Re: [ietf-smtp] Curious, with this now being associated to emailcore, should list name change?
Alexey Melnikov <alexey.melnikov@isode.com> Wed, 22 July 2020 12:31 UTC
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To: John C Klensin <john-ietf@jck.com>, E Sam <winshell64@gmail.com>
Cc: ietf-smtp@ietf.org
References: <81c2a19c-f19e-b495-3441-22c2a112037c@linuxmagic.com> <52D9A14B4CDD14BB4C97C355@PSB> <CAKFo7w=9_eZda47ZMUv_NE9iN1FEnGM7m3nUFy3_Wq4se+W8XQ@mail.gmail.com> <DE8B2C33275660E19FFA513C@PSB>
From: Alexey Melnikov <alexey.melnikov@isode.com>
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Date: Wed, 22 Jul 2020 13:31:38 +0100
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Subject: Re: [ietf-smtp] Curious, with this now being associated to emailcore, should list name change?
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On 18/07/2020 20:15, John C Klensin wrote: > You may want to have a look at the draft agenda, now posted at > https://www.ietf.org/proceedings/108/agenda/agenda-108-emailcore-00, Thank you for the introduction, John. The above was updated a bit: https://www.ietf.org/proceedings/108/agenda/agenda-108-emailcore-01 > and noting that the example topics for rfc5321bis are references > to Appendix G of draft-klensin-rfc5321bis-03 (the agenda sort of > says that, but, IMO, it is easy to miss). It is vaguely > possible that a new version of the I-D will be posted before the > BOF meets, but it is thoroughly unlikely that Appendix > names/numbers will change. > > Alexey or Seth may be able to add to that, especially if you > have specific questions. I don't have much to add at this point. Seth and I will send the conference call link for the BOF once we know it. > Beyond the agenda, "emailcore" seems to be a title or framework > for a lot of different ideas that may not have focused or > converged yet. The purpose of a BOF is to move that process > along. > > best, > john > > > --On Saturday, July 18, 2020 14:55 -0400 E Sam > <winshell64@gmail.com> wrote: > >> Hello all, >> >> I'm out of the loop of the plans for the (future?) emailcore >> working group >> >> Any links where I can catch up and read more about this before >> the IETF 108 meeting (if I can make it of course) >> >> YES i DuckDuckGoed some information about it but I am still >> out of the loop a little bit >> >> Thank you all >> >> On Fri, Jul 17, 2020 at 6:13 PM John C Klensin >> <john-ietf@jck.com> wrote: >>> >>> >>> --On Friday, July 17, 2020 14:57 -0700 Michael Peddemors >>> <michael@linuxmagic.com> wrote: >>> >>>> Not sure what normally happens, but it might be confusing. >>> Independent of "normal", the name and mailing address of this >>> list is known by email developers and operators all over the >>> Internet. It also consolidates some prior lists specifically >>> associated with mail headers, MIME, and non-ASCII addresses >>> and headers (and maybe others, probably including the lists >>> for the DRUMS and YAM WGs). Changing its name (effectively >>> killing the list and starting another) would be disruptive in >>> the extreme. >>> >>> Perhaps "emailcore" should be given a list of its own, but I >>> think that would not be helpful either. >>> >>>> "Email Core" would have a wider scope, and it might be >>>> confusing if the list name was limited to 'smtp'. >>> Consider it a historical artifact and, like WG names (and >>> corresponding mailing list) that are chosen more for cuteness >>> than actual semantic value, accept it and move forward. >>> >>> Please. >>> >>> >>> I will leave it to the BOF Chairs and/or ADs to comment on the >>> rest of this but my understanding is that they want to keep >>> the scope of "emailcore" as narrow as possible, at least >>> initially, rather than having it expand into "any email topic >>> that would be worth addressing". >>> >>> Speaking only for myself, I note that the IETF has tried very >>> hard over the years to stay out of MUA design and issues. >>> Perhaps it is time to change that and take on at least some >>> MUA requirements (work is badly needed, IMO, in the non-ASCII >>> addresses and header space although I don't know if the IETF >>> as the right expertise to do it) but it would be a rather >>> large step. >>> >>> >>> >>>> Suggestion for topic for this group as well: >>>> >>>> Unifying all the 'autodiscover' and 'autoconfig' methods >>>> currently in place.. email client developers have now a very >>>> convoluted set of requirements in order to find the >>>> 'recommended' settings for that domain or ISP etc.. >>>> >>>> There are several independent databases out there, eg >>>> Apple's own, the ISPDB, and even some of Microsofts' own >>>> email clients no longer follow traditional methods of >>>> lookups.. It is a bit of a mess, that maybe the IETF would >>>> like to weigh in on? >>> best, >>> john >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> ietf-smtp mailing list >>> ietf-smtp@ietf.org >>> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ietf-smtp >> _______________________________________________ >> ietf-smtp mailing list >> ietf-smtp@ietf.org >> https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ietf-smtp > > _______________________________________________ > ietf-smtp mailing list > ietf-smtp@ietf.org > https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/ietf-smtp
