Re: [rtcweb] "20 lines" (Re: RTCWeb default signaling protocol [was RE: About defining a signaling protocol for WebRTC (or not)])
"Ravindran Parthasarathi" <pravindran@sonusnet.com> Mon, 26 September 2011 18:09 UTC
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Date: Mon, 26 Sep 2011 23:40:12 +0530
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Thread-Topic: [rtcweb] "20 lines" (Re: RTCWeb default signaling protocol [was RE: About defining a signaling protocol for WebRTC (or not)])
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References: <CALiegfnOCxyTo9ffQ272+ncdu5UdgrtDT-dn10BWGTZMEjZoCg@mail.gmail.com><2E239D6FCD033C4BAF15F386A979BF510F0C0A@sonusinmail02.sonusnet.com><05CAC192-E462-421F-B1E5-B78DC8F60306@ag-projects.com><2E239D6FCD033C4BAF15F386A979BF510F0C93@sonusinmail02.sonusnet.com><16880306-5B3A-4EFD-ADE4-1201138D9182@acmepacket.com><8584590C8D7DD141AA96D01920FC6C698C896B71@gbplmail03.genband.com><CA+9kkMAwnnKKO5+q6ey4Z0QNxax1QF21vVtw8FNsHy_rmfenjQ@mail.gmail.com><4E76E078.5020708@jesup.org><8548CBBD-4E12-48F3-BC59-341FF45EF22F@acmepacket.com><4E77495E.4000409@jesup.org><CALiegfkTdCAeEdZbXP1Y9L6i4Anjrgf1CG6ZNj35WGoHL3p_Ew@mail.gmail.com><4E774F92.4040405@jesup.org><8ECCEE59-E855-4EA9-92B9-543D1585B1F0@ag-projects.com><4E778F1F.9090105@jesup.org><CEA0AC9E-6387-4066-95DC-0D70302E80A7@ag-projects.com><4E77C3EC.9060801@jesup.org><CAD5OKxtciYxaVpb7b3G9yMg1A97b9dkjkOpppZcSRzS5SAO3+A@mail.gmail.com><DB86C19C-781C-4FD2-ADE2-D6E1C0EE1D61@ag-projects.com><4E79A964.2050007@alvestran d.no><0FEA137C08A 9DF4781E EF745038C969 430A51F6401@nambx03.corp.adobe.com><5290D7E8-31AB-44BB-A8B2-3D1C2A4FB797@ag-projects.com> <0FEA137C08A9DF4781EEF745038C969430A51F67F2@nambx03.corp.adobe.com>
From: Ravindran Parthasarathi <pravindran@sonusnet.com>
To: Jozsef Vass <jovass@adobe.com>, Saúl Ibarra Corretgé <saul@ag-projects.com>
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Cc: rtcweb@ietf.org
Subject: Re: [rtcweb] "20 lines" (Re: RTCWeb default signaling protocol [was RE: About defining a signaling protocol for WebRTC (or not)])
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Hi Jozsef, I agree with you that game developer has no need to know the intricacies of signaling protocol and also, how the underlying framework makes it work for traverse through NAT. But the discussion here is which JS API will make it happen and what are the protocol intricacies involved to make it happen? As you wish based on lower level JS API, it is possible to give only one API like peerconnnect([username]) to start the session and how they connect which is not RTCWeb developer headache but underlying framework will take care of the stuff. What level of interop is required for the online registered players? All RTCWEb browser (Mozilla, chrome, IE) player should be able interop without need of browser specific JS or plugin. Here, there is a need of defining the common underlying protocol (which is not RTCWeb developer concern). Thanks Partha >-----Original Message----- >From: rtcweb-bounces@ietf.org [mailto:rtcweb-bounces@ietf.org] On Behalf >Of Jozsef Vass >Sent: Monday, September 26, 2011 10:47 PM >To: Saúl Ibarra Corretgé >Cc: rtcweb@ietf.org >Subject: Re: [rtcweb] "20 lines" (Re: RTCWeb default signaling protocol >[was RE: About defining a signaling protocol for WebRTC (or not)]) > >Look at it from a game developer's perspective. I do not