWWppVXvEzTeJBQs6psa45Oowg?&utm_source=substack&utm_medium=email&utm_content=postcta>> > > > > 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ImlhdCI6MTY4NDEzNzM0OSwiZXhwIjoxNjg2NzI5MzQ5LCJpc3MiOiJwdWItMjgzOTQzIi<https://substack.com/app-link/post?publication_id=283943&post_id=120601591&utm_source=substack&isFreemail=true&submitLike=true&token=eyJ1c2VyX2lkIjo0NjU3NjIyNCwicG9zdF9pZCI6MTIwNjAxNTkxLCJyZWFjdGlvbiI6IuKdpCIsImlhdCI6MTY4NDEzNzM0OSwiZXhwIjoxNjg2NzI5MzQ5LCJpc3MiOiJwdWItMjgzOTQzIiwic3ViIjoicmVhY3Rpb24ifQ.vN6AE7iLQvKkv98V0RaNKEWEX9UdKbdHQdc3nu95Kyg&utm_medium=email> <https://substack.com/app-link/post?publication_id=283943&post_id=120601591&utm_source=substack&isFreemail=true&submitLike=true&token=eyJ1c2VyX2lkIjo0NjU3NjIyNCwicG9zdF9pZCI6MTIwNjAxNTkxLCJyZWFjdGlvbiI6IuKdpCIsImlhdCI6MTY4NDEzNzM0OSwiZXhwIjoxNjg2NzI5MzQ5LCJpc3MiOiJwdWItMjgzOTQzIiwic3ViIjoicmVhY3Rpb24ifQ.vN6AE7iLQvKkv98V0RaNKEWEX9UdKbdHQdc3nu95Kyg&utm_medium=email>> > > > > wic3ViIjoicmVhY3Rpb24ifQ.vN6AE7iLQvKkv98V0RaNKEWEX9UdKbdHQdc3nu95Kyg&u<https://substack.com/app-link/post?publication_id=283943&post_id=120601591&utm_source=substack&isFreemail=true&submitLike=true&token=eyJ1c2VyX2lkIjo0NjU3NjIyNCwicG9zdF9pZCI6MTIwNjAxNTkxLCJyZWFjdGlvbiI6IuKdpCIsImlhdCI6MTY4NDEzNzM0OSwiZXhwIjoxNjg2NzI5MzQ5LCJpc3MiOiJwdWItMjgzOTQzIiwic3ViIjoicmVhY3Rpb24ifQ.vN6AE7iLQvKkv98V0RaNKEWEX9UdKbdHQdc3nu95Kyg&utm_medium=email> <https://substack.com/app-link/post?publication_id=283943&post_id=120601591&utm_source=substack&isFreemail=true&submitLike=true&token=eyJ1c2VyX2lkIjo0NjU3NjIyNCwicG9zdF9pZCI6MTIwNjAxNTkxLCJyZWFjdGlvbiI6IuKdpCIsImlhdCI6MTY4NDEzNzM0OSwiZXhwIjoxNjg2NzI5MzQ5LCJpc3MiOiJwdWItMjgzOTQzIiwic3ViIjoicmVhY3Rpb24ifQ.vN6AE7iLQvKkv98V0RaNKEWEX9UdKbdHQdc3nu95Kyg&utm_medium=email>> > > > > tm_medium=email> > > 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<https://substack.com/app-link/post?publication_id=283943&post_id=120601591&utm_source=substack&utm_medium=email&isFreemail=true&comments=true&token=eyJ1c2VyX2lkIjo0NjU3NjIyNCwicG9zdF9pZCI6MTIwNjAxNTkxLCJpYXQiOjE2ODQxMzczNDksImV4cCI6MTY4NjcyOTM0OSwiaXNzIjoicHViLTI4Mzk0MyIsInN1YiI6InBvc3QtcmVhY3Rpb24ifQ.tQXs6dMHmFEgLKB4vUG4uGJTUSE0N7UdAH1qsj86mCA&utm_source=substack&utm_medium=email> <https://substack.com/app-link/post?publication_id=283943&post_id=1206 <https://substack.com/app-link/post?publication_id=283943&post_id=120601591&utm_source=substack&utm_medium=email&isFreemail=true&comments=true&token=eyJ1c2VyX2lkIjo0NjU3NjIyNCwicG9zdF9pZCI6MTIwNjAxNTkxLCJpYXQiOjE2ODQxMzczNDksImV4cCI6MTY4NjcyOTM0OSwiaXNzIjoicHViLTI4Mzk0MyIsInN1YiI6InBvc3QtcmVhY3Rpb24ifQ.tQXs6dMHmFEgLKB4vUG4uGJTUSE0N7UdAH1qsj86mCA&utm_source=substack&utm_medium=email>> > > > > 01591&utm_source=substack&utm_medium=email&isFreemail=true&comments=tr<https://substack.com/app-link/post?publication_id=283943&post_id=120601591&utm_source=substack&utm_medium=email&isFreemail=true&comments=true&token=eyJ1c2VyX2lkIjo0NjU3NjIyNCwicG9zdF9pZCI6MTIwNjAxNTkxLCJpYXQiOjE2ODQxMzczNDksImV4cCI6MTY4NjcyOTM0OSwiaXNzIjoicHViLTI4Mzk0MyIsInN1YiI6InBvc3QtcmVhY3Rpb24ifQ.tQXs6dMHmFEgLKB4vUG4uGJTUSE0N7UdAH1qsj86mCA&utm_source=substack&utm_medium=email> <https://substack.com/app-link/post?publication_id=283943&post_id=120601591&utm_source=substack&utm_medium=email&isFreemail=true&comments=true&token=eyJ1c2VyX2lkIjo0NjU3NjIyNCwicG9zdF9pZCI6MTIwNjAxNTkxLCJpYXQiOjE2ODQxMzczNDksImV4cCI6MTY4NjcyOTM0OSwiaXNzIjoicHViLTI4Mzk0MyIsInN1YiI6InBvc3QtcmVhY3Rpb24ifQ.tQXs6dMHmFEgLKB4vUG4uGJTUSE0N7UdAH1qsj86mCA&utm_source=substack&utm_medium=email>> > > > > 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jE2ODQxMzczNDksImV4cCI6MTY4NjcyOTM0OSwiaXNzIjoicHViLTI4Mzk0MyIsInN1YiI<https://substack.com/app-link/post?publication_id=283943&post_id=120601591&utm_source=substack&utm_medium=email&isFreemail=true&comments=true&token=eyJ1c2VyX2lkIjo0NjU3NjIyNCwicG9zdF9pZCI6MTIwNjAxNTkxLCJpYXQiOjE2ODQxMzczNDksImV4cCI6MTY4NjcyOTM0OSwiaXNzIjoicHViLTI4Mzk0MyIsInN1YiI6InBvc3QtcmVhY3Rpb24ifQ.tQXs6dMHmFEgLKB4vUG4uGJTUSE0N7UdAH1qsj86mCA&utm_source=substack&utm_medium=email> <https://substack.com/app-link/post?publication_id=283943&post_id=120601591&utm_source=substack&utm_medium=email&isFreemail=true&comments=true&token=eyJ1c2VyX2lkIjo0NjU3NjIyNCwicG9zdF9pZCI6MTIwNjAxNTkxLCJpYXQiOjE2ODQxMzczNDksImV4cCI6MTY4NjcyOTM0OSwiaXNzIjoicHViLTI4Mzk0MyIsInN1YiI6InBvc3QtcmVhY3Rpb24ifQ.tQXs6dMHmFEgLKB4vUG4uGJTUSE0N7UdAH1qsj86mCA&utm_source=substack&utm_medium=email>> > > > > 