- [ietf-smtp] Curious, with this now being associat… Michael Peddemors
- Re: [ietf-smtp] Curious, with this now being asso… John C Klensin
- Re: [ietf-smtp] Curious, with this now being asso… E Sam
- Re: [ietf-smtp] Curious, with this now being asso… John C Klensin
- Re: [ietf-smtp] Curious, with this now being asso… E Sam
- Re: [ietf-smtp] Curious, with this now being asso… John C Klensin
- Re: [ietf-smtp] Curious, with this now being asso… John Levine
- Re: [ietf-smtp] Curious, with this now being asso… E Sam
- Re: [ietf-smtp] Curious, with this now being asso… John Levine
- Re: [ietf-smtp] Curious, with this now being asso… John C Klensin
- Re: [ietf-smtp] Curious, with this now being asso… Jeremy Harris
- Re: [ietf-smtp] Curious, with this now being asso… Arnt Gulbrandsen
- Re: [ietf-smtp] Curious, with this now being asso… John Levine
- Re: [ietf-smtp] Curious, with this now being asso… John C Klensin
- Re: [ietf-smtp] Curious, with this now being asso… Arnt Gulbrandsen
- Re: [ietf-smtp] Curious, with this now being asso… John C Klensin
- Re: [ietf-smtp] Curious, with this now being asso… Alessandro Vesely
- Re: [ietf-smtp] Curious, with this now being asso… John Levine
- Re: [ietf-smtp] Curious, with this now being asso… John Levine
- Re: [ietf-smtp] Curious, with this now being asso… Michael Peddemors
- Re: [ietf-smtp] Curious, with this now being asso… Dilyan Palauzov
- Re: [ietf-smtp] Curious, with this now being asso… Michael Richardson
- Re: [ietf-smtp] broken signatures, was Curious John R Levine
- Re: [ietf-smtp] Curious, with this now being asso… Hector Santos
- Re: [ietf-smtp] Curious, with this now being asso… John C Klensin
- Re: [ietf-smtp] Curious, with this now being asso… Hector Santos
- Re: [ietf-smtp] broken signatures, was Curious John Levine
- Re: [ietf-smtp] broken signatures, was Curious Brandon Long
- Re: [ietf-smtp] broken signatures, was Curious Hector Santos
- Re: [ietf-smtp] broken signatures, was Curious John C Klensin
- Re: [ietf-smtp] Curious, with this now being asso… Pete Resnick
- Re: [ietf-smtp] Curious, with this now being asso… Pete Resnick
- Re: [ietf-smtp] broken signatures, was Curious Paul Smith
- Re: [ietf-smtp] Curious, with this now being asso… John C Klensin
- Re: [ietf-smtp] broken signatures, was Curious John C Klensin
- Re: [ietf-smtp] Curious, with this now being asso… Pete Resnick
- Re: [ietf-smtp] broken signatures, was Curious Michael Richardson
- Re: [ietf-smtp] broken signatures, was Curious Kurt Andersen (b)
- Re: [ietf-smtp] Curious, with this now being asso… Keith Moore
- Re: [ietf-smtp] Curious, with this now being asso… John C Klensin
- Re: [ietf-smtp] broken signatures, was Curious Dave Crocker
- Re: [ietf-smtp] broken signatures, was Curious Michael Richardson
- Re: [ietf-smtp] Curious, with this now being asso… Sam Varshavchik
- Re: [ietf-smtp] broken signatures, was Curious Hector Santos
- Re: [ietf-smtp] broken signatures, was Curious Hector Santos
- Re: [ietf-smtp] broken signatures, was Curious John R Levine
- Re: [ietf-smtp] broken signatures, was Curious John C Klensin
- Re: [ietf-smtp] Curious, with this now being asso… Keith Moore
- Re: [ietf-smtp] broken signatures, was Curious Dave Crocker
- Re: [ietf-smtp] Curious, with this now being asso… John C Klensin
- Re: [ietf-smtp] Curious, with this now being asso… Keith Moore
- Re: [ietf-smtp] broken signatures, was Curious Dilyan Palauzov
- Re: [ietf-smtp] Curious, with this now being asso… Alexey Melnikov
- Re: [ietf-smtp] Curious, with this now being asso… Alexey Melnikov
- Re: [ietf-smtp] Curious, with this now being asso… Ned Freed
- Re: [ietf-smtp] broken signatures, was Curious Alessandro Vesely
- Re: [ietf-smtp] broken signatures, was Curious John Levine
- Re: [ietf-smtp] broken signatures, was Curious John Levine
- Re: [ietf-smtp] broken signatures, was Curious Pete Resnick
- Re: [ietf-smtp] broken signatures, was Curious Dave Crocker
- Re: [ietf-smtp] broken signatures, was Curious Michael Richardson
- Re: [ietf-smtp] broken signatures, was Curious John R Levine
- Re: [ietf-smtp] broken signatures, was Curious John R Levine
- Re: [ietf-smtp] broken signatures, was Curious Pete Resnick
- Re: [ietf-smtp] broken signatures, was Curious John R Levine
- Re: [ietf-smtp] broken signatures, was Curious e sam
- Re: [ietf-smtp] broken signatures, was Curious Dave Crocker
- Re: [ietf-smtp] broken signatures, was Curious e sam
- Re: [ietf-smtp] broken signatures, was Curious Steve Atkins
- Re: [ietf-smtp] Curious, with this now being asso… John C Klensin