want to build a >softphone phone with advanced features, just to add voice chat to the >game. Online registered players should be able to chat with each other, >but really no need to interoperate with anything else (and preferred not >to). Quite often, it is a group of people who are playing together, so >multiparty chat is highly desirable. As I game developer, I do not >event know what is SIP, Jingle or SDP and probably do not even care >about it. > >If you want to communicate behind NATs, firewalls, you need to run a >service to determine the reflexive address (in addition to your web >server) at least. > >Jozsef > >-----Original Message----- >From: Saúl Ibarra Corretgé [mailto:saul@ag-projects.com] >Sent: Monday, September 26, 2011 12:11 AM >To: Jozsef Vass >Cc: Harald Alvestrand; rtcweb@ietf.org >Subject: Re: [rtcweb] "20 lines" (Re: RTCWeb default signaling protocol >[was RE: About defining a signaling protocol for WebRTC (or not)]) > > >On Sep 23, 2011, at 2:58 AM, Jozsef Vass wrote: > >> I am in support of having some basic mechanism in the browser as part >of rtcweb to enable developers to quickly and easily setup media between >participants. Furthermore, if an API is too complex or too hard to use, >people will not use it or misuse it. I can only see a handful of >companies developing advanced calling feature on top of rtcweb, most >people just want to have something simple to work without caring too >much about the details. >> >> Maybe it would be advantages to specify such a very basic use case, >e.g., targeting gaming. It must work behind NATs using peer-to-peer >media transport (but fallback to media relay may not be required). Since >it is targeting closed community, there is no need for interoperability, >there is no need for SIP, Jingle, etc. At the minimum, this would >require a simple service for ip address lookup and to aid NAT and >firewall traversal. >> > >This is a no go. What "closed community" are you talking about? >Interoperability is a MUST here, even if I'm in favor of not having any >default signaling protocol specified. We need to be able to communicate >with other protocols without building gateways. This can be achieved >with both SIP and XMPP, so I see no need for reinventing the wheel. Lets >let developers use whatever protocol they like and just use RTCweb for >the media part. > >> For example, when a user registers with this service, he/she is >assigned an identifier or blob. In order to communicate with another >party, all they need to do is to exchange this information (this can be >done using websocket, etc.) and setup media channel. There should be no >need for parsing SDP, etc. >> > >What service? Who would host a server? > >-- >Saúl Ibarra Corretgé >AG Projects > > > >_______________________________________________ >rtcweb mailing list >rtcweb@ietf.org >https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/rtcweb
- Re: [rtcweb] About defining a signaling protocol … Bernard Aboba
- [rtcweb] About defining a signaling protocol for … Iñaki Baz Castillo
- Re: [rtcweb] About defining a signaling protocol … Henry Sinnreich
- Re: [rtcweb] About defining a signaling protocol … Roman Shpount
- Re: [rtcweb] About defining a signaling protocol … Victor Pascual
- Re: [rtcweb] About defining a signaling protocol … Prakash
- Re: [rtcweb] About defining a signaling protocol … Saúl Ibarra Corretgé