6InBvc3QtcmVhY3Rpb24ifQ.tQXs6dMHmFEgLKB4vUG4uGJTUSE0N7UdAH1qsj86mCA&ut<https://substack.com/app-link/post?publication_id=283943&post_id=120601591&utm_source=substack&utm_medium=email&isFreemail=true&comments=true&token=eyJ1c2VyX2lkIjo0NjU3NjIyNCwicG9zdF9pZCI6MTIwNjAxNTkxLCJpYXQiOjE2ODQxMzczNDksImV4cCI6MTY4NjcyOTM0OSwiaXNzIjoicHViLTI4Mzk0MyIsInN1YiI6InBvc3QtcmVhY3Rpb24ifQ.tQXs6dMHmFEgLKB4vUG4uGJTUSE0N7UdAH1qsj86mCA&utm_source=substack&utm_medium=email> <https://substack.com/app-link/post?publication_id=283943&post_id=120601591&utm_source=substack&utm_medium=email&isFreemail=true&comments=true&token=eyJ1c2VyX2lkIjo0NjU3NjIyNCwicG9zdF9pZCI6MTIwNjAxNTkxLCJpYXQiOjE2ODQxMzczNDksImV4cCI6MTY4NjcyOTM0OSwiaXNzIjoicHViLTI4Mzk0MyIsInN1YiI6InBvc3QtcmVhY3Rpb24ifQ.tQXs6dMHmFEgLKB4vUG4uGJTUSE0N7UdAH1qsj86mCA&utm_source=substack&utm_medium=email>> > > > > m_source=substack&utm_medium=email> > > <https://substack.com/app-link/post?publication_id=283943&post_id=120601591&utm_source=substack&utm_medium=email&isFreemail=true&comments=true&token=eyJ1c2VyX2lkIjo0NjU3NjIyNCwicG9zdF9pZCI6MTIwNjAxNTkxLCJpYXQiOjE2ODQxMzczNDksImV4cCI6MTY4NjcyOTM0OSwiaXNzIjoicHViLTI4Mzk0MyIsInN1YiI6InBvc3QtcmVhY3Rpb24ifQ.tQXs6dMHmFEgLKB4vUG4uGJTUSE0N7UdAH1qsj86mCA&utm_source=substack&utm_medium=email> <https://substack.com/app-link/post?publication_id=283943&post_id=120601591&utm_source=substack&utm_medium=email&isFreemail=true&comments=true&token=eyJ1c2VyX2lkIjo0NjU3NjIyNCwicG9zdF9pZCI6MTIwNjAxNTkxLCJpYXQiOjE2ODQxMzczNDksImV4cCI6MTY4NjcyOTM0OSwiaXNzIjoicHViLTI4Mzk0MyIsInN1YiI6InBvc3QtcmVhY3Rpb24ifQ.tQXs6dMHmFEgLKB4vUG4uGJTUSE0N7UdAH1qsj86mCA&utm_source=substack&utm_medium=email>> > > > > Restack > > > > <https://substack.com/redirect/2/eyJlIjoiaHR0cHM6Ly9zeXN0ZW1zYXBwcm9hY <https://substack.com/redirect/2/eyJlIjoiaHR0cHM6Ly9zeXN0ZW1zYXBwcm9hY2guc3Vic3RhY2suY29tL3AvdGhlLWZ1dHVyZS1vZi1wNC1vbmUtcGVyc3BlY3RpdmU_dXRtX3NvdXJjZT1zdWJzdGFjayZ1dG1fbWVkaXVtPWVtYWlsJmFjdGlvbj1yZXN0YWNrLWNvbW1lbnQiLCJwIjoxMjA2MDE1OTEsInMiOjI4Mzk0MywiZiI6dHJ1ZSwidSI6NDY1NzYyMjQsImlhdCI6MTY4NDEzNzM0OSwiZXhwIjoxNjg2NzI5MzQ5LCJpc3MiOiJwdWItMCIsInN1YiI6ImxpbmstcmVkaXJlY3QifQ.hfc7rMzN53dfpysbLYXxmtkw9siB9dPnC71KIavCOTo?