Re: [lmap] What is broadband?

[Shane Amante <[e-mail]>]

James, All,

On Mar 7, 2013, at 7:30 PM, James Miller <[e-mail]> wrote:
> I believe that Henning had commented at some point that the LMAP definition he contemplated had "architecture" as the 'A' element but certainly access is an important piece.  I think one of the problems that has been discussed also on the LMAP and our FCC Next-Gen lists is that a complete view of LMAP performance measurements would implicate elements from the user's laptop, through wireless and other local LAN, carriers access networks, Tier 1 and other peering networks, the application host side and everything in between.  Clearly there would be a lot of technologies included within that functional scope.

I agree that access is important, but not to the exclusion of everything else that constitutes an Internet end-user customer experience or, alternatively, an Enterprise end-user customer experience -- which is what I believe you're saying above?  That's why it will be important to, at some point, figure out *if*, and then how, to try to segment the portions of the end-to-end path that you describe above so we can attribute good or bad performance to a particular portion of the path so that, ultimately, the correct network operator can be contacted to look into the problem further.  I do not believe that this requires us to break down the end-to-end path on a router-hop by router-hop basis, but rather we need to be able to identify 'sign posts' along the path that can correlate well to end-to-end path.

-shane


> For reference, in the FCC Measuring Broadband America Program we focused on measurement from the consumers' broadband modem through the carriers network to where it connects to a tier one peering point.  LMAP should be able to address the broad mix of other use cases that would have a mix of other elements and motivations.
> 
> Graphic in Report at page 9. http://transition.fcc.gov/cgb/measuringbroadbandreport/2Methodology.pdf
> 
> On Thu, Mar 7, 2013 at 5:20 PM, Bugenhagen, Michael K <[e-mail]> wrote:
> The word "access" should be key here as part of the definition provided we are talking about an Internet service, which is the second component.   I don't really  think we are building tests that won't work on smaller pipes so questioning if it really 'broadband' or not is correct IMO.
> 
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone
> 
> On Mar 7, 2013, at 9:41 AM, "Shane Amante" <[e-mail]> wrote:
> 
>> Benoit,
>> 
>> On Mar 7, 2013, at 3:47 AM, Benoit Claise <[e-mail]> wrote:
>>> Dear all,
>>> 
>>> I started to review the drafts, and I will start posting a few questions to the list.
>>> Open questions, clarifying questions, in order to generate some discussions.
>>> Disclaimer: I have not yet read the entire list archive. Apologize in advance if some points have been discussed already. 
>>> 
>>> Here is my first question. What is broadband in the LMAP context?
>>> Is it DSL, cable, ETTH, Fiber to the home?  Is LMAP technology independent?
>>> And I see also "enterprise edge router", "cellular data or satellite" in draft-schulzrinne-lmap-requirements. In or out?
>>> Or do we have in mind a phase approach, starting with the "enterprise edge router" first, and then home network?
>> 
>> Speaking for the network I operate, I'm very much an advocate of saying that "Enterprise Edge Router" is "in-scope".  We would very much benefit from a standards-based measurement enablement and collection regime vs. mostly proprietary, and non-scalable, approaches that exist today.
>> 
>> This is not to diminish the importance of similar test capabilities for residential broadband use-cases.  We absolutely need to work on those, as well.  
>> 
>> With respect to priority, my hope is that we do not have to choose to prioritize one over the other.  Rather, I would hope that both can be developed in parallel, because both -- at least, IMO -- have a substantially overlapping set of requirements/features. 
>> 
>> My $0.02,
>> 
>> -shane
>> 
>> 
>>> Interestingly, I don't know what A stands for in LMAP, if it stands for something.
>>> According to http://trac.tools.ietf.org/bof/trac/wiki/WikiStart, the A doesn't stand for anything.
>>> However, looking at the different draft titles, there is some confusion.
>>>    draft-linsner-lmap-use-cases-0 title is Large-Scale Broadband Measurement Use Cases
>>>    draft-schulzrinne-lmap-requirements-00.txt title is Large-Scale Measurement of Broadband Performance
>>>    draft-boucadair-lmap-considerations-00, Large scale Measurement of Access network Performance (LMAP):
>>>       Requirements and Issues from a Network Provider Perspective
>>> 
>>> Some more discussions, on the mailing list or during the BoF, on this topic would be appreciated.
>>> 
>>> Regards, Benoit
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
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