- [rtcweb] About defining a signaling protocol for … gao.yang2
- Re: [rtcweb] About defining a signaling protocol … Avasarala, Ranjit
- Re: [rtcweb] About defining a signaling protocol … Matthew Kaufman
- Re: [rtcweb] About defining a signaling protocol … Ravindran Parthasarathi
- Re: [rtcweb] About defining a signaling protocol … Soo-Hyun Choi
- Re: [rtcweb] About defining a signaling protocol … José Luis Millán
- Re: [rtcweb] About defining a signaling protocol … Saúl Ibarra Corretgé
- Re: [rtcweb] About defining a signaling protocol … Iñaki Baz Castillo
- Re: [rtcweb] About defining a signaling protocol … Tim Panton
- Re: [rtcweb] About defining a signaling protocol … Iñaki Baz Castillo
- Re: [rtcweb] About defining a signaling protocol … Lorenzo Miniero
- Re: [rtcweb] About defining a signaling protocol … Iñaki Baz Castillo
- Re: [rtcweb] About defining a signaling protocol … Harald Alvestrand
- Re: [rtcweb] About defining a signaling protocol … Henry Sinnreich
- [rtcweb] RTCWeb default signaling protocol [was R… Ravindran Parthasarathi
- Re: [rtcweb] RTCWeb default signaling protocol [w… Roman Shpount
- Re: [rtcweb] RTCWeb default signaling protocol [w… Hadriel Kaplan
- Re: [rtcweb] RTCWeb default signaling protocol [w… Jim McEachern
- Re: [rtcweb] RTCWeb default signaling protocol [w… Avasarala, Ranjit
- Re: [rtcweb] RTCWeb default signaling protocol [w… Saúl Ibarra Corretgé
- Re: [rtcweb] RTCWeb default signaling protocol [w… Saúl Ibarra Corretgé
- Re: [rtcweb] RTCWeb default signaling protocol [w… Muthu Arul Mozhi Perumal (mperumal)
- Re: [rtcweb] RTCWeb default signaling protocol [w… Iñaki Baz Castillo
- Re: [rtcweb] RTCWeb default signaling protocol [w… Iñaki Baz Castillo
- Re: [rtcweb] RTCWeb default signaling protocol [w… Tim Panton
- [rtcweb] SDP offer/answer vs. JSON (was: About de… Hadriel Kaplan
- Re: [rtcweb] RTCWeb default signaling protocol [w… Ted Hardie
- Re: [rtcweb] RTCWeb default signaling protocol [w… cbran
- Re: [rtcweb] RTCWeb default signaling protocol [w… Hadriel Kaplan
- Re: [rtcweb] RTCWeb default signaling protocol [w… Stephan Wenger
- Re: [rtcweb] RTCWeb default signaling protocol [w… Matthew Kaufman
- Re: [rtcweb] About defining a signaling protocol … Matthew Kaufman
- Re: [rtcweb] RTCWeb default signaling protocol [w… Matthew Kaufman
- Re: [rtcweb] ICE and security Olle E. Johansson
- Re: [rtcweb] RTCWeb default signaling protocol [w… Olle E. Johansson
- Re: [rtcweb] ICE and security Dzonatas Sol
- Re: [rtcweb] ICE and security Hadriel Kaplan
- Re: [rtcweb] RTCWeb default signaling protocol [w… Hadriel Kaplan
- Re: [rtcweb] ICE and security Dzonatas Sol
- Re: [rtcweb] ICE and security Eric Rescorla
- Re: [rtcweb] About defining a signaling protocol … Harald Alvestrand
- Re: [rtcweb] ICE and security Harald Alvestrand
- Re: [rtcweb] About defining a signaling protocol … Timothy B. Terriberry
- Re: [rtcweb] ICE and security Dzonatas Sol
- Re: [rtcweb] RTCWeb default signaling protocol [w… Ravindran Parthasarathi
- Re: [rtcweb] RTCWeb default signaling protocol [w… Randell Jesup
- Re: [rtcweb] RTCWeb default signaling protocol [w… Randell Jesup
- Re: [rtcweb] RTCWeb default signaling protocol [w… José Luis Millán
- Re: [rtcweb] RTCWeb default signaling protocol [w… Hadriel Kaplan
- Re: [rtcweb] RTCWeb default signaling protocol [w… Markus.Isomaki
- Re: [rtcweb] RTCWeb default signaling protocol [w… Randell Jesup