&utm_source=substack&utm_medium=email> <https://substack.com/redirect/2/eyJlIjoiaHR0cHM6Ly9zeXN0ZW1zYXBwcm9hY <https://substack.com/redirect/2/eyJlIjoiaHR0cHM6Ly9zeXN0ZW1zYXBwcm9hY2guc3Vic3RhY2suY29tL3AvdGhlLWZ1dHVyZS1vZi1wNC1vbmUtcGVyc3BlY3RpdmU_dXRtX3NvdXJjZT1zdWJzdGFjayZ1dG1fbWVkaXVtPWVtYWlsJmFjdGlvbj1yZXN0YWNrLWNvbW1lbnQiLCJwIjoxMjA2MDE1OTEsInMiOjI4Mzk0MywiZiI6dHJ1ZSwidSI6NDY1NzYyMjQsImlhdCI6MTY4NDEzNzM0OSwiZXhwIjoxNjg2NzI5MzQ5LCJpc3MiOiJwdWItMCIsInN1YiI6ImxpbmstcmVkaXJlY3QifQ.hfc7rMzN53dfpysbLYXxmtkw9siB9dPnC71KIavCOTo?&utm_source=substack&utm_medium=email>> > > > > 2guc3Vic3RhY2suY29tL3AvdGhlLWZ1dHVyZS1vZi1wNC1vbmUtcGVyc3BlY3RpdmU_dXR<https://substack.com/redirect/2/eyJlIjoiaHR0cHM6Ly9zeXN0ZW1zYXBwcm9hY2guc3Vic3RhY2suY29tL3AvdGhlLWZ1dHVyZS1vZi1wNC1vbmUtcGVyc3BlY3RpdmU_dXRtX3NvdXJjZT1zdWJzdGFjayZ1dG1fbWVkaXVtPWVtYWlsJmFjdGlvbj1yZXN0YWNrLWNvbW1lbnQiLCJwIjoxMjA2MDE1OTEsInMiOjI4Mzk0MywiZiI6dHJ1ZSwidSI6NDY1NzYyMjQsImlhdCI6MTY4NDEzNzM0OSwiZXhwIjoxNjg2NzI5MzQ5LCJpc3MiOiJwdWItMCIsInN1YiI6ImxpbmstcmVkaXJlY3QifQ.hfc7rMzN53dfpysbLYXxmtkw9siB9dPnC71KIavCOTo?&utm_source=substack&utm_medium=email> <https://substack.com/redirect/2/eyJlIjoiaHR0cHM6Ly9zeXN0ZW1zYXBwcm9hY2guc3Vic3RhY2suY29tL3AvdGhlLWZ1dHVyZS1vZi1wNC1vbmUtcGVyc3BlY3RpdmU_dXRtX3NvdXJjZT1zdWJzdGFjayZ1dG1fbWVkaXVtPWVtYWlsJmFjdGlvbj1yZXN0YWNrLWNvbW1lbnQiLCJwIjoxMjA2MDE1OTEsInMiOjI4Mzk0MywiZiI6dHJ1ZSwidSI6NDY1NzYyMjQsImlhdCI6MTY4NDEzNzM0OSwiZXhwIjoxNjg2NzI5MzQ5LCJpc3MiOiJwdWItMCIsInN1YiI6ImxpbmstcmVkaXJlY3QifQ.hfc7rMzN53dfpysbLYXxmtkw9siB9dPnC71KIavCOTo?&utm_source=substack&utm_medium=email>> > > > > 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iZiI6dHJ1ZSwidSI6NDY1NzYyMjQsImlhdCI6MTY4NDEzNzM0OSwiZXhwIjoxNjg2NzI5M<https://substack.com/redirect/2/eyJlIjoiaHR0cHM6Ly9zdWJzdGFjay5jb20vc2lnbnVwP3V0bV9zb3VyY2U9c3Vic3RhY2smdXRtX21lZGl1bT1lbWFpbCZ1dG1fY29udGVudD1mb290ZXImdXRtX2NhbXBhaWduPWF1dG9maWxsZWQtZm9vdGVyJmZyZWVTaWdudXBFbWFpbD1tYXJpZUBtam1vbnRwZXRpdC5jb20iLCJwIjoxMjA2MDE1OTEsInMiOjI4Mzk0MywiZiI6dHJ1ZSwidSI6NDY1NzYyMjQsImlhdCI6MTY4NDEzNzM0OSwiZXhwIjoxNjg2NzI5MzQ5LCJpc3MiOiJwdWItMCIsInN1YiI6ImxpbmstcmVkaXJlY3QifQ.GtVGEVhyYZ__pv96bIPsssoL78rJrnvkIgcdwC4WQfs?> <https://substack.com/redirect/2/eyJlIjoiaHR0cHM6Ly9zdWJzdGFjay5jb20vc2lnbnVwP3V0bV9zb3VyY2U9c3Vic3RhY2smdXRtX21lZGl1bT1lbWFpbCZ1dG1fY29udGVudD1mb290ZXImdXRtX2NhbXBhaWduPWF1dG9maWxsZWQtZm9vdGVyJmZyZWVTaWdudXBFbWFpbD1tYXJpZUBtam1vbnRwZXRpdC5jb20iLCJwIjoxMjA2MDE1OTEsInMiOjI4Mzk0MywiZiI6dHJ1ZSwidSI6NDY1NzYyMjQsImlhdCI6MTY4NDEzNzM0OSwiZXhwIjoxNjg2NzI5MzQ5LCJpc3MiOiJwdWItMCIsInN1YiI6ImxpbmstcmVkaXJlY3QifQ.GtVGEVhyYZ__pv96bIPsssoL78rJrnvkIgcdwC4WQfs?