Re: Deprecation of ICMP Source Quench messages (draft-gont-tsvwg-source-quench)

Joe Touch <touch@isi.edu> Thu, 06 January 2011 18:41 UTC

Return-Path: <touch@isi.edu>
X-Original-To: tsvwg@core3.amsl.com
Delivered-To: tsvwg@core3.amsl.com
Received: from localhost (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 187623A6F43 for <tsvwg@core3.amsl.com>; Thu, 6 Jan 2011 10:41:27 -0800 (PST)
X-Virus-Scanned: amavisd-new at amsl.com
X-Spam-Flag: NO
X-Spam-Score: -102.479
X-Spam-Level:
X-Spam-Status: No, score=-102.479 tagged_above=-999 required=5 tests=[AWL=0.120, BAYES_00=-2.599, USER_IN_WHITELIST=-100]
Received: from mail.ietf.org ([64.170.98.32]) by localhost (core3.amsl.com [127.0.0.1]) (amavisd-new, port 10024) with ESMTP id eMgyysm3N0qj for <tsvwg@core3.amsl.com>; Thu, 6 Jan 2011 10:41:26 -0800 (PST)
Received: from boreas.isi.edu (boreas.isi.edu [128.9.160.161]) by core3.amsl.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 465F43A6F35 for <tsvwg@ietf.org>; Thu, 6 Jan 2011 10:41:26 -0800 (PST)
Received: from [128.9.160.166] (abc.isi.edu [128.9.160.166]) (authenticated bits=0) by boreas.isi.edu (8.13.8/8.13.8) with ESMTP id p06Igd8e025948 (version=TLSv1/SSLv3 cipher=AES256-SHA bits=256 verify=NOT); Thu, 6 Jan 2011 10:42:39 -0800 (PST)
Message-ID: <4D260D1F.3000809@isi.edu>
Date: Thu, 06 Jan 2011 10:42:39 -0800
From: Joe Touch <touch@isi.edu>
User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 6.1; en-US; rv:1.9.2.13) Gecko/20101207 Thunderbird/3.1.7
MIME-Version: 1.0
To: Fernando Gont <fernando@gont.com.ar>
Subject: Re: Deprecation of ICMP Source Quench messages (draft-gont-tsvwg-source-quench)
References: <4D21F2FC.2090000@erg.abdn.ac.uk> <FE2AD841-7CAD-4A09-A766-73A1D5BE1F56@cisco.com> <068B22BC-E1B4-4C7F-99C5-3B8B483EB057@cisco.com> <20110106092048.GA14506@openss7.org> <4D2602D5.30608@isi.edu> <4D260555.8050901@gont.com.ar> <4D26071C.30303@isi.edu> <4D260B3A.1050804@gont.com.ar>
In-Reply-To: <4D260B3A.1050804@gont.com.ar>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="ISO-8859-1"; format="flowed"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-ISI-4-43-8-MailScanner: Found to be clean
X-MailScanner-From: touch@isi.edu
Cc: Gorry Fairhurst <gorry@erg.abdn.ac.uk>, "tsvwg-chairs@tools.ietf.org chair" <tsvwg-chairs@tools.ietf.org>, Fred Baker <fred@cisco.com>, tsvwg list <tsvwg@ietf.org>
X-BeenThere: tsvwg@ietf.org
X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.9
Precedence: list
List-Id: Transport Area Working Group <tsvwg.ietf.org>
List-Unsubscribe: <https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/tsvwg>, <mailto:tsvwg-request@ietf.org?subject=unsubscribe>
List-Archive: <http://www.ietf.org/mail-archive/web/tsvwg>
List-Post: <mailto:tsvwg@ietf.org>
List-Help: <mailto:tsvwg-request@ietf.org?subject=help>
List-Subscribe: <https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/tsvwg>, <mailto:tsvwg-request@ietf.org?subject=subscribe>
X-List-Received-Date: Thu, 06 Jan 2011 18:41:27 -0000

On 1/6/2011 10:34 AM, Fernando Gont wrote:
> On 06/01/2011 03:17 p.m., Joe Touch wrote:
>
>> Yes. Does that mean we need to create a separate doc to do it? No.
>
> You proposed exactly this a number of times, on the tcpm list. -- Should
> I dig the archive?

Yes, I wanted the issue separate so we could decide on it *independently*.

Once we decide what do do, we can then make a decision on how best to do 
it. In this case, there's no disagreement that SQ should be deprecated, 
or that (IMO) that issue should be decided independent of other ICMP or 
TCP issues.

The question is whether *issuing* a separate doc is the best way to 
achieve that recommendation. IMO, this is one of the ones that can wait. 
that's what I'm hearing from others too.

>> We can put it on queue for 1122-bis or 1812-bis, and *whenever* that
>> happens should be sufficient for this particular issue.
>
> Please be realistic.

We all are. Realistically, an RFC officially deprecating a feature that 
is already recommended against, and is already not being used (far as 
any of us can tell) serves no *urgent* purpose.

Yes, that means this issue might wait on the shelf for a long time. So what?

Joe