- Re: [rtcweb] ICE and security Dan Wing
- Re: [rtcweb] RTCWeb default signaling protocol [w… Olle E. Johansson
- Re: [rtcweb] RTCWeb default signaling protocol [w… Iñaki Baz Castillo
- Re: [rtcweb] RTCWeb default signaling protocol [w… Randell Jesup
- Re: [rtcweb] RTCWeb default signaling protocol [w… Eric Rescorla
- Re: [rtcweb] SDP offer/answer vs. JSON (was: Abou… Henry Sinnreich
- Re: [rtcweb] RTCWeb default signaling protocol [w… Jim McEachern
- Re: [rtcweb] RTCWeb default signaling protocol [w… Randell Jesup
- Re: [rtcweb] RTCWeb default signaling protocol [w… Saúl Ibarra Corretgé
- Re: [rtcweb] SDP offer/answer vs. JSON Magnus Westerlund
- [rtcweb] Data Transport, was: Re: RTCWeb default … Magnus Westerlund
- Re: [rtcweb] RTCWeb default signaling protocol [w… Igor Faynberg
- Re: [rtcweb] Data Transport, was: Re: RTCWeb defa… Olle E. Johansson
- Re: [rtcweb] Data Transport, was: Re: RTCWeb defa… Timothy B. Terriberry
- Re: [rtcweb] RTCWeb default signaling protocol [w… Dzonatas Sol
- Re: [rtcweb] RTCWeb default signaling protocol [w… Randell Jesup
- Re: [rtcweb] RTCWeb default signaling protocol [w… Randell Jesup
- Re: [rtcweb] Data Transport, was: Re: RTCWeb defa… Harald Alvestrand
- Re: [rtcweb] RTCWeb default signaling protocol [w… Saúl Ibarra Corretgé
- Re: [rtcweb] RTCWeb default signaling protocol [w… Randell Jesup
- Re: [rtcweb] RTCWeb default signaling protocol [w… Matthew Kaufman
- Re: [rtcweb] RTCWeb default signaling protocol [w… Roman Shpount
- Re: [rtcweb] RTCWeb default signaling protocol [w… Ravindran Parthasarathi
- Re: [rtcweb] RTCWeb default signaling protocol [w… Hadriel Kaplan
- Re: [rtcweb] RTCWeb default signaling protocol [w… Randell Jesup
- Re: [rtcweb] RTCWeb default signaling protocol [w… Hadriel Kaplan
- Re: [rtcweb] RTCWeb default signaling protocol [w… Saúl Ibarra Corretgé
- Re: [rtcweb] RTCWeb default signaling protocol [w… Randell Jesup
- Re: [rtcweb] RTCWeb default signaling protocol [w… Iñaki Baz Castillo
- Re: [rtcweb] RTCWeb default signaling protocol [w… Hadriel Kaplan
- Re: [rtcweb] RTCWeb default signaling protocol [w… Olle E. Johansson
- Re: [rtcweb] RTCWeb default signaling protocol [w… Ravindran Parthasarathi
- Re: [rtcweb] RTCWeb default signaling protocol [w… Hadriel Kaplan
- Re: [rtcweb] RTCWeb default signaling protocol [w… Olle E. Johansson
- Re: [rtcweb] RTCWeb default signaling protocol [w… Iñaki Baz Castillo
- Re: [rtcweb] RTCWeb default signaling protocol [w… Iñaki Baz Castillo
- Re: [rtcweb] RTCWeb default signaling protocol [w… Ravindran Parthasarathi
- Re: [rtcweb] RTCWeb default signaling protocol [w… José Luis Millán
- Re: [rtcweb] Data Transport, was: Re: RTCWeb defa… Magnus Westerlund
- Re: [rtcweb] RTCWeb default signaling protocol [w… Ted Hardie
- Re: [rtcweb] RTCWeb default signaling protocol [w… Dzonatas Sol
- Re: [rtcweb] SDP offer/answer vs. JSON (was: Abou… Elwell, John
- Re: [rtcweb] SDP offer/answer vs. JSON Dzonatas Sol
- Re: [rtcweb] SDP offer/answer vs. JSON Dzonatas Sol
- Re: [rtcweb] RTCWeb default signaling protocol [w… Henry Sinnreich
- [rtcweb] "20 lines" (Re: RTCWeb default signaling… Harald Alvestrand
- Re: [rtcweb] Data Transport, was: Re: RTCWeb defa… Harald Alvestrand
- Re: [rtcweb] Data Transport, was: Re: RTCWeb defa… Iñaki Baz Castillo
- Re: [rtcweb] Data Transport, was: Re: RTCWeb defa… Iñaki Baz Castillo