>> > > > > zQ5LCJpc3MiOiJwdWItMCIsInN1YiI6ImxpbmstcmVkaXJlY3QifQ.GtVGEVhyYZ__pv96<https://substack.com/redirect/2/eyJlIjoiaHR0cHM6Ly9zdWJzdGFjay5jb20vc2lnbnVwP3V0bV9zb3VyY2U9c3Vic3RhY2smdXRtX21lZGl1bT1lbWFpbCZ1dG1fY29udGVudD1mb290ZXImdXRtX2NhbXBhaWduPWF1dG9maWxsZWQtZm9vdGVyJmZyZWVTaWdudXBFbWFpbD1tYXJpZUBtam1vbnRwZXRpdC5jb20iLCJwIjoxMjA2MDE1OTEsInMiOjI4Mzk0MywiZiI6dHJ1ZSwidSI6NDY1NzYyMjQsImlhdCI6MTY4NDEzNzM0OSwiZXhwIjoxNjg2NzI5MzQ5LCJpc3MiOiJwdWItMCIsInN1YiI6ImxpbmstcmVkaXJlY3QifQ.GtVGEVhyYZ__pv96bIPsssoL78rJrnvkIgcdwC4WQfs?> <https://substack.com/redirect/2/eyJlIjoiaHR0cHM6Ly9zdWJzdGFjay5jb20vc2lnbnVwP3V0bV9zb3VyY2U9c3Vic3RhY2smdXRtX21lZGl1bT1lbWFpbCZ1dG1fY29udGVudD1mb290ZXImdXRtX2NhbXBhaWduPWF1dG9maWxsZWQtZm9vdGVyJmZyZWVTaWdudXBFbWFpbD1tYXJpZUBtam1vbnRwZXRpdC5jb20iLCJwIjoxMjA2MDE1OTEsInMiOjI4Mzk0MywiZiI6dHJ1ZSwidSI6NDY1NzYyMjQsImlhdCI6MTY4NDEzNzM0OSwiZXhwIjoxNjg2NzI5MzQ5LCJpc3MiOiJwdWItMCIsInN1YiI6ImxpbmstcmVkaXJlY3QifQ.GtVGEVhyYZ__pv96bIPsssoL78rJrnvkIgcdwC4WQfs?>> > > > > bIPsssoL78rJrnvkIgcdwC4WQfs?> > > <https://substack.com/redirect/2/eyJlIjoiaHR0cHM6Ly9zdWJzdGFjay5jb20vc2lnbnVwP3V0bV9zb3VyY2U9c3Vic3RhY2smdXRtX21lZGl1bT1lbWFpbCZ1dG1fY29udGVudD1mb290ZXImdXRtX2NhbXBhaWduPWF1dG9maWxsZWQtZm9vdGVyJmZyZWVTaWdudXBFbWFpbD1tYXJpZUBtam1vbnRwZXRpdC5jb20iLCJwIjoxMjA2MDE1OTEsInMiOjI4Mzk0MywiZiI6dHJ1ZSwidSI6NDY1NzYyMjQsImlhdCI6MTY4NDEzNzM0OSwiZXhwIjoxNjg2NzI5MzQ5LCJpc3MiOiJwdWItMCIsInN1YiI6ImxpbmstcmVkaXJlY3QifQ.GtVGEVhyYZ__pv96bIPsssoL78rJrnvkIgcdwC4WQfs?> <https://substack.com/redirect/2/eyJlIjoiaHR0cHM6Ly9zdWJzdGFjay5jb20vc2lnbnVwP3V0bV9zb3VyY2U9c3Vic3RhY2smdXRtX21lZGl1bT1lbWFpbCZ1dG1fY29udGVudD1mb290ZXImdXRtX2NhbXBhaWduPWF1dG9maWxsZWQtZm9vdGVyJmZyZWVTaWdudXBFbWFpbD1tYXJpZUBtam1vbnRwZXRpdC5jb20iLCJwIjoxMjA2MDE1OTEsInMiOjI4Mzk0MywiZiI6dHJ1ZSwidSI6NDY1NzYyMjQsImlhdCI6MTY4NDEzNzM0OSwiZXhwIjoxNjg2NzI5MzQ5LCJpc3MiOiJwdWItMCIsInN1YiI6ImxpbmstcmVkaXJlY3QifQ.GtVGEVhyYZ__pv96bIPsssoL78rJrnvkIgcdwC4WQfs?>> > > > > -- > > > > Coin mailing list > > > > Coin@irtf.org 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