- Re: [rtcweb] Data Transport, was: Re: RTCWeb defa… Colin Perkins
- Re: [rtcweb] "20 lines" (Re: RTCWeb default signa… Hadriel Kaplan
- Re: [rtcweb] Data Transport, was: Re: RTCWeb defa… Hadriel Kaplan
- Re: [rtcweb] Data Transport, was: Re: RTCWeb defa… Colin Perkins
- Re: [rtcweb] Data Transport, was: Re: RTCWeb defa… Hadriel Kaplan
- Re: [rtcweb] Data Transport, was: Re: RTCWeb defa… Olle E. Johansson
- Re: [rtcweb] Data Transport, was: Re: RTCWeb defa… Saúl Ibarra Corretgé
- Re: [rtcweb] Data Transport, was: Re: RTCWeb defa… Iñaki Baz Castillo
- Re: [rtcweb] Data Transport, was: Re: RTCWeb defa… Randell Jesup
- [rtcweb] SCTP for data channels in rtcweb Randell Jesup
- Re: [rtcweb] SCTP for data channels in rtcweb Randell Jesup
- Re: [rtcweb] RTCWeb default signaling protocol [w… Ravindran Parthasarathi
- Re: [rtcweb] RTCWeb default signaling protocol [w… Roman Shpount
- Re: [rtcweb] RTCWeb default signaling protocol [w… Iñaki Baz Castillo
- Re: [rtcweb] RTCWeb default signaling protocol [w… Randell Jesup
- Re: [rtcweb] "20 lines" (Re: RTCWeb default signa… Jozsef Vass
- Re: [rtcweb] "20 lines" (Re: RTCWeb default signa… Roman Shpount
- Re: [rtcweb] "20 lines" (Re: RTCWeb default signa… Saúl Ibarra Corretgé
- Re: [rtcweb] "20 lines" (Re: RTCWeb default signa… Iñaki Baz Castillo
- Re: [rtcweb] "20 lines" (Re: RTCWeb default signa… Iñaki Baz Castillo
- Re: [rtcweb] "20 lines" (Re: RTCWeb default signa… Jozsef Vass
- Re: [rtcweb] "20 lines" (Re: RTCWeb default signa… Jozsef Vass
- Re: [rtcweb] "20 lines" (Re: RTCWeb default signa… Iñaki Baz Castillo
- Re: [rtcweb] "20 lines" (Re: RTCWeb default signa… Ravindran Parthasarathi
- Re: [rtcweb] "20 lines" (Re: RTCWeb default signa… Iñaki Baz Castillo
- Re: [rtcweb] "20 lines" (Re: RTCWeb default signa… Ravindran Parthasarathi
- Re: [rtcweb] "20 lines" (Re: RTCWeb default signa… Iñaki Baz Castillo
- Re: [rtcweb] "20 lines" (Re: RTCWeb default signa… Ravindran Parthasarathi
- Re: [rtcweb] "20 lines" (Re: RTCWeb default signa… Saúl Ibarra Corretgé
- Re: [rtcweb] RTCWeb default signaling protocol [w… Ravindran Parthasarathi
- Re: [rtcweb] RTCWeb default signaling protocol [w… Iñaki Baz Castillo
- Re: [rtcweb] RTCWeb default signaling protocol [w… Ravindran Parthasarathi
- Re: [rtcweb] RTCWeb default signaling protocol [w… Saúl Ibarra Corretgé
- Re: [rtcweb] RTCWeb default signaling protocol [w… Tim Panton
- Re: [rtcweb] RTCWeb default signaling protocol [w… Randell Jesup
- Re: [rtcweb] RTCWeb default signaling protocol [w… Eric Rescorla
- Re: [rtcweb] RTCWeb default signaling protocol [w… Jim McEachern
- Re: [rtcweb] RTCWeb default signaling protocol [w… Tim Panton
- Re: [rtcweb] RTCWeb default signaling protocol [w… Bernard Aboba
- Re: [rtcweb] RTCWeb default signaling protocol [w… Cullen Jennings
- Re: [rtcweb] RTCWeb default signaling protocol [w… Matthew Kaufman
- Re: [rtcweb] RTCWeb default signaling protocol [w… Randell Jesup
- Re: [rtcweb] RTCWeb default signaling protocol [w… Matthew Kaufman
- Re: [rtcweb] RTCWeb default signaling protocol [w… Randell Jesup
- Re: [rtcweb] RTCWeb default signaling protocol [w… Cameron Byrne
- Re: [rtcweb] RTCWeb default signaling protocol [w… Ravindran Parthasarathi
- Re: [rtcweb] RTCWeb default signaling protocol [w… Ravindran Parthasarathi
- Re: [rtcweb] RTCWeb default signaling protocol [w… Asveren, Tolga
- Re: [rtcweb] RTCWeb default signaling protocol [w… Saul Ibarra Corretge